Blood Angels Legion question

[TennisBall]

Fear to Tread mentions a council of 300. If there were 300 companies or equivalent in the legion, which numbered 120,000, then there were the equivalent of 400 marines per company. As standard legion structure divides chapters, great companies etc into units of 500, does that mean that the Blood Angels at full strength should have been 150,000? Or do they simply have an alternative organisation of four modern companies per Company?

 

The 500 figure comes from the FW video previewing their new HH book. It shows legions divided into chapters or equivalent and each chapter is divided into two 500 man units called a battalion.

[Killax]

Not this :cuss again, please...

 

Numbers switch constantly even in the fluff and even for fluff fans, never hold on the number because casulties are common.

[AGPO]

The fluff does often change, but as the Forge World books are going into quite a bit of detail on legion organisation, I'd say they're the definitive cannon as far as this issue goes. I'd wait for the Blood Angels book (sadly book three at best) before judging though.

[DominicJ]

Maybe not all company captains got to be in the council of 300....

 

Maybe not everyone in the council was a captain

[knife&fork]

Back in the days a Legion was 10,000 marines.... Talk about inflated numbers :huh:

[TennisBall]

Not this :rolleyes: again, please...

 

Numbers switch constantly even in the fluff and even for fluff fans, never hold on the number because casulties are common.

If you do not possess the maturity to respond to a simple question without acting like a complete arse, then do not respond at all.

[DominicJ]

K/F

 

I thought it was always 100k

Unless 10k was rogue trader, I'm not quite that old :blink:

[Killax]

Not this :) again, please...

 

Numbers switch constantly even in the fluff and even for fluff fans, never hold on the number because casulties are common.

If you do not possess the maturity to respond to a simple question without acting like a complete arse, then do not respond at all.

 

It has nothing to do with awnsering a simple question.

 

A funny thing is you seem to be an arse to by your own rules since you didn't awnser the question either. GJ, arse!

 

The numbers constantly change making the awnser no more than any best mans guessing.

 

If you want a number, 150.000 could be it, could also have been 200.000 the year before that.

[Vodunius]

Back in the days a Legion was 10,000 marines.... Talk about inflated numbers :)

 

Only when GW chopped the plural off to appease the dogmatists (Ultramarine players mostly) who were irked by the imprecision. In RT it was tens of thousands.

 

Note the 'notional legion organisation' in the FW book is generic one from the Horus Heresy artbooks (volume II I think):

1000 marines = regiment/chapter/great company/wing led by an Imperial Commander

500 marines = battalion led by a lieutenant-commander

100 marines = company led by a captain

[TennisBall]

Thanks for the replies, I wanted to see if I'd missed something about the Blood Angels and their legion. I guess a firm answer might be forthcoming in one of the Horus Heresy books by Forge World.

[Sixestohit]

In the new HH book from FW it has a two page spread for the disposition of a space marine legion.

 

It states that each chapter would originally be made from 1000 legionaries but this number would later swell or reduce according to the amount of recruits added, or the amount of men lost.

 

For chapters it goes I-X and then continues with a dotted line stating "Chapter XI Etc.".

 

The chapter then splits into two battalions which then splits down into companies.

 

Also worthy of note is that Tactical Squads are 20 strong, as are many other squads.

 

James.

[knife&fork]

Aren't these legion numbers a clear contradiction to the fluff? If these legions were later spilt up into 1k marines chapters (things like SW and BT being notable exceptions) we would have more 2:nd founding chapters than there are chapters total in the 41st millennium...

[Sixestohit]

It depends how much of a kicking they got in the end of the heresy really I'd imagine. The casualties might have been so high that the legions were knocked down to a tenth of the numbers they had during the crusades.

 

James.

[Killax]

Perhaps Pre-heresy marines couldn't count.

 

Have you guys put that into consideration allready?

[DominicJ]

9 loyal legions at 100,000 each = 900,000

900 chapters at 1000 each = 900,000

[Vodunius]

Aren't these legion numbers a clear contradiction to the fluff?

 

To quote Codex Titanicus (both editions - it was so good they put in the Titan Legions version as well even tho that game was post-heresy):

 

"Hatred drove us. Hatred and fear.

 

Aye, fear. For we were the finest warriors in the universe, elite among elite, the chosen of humanity.

Once we had acknowledged no foe as our equal. Now we must – for were not these men the same as

ourselves? Spawned from geneseed, trained by masters, armed and equipped with the best from

humanity's realm. Finally we faced a for worthy of fear, a mirror image of ourselves and all we

believed in. In this nightmare, brother against false brother to the death. Is it any wonder we knew

fear?

 

We fought like tigers but were met with equal ferocity. We shot accurately. Our eyes were like those

of hawks. Yet equal numbers fell from our ranks. We met at close quarters. Weapons flashed and

gouged but who was to say which was faster? For every Traitor who fell, so fell a loyal brother.

The battle surged back and forth till finally in the end true faith prevailed and we had the mastery.

Yet we were slaughtered. But one in ten survived."

 

Now on the one hand true that was just referring to the battle for a single city (on Tallarn), but on the other hand that was just the battle for a single city. Multiply that by a decade and a half of unending war and you get no discrepancy between 100k legions and the 2nd founding.

[DominicJ]

But even 90% losses are not a problem long term, if the bodies are recovered.

 

A marine who dies on the first day of heresy provides scouts for year five and two new marines by the end.

[Sixestohit]

Only if suitable recruits can be found to replace him though.

 

James.

[Vodunius]

But even 90% losses are not a problem long term, if the bodies are recovered.

 

A marine who dies on the first day of heresy provides scouts for year five and two new marines by the end.

 

True, at least:

 

1. If the body is recovered relatively intact, ie: not crushed under a titans foot, vaporized by a plasma, melta or beam weapon, incinerated by a flame weapon or torn apart by something like a fatal chest wound from an armour piercing explosive round designed to detonate inside the target for maximum organ damage such as used by the small arms carried by 95% of space marines.

 

2. Before the geneseed can decay.

 

3. To the legion who recovers it. See Honsou of the Iron Warriors and his 'halfbreed' company of cannon fodder who was not to my knowledge described as unique.