Circus Nurgling Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Glad I have at least the shooty weapons magnetized... Still going to have to change out my power maul, though :/. I really liked the looks of that weapon, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Why? Power maul is not an upgrade. It's a power weapon and they come with those as standard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circus Nurgling Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Oh? Well I'm not jumping to rip them apart anytime soon. I thought I read that the consensus was the maul would be an underperformer... guess I'll wait and see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feste Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Oh? Well I'm not jumping to rip them apart anytime soon. I thought I read that the consensus was the maul would be an underperformer... guess I'll wait and see. I'd actually heard differently. It's a nice min/maxed tool, wounding on 2+'s and not caring about your armour save. Helps you kill vehicles, extra attacks from 2CC weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 What do you think about claws on TDA? I'm planning to give claws to 2 models in my 10 men TDA unit. The other models would have:2 Chainfists, 2 Maces, 4 Axes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feste Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 What do you think about claws on TDA?I'm planning to give claws to 2 models in my 10 men TDA unit. The other models would have:2 Chainfists, 2 Maces, 4 Axes. I like them, they'd add a nice amount of AP3 weaponry going at Initiative. Would reduce your outgoing fire a bit, but not a massive issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 At X point per claw, where X is half the cost of an Ork boy, I see no reason to ever equip my termies with swords, hehe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 What do you think about claws on TDA?I'm planning to give claws to 2 models in my 10 men TDA unit. The other models would have:2 Chainfists, 2 Maces, 4 Axes. I like them, they'd add a nice amount of AP3 weaponry going at Initiative. Would reduce your outgoing fire a bit, but not a massive issue. That is my opinion too. I suppose they will cost about 15 pts so they are not very expensive. With that loadout I should have double STR APs armourbane attacks, AP3 rerolling to wound capabilities, cheap AP2 I1 strikes and STR 6 attacks that wounds most targets on 2+, can threat walkers and ignore the armour of many xenos. I suppose it is a quite balanced loadout... or not? :) Anyway is it confirmed we can upgrade the power weapons to fists/claws and still get the reaper cannon? EDIT: At X point per claw, where X is half the cost of an Ork boy, I see no reason to ever equip my termies with swords, hehe... Wait... a claw for Chaos TDA costs 3 points!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 yes i believe that for every 10 guys you can get a auto cannon. Yo dont talk points. Talk in ork boys.... I believe that the reaper auto cannon will cost 1 and 2/3s the cost of an ork... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Reapers and heavy flamers are 1 per 5 guys. Reaper price is the same as currently, flamer is twice as much as the current codex... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted October 3, 2012 Author Share Posted October 3, 2012 yes i believe that for every 10 guys you can get a auto cannon. Yo dont talk points. Talk in ork boys.... I believe that the reaper auto cannon will cost 1 and 2/3s the cost of an ork... Half a ork boy cost is extremey cheap for a claw as well 1.66 orks for a reaper auto cannon... if you want to use orks as unit of measure.... why just orks and not, guess what, Techmarine servitors, plasma guns, pyscannons etc.... I mean there are many things more valuable than an ork for "payment" :) (it's a joke, of course :P ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verythrax Draconis Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I'm working on a budget here, so I will need to work with what I have... I have 5 termies from Black Reach armed with stormbolters (combibolter) and powefists, but it would suck. Maybe if I use the extra Warp talon Lightning Claws from the new Raptors box and make them 5 to have LCs instead, on a LR? Would it float? I have no clue, I only played as Sisters of Battle until now B) Dunno with mark to use as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Well then, let's just take a look at what the marks all do for Termies then, shall we? Tzeentch (+1 to I saves): Bolsters their resilience against armor-defeating hits, making them a 4++ against both shooting and melee. Given that they are already 2+ against most things, the MoT blends well with the most common CCW loadout for our Terminators (being Unwieldy axes and fists), ensuring that we will survive plasma and melta to get into melee and that we survive the kind of slugfest we'll face when fighting against other Terminator types. I say, Good for us. The Icon of Flame, on the other hand, isn't worth its weight here. I see Soul Blaze as really only being effective if you have LOTS of units with the ability, and you spread the love around to ensure that you score a couple extra wounds each turn. Slaanesh (+1 Initiative): Taken with the above assumption regarding Unwieldy weapons, MoS is probably the least useful Mark to take -- in a vaccuum, that is. However, taking it also unlocks the ability to take the Icon of Excess, which grants FNP to the unit. If you take MoS, you'd better take the Icon, and you'd better gear your Termies to the Mark. I suggest a liberal dose of lightning claws and a maul or two instead of fists and axes so that you actually get a benefit from the Mark. That being said, if you do this, you're losing out if you find yourself confronted with 2+ saves. Khorne (Rage & Counter-attack): 4 attacks per model on the charge, or 3 attacks if charged, is a big increase in kill-power for the unit, especially if you're rocking the standard Unwieldy weaponry, because it makes up for any losses you take before it's your turn fight. Taking the