Smurfalypse Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 So a question, since our base CSMs are losing the three items as base do we have to actually model the marines with the extra CCW since it is an upgrade and doesn't actually come base with the unit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I would think yes to maintain wysiwyg. Should be clear to your opponent who has what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 I would think yes to maintain wysiwyg. Should be clear to your opponent who has what. lol guess this means i would never take the upgrade, along with 99% of the rest of the CSM population :P Seeing how most of us have always modeled with a bolter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Mine are modelled with both bolter and boltpistol + ccw, and I'll gladly take that upgrade thanks! :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I tended to have a mix of bolters and bolt pistol/ccwep models. Though I added pistol holsters to many of my bolter marines, I didn't give most of them extra close combat weapons. At the moment, I'm not sure whether to convert them to have everything, or just leave it as it is and run specialized squads squads or squads have some bolter and some ccwep marines, but none with both. I think the ccwep option might be ever so slightly overpriced, and cheaper squads might be more effective. Then again, if you want cheaper, you can get cultists, and save those points for specialist units or daemonic allies. Hrm. I may be somewhat underwhelmed by the new model range, and I think the codex will definitely be a step down in overall power from the last several books, but you can't say there's any lack of options and builds to try out, and that's all most of us have been asking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attomsk Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I don't have time to remodel all my CSM so I am just saying screw WYSIWYG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I know my old Alpha Legion counts-as zerkers will be used again, as a dirt-cheap assault unit to follow my melee cultists around! :P ...or something... What I am glad over are all the options we have in the basic CSM squads though, they seem to be able to become really versitile now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AmCjkh Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I'm in the same boat. Most of my marines are modeled with bolter and chainsword, true grit style, with some bolt pistols thrown in. There's no way I'm tearing off all their chainswords to satisfy wysiwyg... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 I tended to have a mix of bolters and bolt pistol/ccwep models. Though I added pistol holsters to many of my bolter marines, I didn't give most of them extra close combat weapons. At the moment, I'm not sure whether to convert them to have everything, or just leave it as it is and run specialized squads squads or squads have some bolter and some ccwep marines, but none with both. I think the ccwep option might be ever so slightly overpriced, and cheaper squads might be more effective. Then again, if you want cheaper, you can get cultists, and save those points for specialist units or daemonic allies. Hrm. I may be somewhat underwhelmed by the new model range, and I think the codex will definitely be a step down in overall power from the last several books, but you can't say there's any lack of options and builds to try out, and that's all most of us have been asking for. I dunno man, those Daemon Engines are all very well priced, can dish out a severe amount of pain, and take more abuse than a Dread. The Daemon prince while pricey, is a massive beat stick. Just insane with options to be up to a mastery level 3 psycher, options to take stuff out of the chaos armory (i think the pic says Chaos Rewards and Chaos Artifacts, but dont quote me, it is a little blurry). If he can take a daemon weapon on top of what we can already see, he will be nearly unstoppable in CC. Admittedly pricey, but just a pure brute. Chaos Lord should be viable again with access to an armory (assuming there is decent stuff in it). Mastery level 3 psychers. . . Nuff said. Warsmiths (I like how Warsmith sounds better than Warpsmith) curse against enemy vehicles is going to be good. Really really good. Making an enemy vehicle shooting stuff gain "gets hot" special rule will be brutal against anything that spams a lot of shots. The Mutilators may not be the best over all unit idea, but I remember someone saying they actually did have Deepstrike in one of the pictures of them and they are only 35 pts each. . . That is cheaper than a normal terminator, so not a bad buy completely. The flyer does seem very very, not good. Cant argue that lol Hellbrutes are very viable. The new crazed chart is actually good. There is a lot of good in this codex that has been confirmed by pics of the stuff from GD this weekend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffeineated Chaos Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I'm in the same boat. Most of my marines are modeled with bolter and chainsword, true grit style, with some bolt pistols thrown in. There's no way I'm tearing off all their chainswords to satisfy wysiwyg... ditto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevak Dal Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Yeah I was reading over the white dwarf and saw the battle report and was like "Extra close combat weapons...what the hell?" a little dismaying that we can't have a special weapon per every 5, and/or a heavy for every 10. My two completed CSM squads have bolters, with bolt pistol holsters and knives on their belts. *sigh* looks like MY chaos space marines didn't get cheaper, and we still don't get a 'free' option like everyone else does. And why do Zerkers have to buy their chain axes? If ap4 isn't included, why would you want to buy it per guy? Why doesn't it have ap4 and rending at least? At least it's not at initiative 1 and 'unwieldly' lol. For that matter, why not instead of 2 extra plasma pistols, can they not get 2 extra power weapons? *sigh* That heresy ruleset is looking pretty good... