Joasht Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 As I understand it, during the heresy era there was a rift between the native calabanites and terrans, although I'm unclear who was left behind to stay on Calaban, leading up to Luther's betrayal. I also understand that calabanites had their own style of armor and heraldry, but the details are vague at best. He did the two different marines (native and Terran) differ in appearance? Thanks! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother-Sergeant Bohemond Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 As far as I am aware they did not differ in terms of heraldry... as for armour, it was the same mish-mash that all the Legions shared in, so, Mk II, III and IV with V coming to the loyalists later on. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187285 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Semper Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 As I understand it, during the heresy era there was a rift between the native calabanites and terrans, although I'm unclear who was left behind to stay on Calaban, leading up to Luther's betrayal. I also understand that calabanites had their own style of armor and heraldry, but the details are vague at best. He did the two different marines (native and Terran) differ in appearance? Thanks! Ok, the ones that were sent to Caliban were not Calibanites or Terran. They were those the Lion was displeased with. At the head you've got Luther - a Calibanite through and through and second in command of the Legion. At his side is Astelan, a distinguished Terran Dark Angel Chapter Commader. Also Zachariel, a prominent Calibanite Librarian, is among the ones sent back and at the same time you have Israfael (sp?) a senior Terran Librarian that is also sent back to Caliban... So as far as the Lion is concerned all DAs are judged loyalty to him personally not where they come from. If he doubts them, off they go! Now regarding heraldy, it is mentioned in the "Call of the Lion" that Belath (a Calibanite Chapter Master) was wearing a green shoulder pad (as opposed to the all-black panoply of the DAs) to denote he comes from Caliban. Apparently the Lion had allowed Calibanites to show-off their ancestry that way which shows some preferential treatment but other other than that there is nothing solid to show that the Lion was partial towards either group (Terrans or Calibanites). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187332 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joasht Posted September 26, 2012 Author Share Posted September 26, 2012 Thanks for the detailed reply! Is there any mention on the use of robes, or why the HH art seems to portray a different looking robe compared to the current 40k robes? The 30k ones look like those worn by knights to prevent heat from getting to them, while the 40k ones look more monastic. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187337 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Semper Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 Thanks for the detailed reply! Don't mention it! :) Is there any mention on the use of robes, or why the HH art seems to portray a different looking robe compared to the current 40k robes? The 30k ones look like those worn by knights to prevent heat from getting to them, while the 40k ones look more monastic. The idea behind the robes pre-dates the Imperium and was a Calibanite custom of the Order. In the pre-Imperium days, the social system of Caliban was based around knightly orders that were protecting the populace from the "beasts" with various degrees of success... The most prominent was the one called simply the Order which was led by Luther and it was the one that found and adopted the Lion. One of the traditions of the knights of the Order was to wear white surplices -often over their armour. This tradition was carried over to the Dark Angels Legion although I'd assume it was not part of the "official" gear - more like a tolerated tradition than a compulsory thing. In principle there is no real change in the consistency or material of the surplice - at least there is no evidence of it. If it served a function like the one you mention for the knights of the Order (that had 16th-17th Century levels of technology) it sure did nothing of the sort for the Space Marines of the First Legion as the power armour and their physiology took care of all that. So for the DAs it was purely ceremonial - and still is. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187350 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blood Angel Scout Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 Not sure as to their function i.e heat-prevention (would this concern a marine and aren't they worn over their armour?) but the robes are referenced in Savage Weapons (Age of Darkness) The Lion (The Primarchs) and Prince of Crows (Shadows of Treachery) as well as works previously mentioned, and I'd always interpretated their depiction as monastic/medieval, a mark of distinction among the orders. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187362 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joasht Posted September 26, 2012 Author Share Posted September 26, 2012 Haha I didn't mean it protected the Space Marines from heat; I meant that the form of garment, in real life, was used as prevention from heat stroke. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187796 Share on other sites More sharing options...
curnow Posted September 26, 2012 Share Posted September 26, 2012 i think the differnce in the look of the surplice's is to show the shift from a crusadeing knightly force to a repentive combative monk like force . as for the real life "heat stroke theory " mentioned ...well ive worn full milanese plate as well as full harnis of maile and i can tell you the surcoats just add to the heat , they were worn in europe as a recognition device and carried over in to the crusades as that as well but were normaly made of linnen rather than wool and were worn over a lighter form of mail (thiner gage and 4in to one rather than 6 or 8 into one} as well beacause of the heat . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3187981 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joasht Posted September 28, 2012 Author Share Posted September 28, 2012 Yeah, it does seem like its mostly just the shift in theme, since the original "theme" died out when their planet blew up. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3189380 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Semper Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 Guys, I think that what you're looking at is artistic licence rather than a notable or documented change in the consistency of the fabric or the style of the surplice... Maybe you're reading too much into it... :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3189382 Share on other sites More sharing options...
yhta Posted September 28, 2012 Share Posted September 28, 2012 i belive is more a artistic change:pre heresy is more a knight theme and now post heresy is more hunters of the fallen. with that look of "we are looking for you fallens. specialy you cypher. just they there..." Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3189390 Share on other sites More sharing options...
mysteriousmaskedmystery Posted September 29, 2012 Share Posted September 29, 2012 i think it has a lot to do with the fact that there aren't any BT pre-heresy, so they didn't have to worry about making the DA and BT look different. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/261834-question-on-heresy-era-dark-angels/#findComment-3190330 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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