loadout for mixed armor wolf guard in crusader

[skeletoro]

So I'm planning on building a wolf guard squad in cataphractii/mk iii armor (5 of each model), and plonking them in a LRC.

 

What loadout suits best?

 

I am thinking of modelling one of the cataphractii as a wolf lord (though I already have a terminator Njal and Arjac model, so this may be unnecessary; plus, I already have a thunderwolf lord. I can't imagine fielding them ALL....)

 

Apart from that, I'm torn between two basic loadouts: close range shooty, and melee specialists.

 

More shooty: give all models (TDA and PA) combi plasma/melta. Wolf claws for the TDA (1 chain fist, maybe one power fist). Power swords for the PA (maybe 1-2 power axes).

One issue I'm wondering about: What should I do with my 2 heavy weapon choices? I could give 2 models heavy flamers or reaper autocannons that "count-as" asscans. Or I could split off 2 wolf guard (keeping the squad size at 8) and attach 2 cyclones to my long fangs. Heavy flamers might actually be quite good for this squad, I imagine, because they're so effective with overwatch, and the LRC will ensure the squad gets nice and close.

Also, is it worth giving power weapons to the 5 power-armor models? Or is it somewhat a waste of 50 points, given that the TDA models already have wolf claws/chain/power fists?

 

Melee: Give TDA 2x dual WC, 2x WC+PF, 1x WC+Chain fist. Give PA a power weapon (sword or axe) - leaving them with their bolt pistols for the extra attack.

Is it worth it to field melee specialist WG like this, as space wolves? I sort of feel like the combi wolves play to the strengths of SWs a bit better (e.g. counterattack).

If I were to go full melee, would it be worth it to give the PA models 2 power weapons for 50 more points (1x axe, 1x sword?) This would add a degree of flexibility.

 

Which option(s) work best?

 

EDIT: Upon further reflection, I think that if I was to go combi spam (and that's what I'm leaning towards) then a WL is a bad option as it has no ranged attacks. Therefore, Arjac or a RP would probably work best. Here's one possible loadout:

 

10 models (16 transport spots)

Arjac

2x TDA /w heavy flamer & WC

2x TDA /w combi-X & WC

1x TDA /w combi-X & CF

2x PA /w combi-X & PS

2x PA /w combi-X & PA

Land Raider Crusader (are any upgrades worth it? Perhaps multi-melta?)

 

By my count, that's 810 points. Ouch! I could save some by downgrading the terminators to power weapons (a shame; the cataphractii wolf claws are beautiful) and downgrading the PA guys to ccw.

[WG Vrox]

By my count, that's 810 points. Ouch!

 

That sums it up nicely, for me that is way to many eggs all sitting in one basket. Sure its a hella of a tough basket but none the less bad luck or the right type of opponent can leave that LRC wrecked on turn 1.

 

Consider 8 WG in TDA

 

2 CM - Power Axe

2 SB - Power Maul

2 SB - Power Weapon

1 WC-PF

1 Assault Cannon-CF

 

LRC with MM

 

This load-out comes in at 594 points including the LRC,, sure its a compromise of both shooty and melee, but will give you the best of both worlds and won't totally leave you in the pooper house if you have bad luck getting the unit where it needs to be by turn 3.

 

The standard power weapon getting multiple options is the best thing that happened to our TDA WG, now for a cheap 33 points we have a TDA option that can bring the hurt to anything on the table. Take advantage of its diversity and rock that battlefield.

 

Vrox

[Ullr Direfang]

A while back I looked at going with 10 PA WG and 4 characters and some wolves to go in one. I had a ton of SS in there which put my points value at over 1000.

 

I have thought about it again, as the big scary thing that has to have something crazy in it. But am not sure of how I would load them out yet. I haven't play a game in 6th ed yet (I haven't played a game in over 2 years.....). I will think on in and maybe post up what I would consider tomorrow.

[skeletoro]

OK, how's this for a compromise?

 

2 TDA /w combi-X and WC

1 TDA /w combi-X and CF

2 TDA /w H. Flamer and P. Axe

5 PA /w combi-X and ccw

 

LRC + MM

 

585 points.

 

I've got 2 heavy flamers, 8 combi weapons.

In close combat, just like the squad you built, I've got 2 power axes and a chainfist. I also have a couple of wolf claws, and a whole bunch of regular ccw attacks.

 

It's arguable which is better in melee (probably your squad, but it depends on what you're fighting), but the one I build is pretty good at close range shooty-ness. Those heavy flamers + counterattack will keep enemies from charging, and with 8 combi-weapons, they should be able to shoot the crap out of most foes. Arguably, once the combi-weapons were spent, the squad would aim to get into CC.

 

Arguably, it would be worth sinking 50 points to add power weapons to the PA guys. What do you think?

[skeletoro]

Perhaps the 3 combi-weapons on the terminators is overkill too (especially given that storm bolters aren't bad - in fact they're better if you've spent your last turn slaughtering everything within 12")

 

So it would be:

 

2 TDA /w SB and WC

1 TDA /w SB and CF

2 TDA /w H. Flamer and P. Axe

3 PA /w combi-X and P. Sword

2 PA /w combi-X and P. Axe

LRC + MM

 

620 points. Not too bad!