Icon of Wrath to go with it grants Furious Charge, but S6 and S8 weapons don't strictly need the boost to be effective; axes, swords, and lightning claws will all appreciate it, though, especially swords since they require no additional points investment. Nurgle (+1 Toughness): Like Tzeentch, MoN increases resiliency, but in a different way. While MoT makes the unit harder against armor-defeating hits, MoN makes the unit harder against small arms fire. Its also cheaper than MoS + Icon, which likewise increase resilience to small arms. Against most things that want to shoot at Terminators, however -- plasma & melta, for example -- it has no real effect since their Strength values are high enough that they don't care. Taking the Icon of Despair, which grants Fear to unit, is not seriously going to be worth its points in most cases since all loyalist Space Marines are already immune to the effects of Fear. Even then, the unit must reach melee to get an effect from the Icon. The Icon of Vengeance: Grants Fearless, regardless of Mark used. This is probably the best all-around Icon for Termies to have, since it ensures that our big bad shock unit isn't going to get run down off of some bad dice rolls. MoS Termies should, in my mind, definitely take the Icon of Excess instead, but its toss up here for Khorne units. Tzeentch and Nurgle however both get more mileage out of Fearless than they will Soul Blaze and Fear, respectively. So that's my take on Marks and Icons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verythrax Draconis Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Thanks a lot, very useful! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I try. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
--eFTy--> Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Somehow I missed this thread ;) Anyway - I'm thinking Mark of Tzeentch is best over all too. Slaanesh with the icon may be a bit of a better boost, but it's also way more expensive. What about 10 terminator units with a lord? How would one equip those (other than the 2 reapers and a chainfist or two)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Thoughts on vets of the long war? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Thoughts on vets of the long war? Should be a must if the termies are CC and you expect to face marines. If not, then I think its unecessary if you have the vengeance icon. If you have some other icon, +1 ld could indeed be still quite helpful. I try. And yeah, excellent post :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Worth noting, iirc our lords are still fearless, right? If so, then termies run as retinues for a termie lord or special character don't require the IoV, as the character will confer their fearlessness on the squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Worth noting, iirc our lords are still fearless, right? If so, then termies run as retinues for a termie lord or special character don't require the IoV, as the character will confer their fearlessness on the squad. True, lords are fearless. Sorcerers are not though, which is worth noting, since some may want to field termie sorcerers. Edit: Even so, against Adeptus Astartes, the VotLW is very good, despite costing a few points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I'm going to have to do some reconverting of models to fit the new equipment restrictions (particularly annoying since I like the look of the "heavy guy" with heavy flamer and power fist), but early on I'll probably be trying out termie sorcerer lord in a unit of six with MoT, couple fists, couple swords, couple mauls/axes, couple plasma, IoV, heavy flamer, chain champ, & vets, in an army of approx 1850 points, along with two CSM squads, two cultist blobs, some nurgle bikes, defiler, & maybe some havocs manning a defense line. We'll see how that goes. In larger games, the sorcerer will be replaced by Yabba Dabba, I'll add some more terminators, the CSM squads will turn into chosen, and assorted other ridiculousness will be thrown in on a game by game basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 No vet upgrade for me, just cheap and dirrty. Most likely will field 3-5 Units, combi-melta, one with a fist IF 5 still prefer the combi's. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I like the Veterans upgrade on them, personally. They're only 2 attacks base unless you go dual-claw, so they'll need every hit they can get to push casualties through, say, Hammernators. And I'm not taking a Termie Lord with them, so the Ld10 is a good bonus for them. And the more I think about it, the more I dislike mauls on them, too. Two attacks at WS4 without AP3 or better isn't likey to do much against a Marine opponent, and no xenos have massed AP2 CCWs that I can think of. So unless you've got the Mark of Slaanesh, the axe is probably the best weapon they can take in terms of hitting power and point cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 How stupid it might sound, I don't think the best use of our terminators is going for a heavy hammer unit. How mweh it might sound, the Mutilators or even Obliterators are general a better choice in that part as are the havocs/raptors. Where I do see our Terminator units shine is in the form of combat assistance or them being backed up by a nice full unit of Cultists. The combination of both should be more than enough of a problem for your average marine unit but still is roughly the same cost. Cheers, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Mark and Icon of Khorne are fine. Tzeentch is cool as a mark, but the Icon is just a shame. Slaanesh may be useful, but you only have one Aspiring Champ, plus the terminators using PF and CF will kinda miss the point of the +1 I. So Khorne. Veterans of the Long War is an auto take on them IMO. EDIT : How mweh it might sound, the Mutilators or even Obliterators are general a better choice in that part as are the havocs/raptors. Wrong. Mutilators are crap. It's a close combat unit that is unable to reach close combat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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