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smurfalypse Posted September 23, 2012 Author Share Posted September 23, 2012 Yeah I was reading over the white dwarf and saw the battle report and was like "Extra close combat weapons...what the hell?" a little dismaying that we can't have a special weapon per every 5, and/or a heavy for every 10. My two completed CSM squads have bolters, with bolt pistol holsters and knives on their belts. *sigh* looks like MY chaos space marines didn't get cheaper, and we still don't get a 'free' option like everyone else does. And why do Zerkers have to buy their chain axes? If ap4 isn't included, why would you want to buy it per guy? Why doesn't it have ap4 and rending at least? At least it's not at initiative 1 and 'unwieldly' lol. That heresy ruleset is looking pretty good... Yeah, I literally have 30 CSMs that just have bolters lol Not sure if I want to invest the time and money to do 20 more with the BP+CCW or just say F-it and not take the upgrade. Guess I will have to playtest and see how it all pans out. Cultists may make having all three unnecessary, but we will see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 I tended to have a mix of bolters and bolt pistol/ccwep models. Though I added pistol holsters to many of my bolter marines, I didn't give most of them extra close combat weapons. At the moment, I'm not sure whether to convert them to have everything, or just leave it as it is and run specialized squads squads or squads have some bolter and some ccwep marines, but none with both. I think the ccwep option might be ever so slightly overpriced, and cheaper squads might be more effective. Then again, if you want cheaper, you can get cultists, and save those points for specialist units or daemonic allies. Hrm. I may be somewhat underwhelmed by the new model range, and I think the codex will definitely be a step down in overall power from the last several books, but you can't say there's any lack of options and builds to try out, and that's all most of us have been asking for. I dunno man, those Daemon Engines are all very well priced, can dish out a severe amount of pain, and take more abuse than a Dread. The Daemon prince while pricey, is a massive beat stick. Just insane with options to be up to a mastery level 3 psycher, options to take stuff out of the chaos armory (i think the pic says Chaos Rewards and Chaos Artifacts, but dont quote me, it is a little blurry). If he can take a daemon weapon on top of what we can already see, he will be nearly unstoppable in CC. Admittedly pricey, but just a pure brute. Chaos Lord should be viable again with access to an armory (assuming there is decent stuff in it). Mastery level 3 psychers. . . Nuff said. Warsmiths (I like how Warsmith sounds better than Warpsmith) curse against enemy vehicles is going to be good. Really really good. Making an enemy vehicle shooting stuff gain "gets hot" special rule will be brutal against anything that spams a lot of shots. The Mutilators may not be the best over all unit idea, but I remember someone saying they actually did have Deepstrike in one of the pictures of them and they are only 35 pts each. . . That is cheaper than a normal terminator, so not a bad buy completely. The flyer does seem very very, not good. Cant argue that lol Hellbrutes are very viable. The new crazed chart is actually good. There is a lot of good in this codex that has been confirmed by pics of the stuff from GD this weekend. Interestingly, from the pictures I have seen, the mutilators are just that. CC terminators. I mean, they have the exact same rules. They have flesharmour, pinping armour to 2, and then they have the daemon special rule, giving them +5 invul, and then of course they have identical stats to termies except that they have 2 wounds. So...They are 35 points, have 2 wounds and always have a pair of power weapons, albeit must use a different one every other turn. They can`t take icons, but they can take marks though. Not sure what the marks costs for them. Maybe the same as for termies. Ugly models and very limited, but maybe not a bad unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevak Dal Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well, have you played a Loyalist, non Space Wolf army before? Cause that's what they'd be, Loyalists without ATSKNF (the bolter and Bolt pistol ones that is). Yeah, we get more options, and we're cheaper...but I like having assault squad levels of attacks on my base guys because it was...utility. Spending 17 points for Bolter, bolt pistol and Close combat weapon, plus a Mark of Khorne sort of gives me pause. I'm probably going to wait until somebody scans the thing, $50 is a