 

An even split between @init Ap3 and init 1 AP 2 attacks. Perhaps I should trade out a few axes for swords. Or for wolf claws. IMO, wolf claws are very much worth the upgrade over swords or maces. Against some foes, the maces will be slightly better bang for buck, but against some foes, the wolf claws will be drastically superior. I think unless you can guarantee you're fighting Orks or something... it's better to just go claws. What other low armour, high toughness foes are there? Unfortunately I'm not familiar with all the codices as I haven't played in years!

[WG Vrox]

There you go, looks good, worth a play test or two before you build your models for sure. PM if you post your entire list. I'd like to see what you plan to run with it.

 

I plan to run a LRC in an upcoming 1850 league game, but instead of WG it will be the following. We'll see how it does.

 

 

10 GH Flamer - Melta, MotW, Standard, Power Axe

Arjac

LRC MM-

 

For 638 about the same points as you, I get Arjac, he has performed consistently well for me and I plan to play test him in most of my upcoming lists. You may have luck with him in your unit, but for me it puts the point value in any single unit + trans that reduces your overall combat effectiveness. I would only consider this unit in games 1750+.

 

What you have to consider for 6th is scoring units. To me it seems it's all about Victory Points and I am now leaning toward one scoring unit in every 400 points instead of the standard 5th build ratio of 1 in 500. For Space Wolves we luckily have the best scoring unit in the game. The thing with a unit like yours is if you want a WG unit to be scoring you must take Logan and at that point you have a lot of your points in only 12 models.

 

Vrox

[skeletoro]

Well, I had bought an army just before 6th came out. It's rather razor-spam. I've got about 6, and enough grey hunters to fill them up (actually, some of them can be rhinos instead). I've also already got enough wolf guard models to add one to each squad, about 6 WG terminators, a couple of long fang squads, a thunderwolf cavalry squad (plus lord), a dreadnought, a wolf scout squad (armed with plasma), TDA njal, and Arjac. Also 5 fenrisian wolves.

 

I have a bunch of old models from my old army, that were painted terribly. I've been gradually stripping the paint off. Today I disassembled an old LRC (metal bits) and LR. I was thinking of stripping off the paint, buying a LRC conversion kit, and using those pieces to convert the two to a LRC and a LRR and repainting them.

 

So I would actually be able to field the squad I mentioned, plus the squad you mentioned (I'd been thinking of doing that with Arjac - I think it's a better use of him for the reasons you mentioned) alongside each other with about 6 razorbacks. Of course, that's about 3000 points... and I haven't actually painted anything yet!

 

In short, I haven't really got much of a list planned at this point! Nor do I even have a points value in mind.

[Runesch]

You could always do 1 WG with 2 x Cyclone :) and stick him with a LF squad, and before you all go ape poop on the 2 x cyclone, it is very much allowed in the codex, other option is the cyclone ass-cannon guy, always a party pleaser...

 

 

 

Rune

[dswanick]

You could always do 1 WG with 2 x Cyclone B) and stick him with a LF squad, and before you all go ape poop on the 2 x cyclone, it is very much allowed in the codex, other option is the cyclone ass-cannon guy, always a party pleaser...

 

 

 

Rune

First, no it is not allowed : "For every five models in the squad, one Wolf Guard model in Terminator armour may choose one of the following:",C:SW, Pg.86.

"One ... model" ... "may choose one of the following". So each model could only have one Cyclone.

Second, even if it were allowed for a model to take more than one of the upgrades, it would still be bound by the "one weapon" Shooting rule. So would only be able to fire one per Shooting phase.

[Ullr Direfang]

I am not sure if my not having played a game is skewing the way I look at it but I still feel a couple SS would help them out.

 

I was looking at something like this bases off of what you guys have been posting:

 

LRC w/ MM

 

TDA w/ HF and CF

TDA w/ HF and WC

2x TDA w/ CombiX and WC

TDA w/ CombiX and PAx

PA w/ PM and SS

2x PA w/ PP and PAx

2x PA w/ CombiX and PW

 

I did just edit this while typing. but that is 675 points, I hate to give PA guys the combi weapons but you guys seem to and if the secondary is an assault weapon then I can see the use, but I feel that a WG unit would b e best fitted for CC goodness.

[skeletoro]

The thing I like about giving a fisty weapon to every terminator, and a power sword or axe to every PA guy, is that I can magnetize their right hands/arms and swap out the combi weapons for lightning claws/bolt pistols, respectively. That would be an easy weapon swap to go from generalist to melee specialist. If you give an axe to a terminator, it gets a bit more complicated as the codex doesn't allow you to give 2 power/frost weapons to a terminator. I guess you could make that model an axe+SS guy.

 

Storm shields are pretty good. I just find them to be so expensive. And how do you ensure the storm shield absorbs the blows it needs to? You need to keep small arms fire away from that model but ensure all the lascannon/plasma/melta is directed that way. I can't imagine that that would be easy.