lot of money to spend on something that so far-sound incredibly disappointing and not really for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 *Shrugs* Well, I am going to continue playing my army and try to adapt. I seriosuly doubt its all that bad. I see a lot of good stuff in this codex, and I honestly think your harsh reaction is almost ridiculously premature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Spending 17 points for Bolter, bolt pistol and Close combat weapon, plus a Mark of Khorne sort of gives me pause. You do know that that combination is at 18 points per model currently in a 10-man CSM unit? You can spend the extra point on turning them into veterans in the new book, where they'll apart from having the same Ld as they have in the current book, also have hatred against loyalist marines... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Mine are modelled with both bolter and boltpistol + ccw, and I'll gladly take that upgrade thanks! :tu: Yeah, mine have it all modeled. I try to always model grenade, BP, Bolter and CCW on my marines. (chaos or otherwise). To me, more gear makes them look more complete. (to me!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Don't we also have the option to make our troops fearless though? Mine are all modeled with BP, bolter and at least one CCW so I don't have any problems with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diabloelmo Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 What, we are loosing our base weapon loadout? God... DAMMIT GW. I want to love you, and you are giving me a shiny new codex... But c'mon now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well. This is disappointing for sure, but I can live with it. And I'm willing to shell out the points for all three, but I really am not looking forward to finding a way to mount slung bolters on my BP/CCW squads... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffeineated Chaos Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well, have you played a Loyalist, non Space Wolf army before? Cause that's what they'd be, Loyalists without ATSKNF (the bolter and Bolt pistol ones that is). Yeah, we get more options, and we're cheaper...but I like having assault squad levels of attacks on my base guys because it was...utility. Spending 17 points for Bolter, bolt pistol and Close combat weapon, plus a Mark of Khorne sort of gives me pause. I'm probably going to wait until somebody scans the thing, $50 is a lot of money to spend on something that so far-sound incredibly disappointing and not really for me. B/c a 10-man squad w/ MoK in the old codex weighed in at 18 points a model and didn't have a free champ. I'll take the slight debuff of +1A to rage+counterattack for one point less. Add in veterans of the long war and the unit didn't really change(Khorne wise), except for the Hsatred and the free champ. Not so bad to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
space wolf Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well. This is disappointing for sure, but I can live with it. And I'm willing to shell out the points for all three, but I really am not looking forward to finding a way to mount slung bolters on my BP/CCW squads... You don't really have to. In a lot of the fluff, the bolters are just maglocked to their leg armor. So if you want to, you can just glue them on... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well. This is disappointing for sure, but I can live with it. And I'm willing to shell out the points for all three, but I really am not looking forward to finding a way to mount slung bolters on my BP/CCW squads... You don't really have to. In a lot of the fluff, the bolters are just maglocked to their leg armor. So if you want to, you can just glue them on... Yup. That's how many of my models are represented in my three marine armies. Mag locked to thigh or hip. You can even take insipiration from the chosen in the DV box. A few are attached to their power packs. (They look holstered but could be mag locked on your marines). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Volsung- Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well. This is disappointing for sure, but I can live with it. And I'm willing to shell out the points for all three, but I really am not looking forward to finding a way to mount slung bolters on my BP/CCW squads... You don't really have to. In a lot of the fluff, the bolters are just maglocked to their leg armor. So if you want to, you can just glue them on... Khorne Berzerker sheated sword bits. Paint them all separately, drill a pin through any models you want to have it (or not, you can glue direct too). Glue, then re-varnish. That should be suitable too, no doubt. And those swords shouldn't be too expensive on Ebay. Look with Hoard o Bits or Blackdaggers, those guys usually have stuff like that. I buy wolf tails by the bulk from Blackdaggers. Not a bad bits store, that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RapatoR Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 Well I will add CCW/Bolter where needed, but I am glad we got option to make them cheaper for not taking CCW (my havocs are definitely not getting one! :)) and I like that you can swap it model by model not per entire squad, those guys without extra weapon will be taking front ranks. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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