Swifftclaws

[Bearingtheword]

Hail brethren,

 

I've played a few games now using my Swiftclaws (yeah, a small sampling I know) but so far they have not lasted very long. I have been running 6 (1 AB, 5 regs- 1 w/flamer) led by a Wolf priest. I'm sure some of the survivability has to do with the learning curve and that it will get better as a play more games. But I had got to thinking about possibly dropping 1 bike and then giving one of them a Power Lance. It seems as if it would be just as effective as a power sword but with the bonus to str of a power axe.

 

What are your thoughts on this?

 

What are your experiences with Power Lances?

 

How are they affected when using "Hammer of Wrath"?

 

What are your tactics with the unit?

 

Thanks in advance!

 

 

 

~BtW

 

 

Edit: Removed the part about hit and run as I thought I had removed it in the first place...darn kids and their interruptions, lol

[Exark]

Err, how are you getting them with hit and run if I may ask?

[Ullr Direfang]

From what I have seen/read, that seems to be the point of a power lance. Sure you can give it to other models, but on something that can hit and run is best. The ability to keep getting the strength bonus and better AP is awesome. Just to bad it doesn't work on counter charge other wise it would be a good choice for a lot of our army.

 

I used to use bike, 5 with only close combat weapons. I would often leave them to one side kind of all alone. Not as a deployment disruptor mind you. Then pin something in place with my GH or TDAWG, and slam them home. I imagine that this would still be a good thing for them particularly with HoW.

 

EDIT:

Err, how are you getting them with hit and run if I may ask?

 

I too thought hit and run was a new Bike USR, but just looked and it not, so yeah, how would they get hit and run?

[Grimtooth]

How are Swift Claws getting Hit and Run?

[Bearingtheword]

Err, how are you getting them with hit and run if I may ask?

 

 

I'm not.....But I keep getting interrupted by my kids when attempting to post, lol.... I can handle two conversations at once but not more than that. I had started to ask a question about hit and run, but changed my mind after the interruption and thought I had deleted that part....

 

~BtW

 

Edit: although I do think bikes should have it, sadly the designers don't agree.... Unless your running White Scars led by Kor'sarro Khan that is....

Tempting to take some as allies at some point, lol...

[MeatGrinder]

Edit: although I do think bikes should have it, sadly the designers don't agree....

 

A bike to too unweildy to disengage with easily, as opposed to jump packs boosting away.

I run my bikes as 4 with melta attack bike, fist, meltagun. With WGPL with cmbimelta and fist. In my current list I have them with a Battle leader with frost blade and RA.

They support my pods coming down, flanking enemy units, melting tanks, picking off smaller frail units and joining in units that get caught in combat. Heres a tip, dont use them as your assault force, get thunderwolves for that. These guys arent top of the line combat troops. They will get minced in combat. Theyre there to support the rest of your troops. They are a fantastic countercharge unit.

[Bearingtheword]

Edit: although I do think bikes should have it, sadly the designers don't agree....

 

A bike to too unweildy to disengage with easily, as opposed to jump packs boosting away.

I run my bikes as 4 with melta attack bike, fist, meltagun. With WGPL with cmbimelta and fist. In my current list I have them with a Battle leader with frost blade and RA.

They support my pods coming down, flanking enemy units, melting tanks, picking off smaller frail units and joining in units that get caught in combat. Heres a tip, dont use them as your assault force, get thunderwolves for that. These guys arent top of the line combat troops. They will get minced in combat. Theyre there to support the rest of your troops. They are a fantastic countercharge unit.

 

Not sure I agree with them being to unwieldy to hit and run as at least one unit of Scars can do it.

 

Do you mean counter-charge? or secondary charge unit? (as in charging into a unit already locked into CC?)

 

Thanks!

 

~BtW

[space wolf]

These guys arent top of the line combat troops. They will get minced in combat. Theyre there to support the rest of your troops. They are a fantastic countercharge unit.

 

I'm gunna have to partially disagree here. These guys will chew through quite a bit. Granted you have to be a little more careful on what you charge with them, but I've had these guys hold my entire flank by themselves, quite easily. Granted I usually run about 8 bikes total, with MM attackbike, Melta, pfist, and either WP or WGBL.

 

~BTW: These guys just like most of the units in our codex, are absolute monsters if you support them. Don't be afraid to let these guy hang back just a little. Let your GH do some heavy lifting, getting the enemy softened up. Then ram these guys down their throat! It doesn't necessarily mean, charging an already engaged unit, but it could. Another tactic is to use them as a massive distraction. This will limit their survivability, and also depend on how many bikes you're fielding, as they will be taking much more fire. But if done right, there will be less things shooting at the rest of your army.

[TiguriusX]

HQ unit with runic armor to take armor save rolls can help with some durability

 

Proper timing on attacks will help as well.

 

Use them as a scalpel for surgical strikes instead of death star taking on all comers. As others have said, the GH do the heavy lifting

 

Also, do a forum search for littlbitz. He is the biker expert with many great informational posts and battle reports

[Valerian]

Hail brethren,

 

I've played a few games now using my Swiftclaws (yeah, a small sampling I know) but so far they have not lasted very long. I have been running 6 (1 AB, 5 regs- 1 w/flamer) led by a Wolf priest. I'm sure some of the survivability has to do with the learning curve and that it will get better as a play more games. But I had got to thinking about possibly dropping 1 bike and then giving one of them a Power Lance. It seems as if it would be just as effective as a power sword but with the bonus to str of a power axe.

 

Instead of answers, I'll just ask a few questions.

 

1. What do you intend for your Swiftclaws to do for your army? What tasks will they accomplish for you in the offense, and in the defense?

 

2. Have you designed the unit to accomplish those tasks?

 

Valerian

[MeatGrinder]

I'm gunna have to partially disagree here. These guys will chew through quite a bit. Granted you have to be a little more careful on what you charge with them, but I've had these guys hold my entire flank by themselves, quite easily. Granted I usually run about 8 bikes total, with MM attackbike, Melta, pfist, and either WP or WGBL.

 

~BTW: These guys just like most of the units in our codex, are absolute monsters if you support them. Don't be afraid to let these guy hang back just a little. Let your GH do some heavy lifting, getting the enemy softened up. Then ram these guys down their throat! It doesn't necessarily mean, charging an already engaged unit, but it could. Another tactic is to use them as a massive distraction. This will limit their survivability, and also depend on how many bikes you're fielding, as they will be taking much more fire. But if done right, there will be less things shooting at the rest of your army.

 

A unit of bikes costs in the range on 200+pts for 5 or 6 ws/bs3 3+ no invul models. They are t5, but a single power fist will smash a unit of them if you can't wreck the enemy in the first combat phase. It is very easy to overestimate them, considering what youre paying for them.

 

@BTW: I mean both man, for example, your GH get charged by something nasty that they cant deal with themselves, get the bikers in there to help them. GH doing the charging? Is it a charge that may go wrong? Get them bikes in there to make sure it all goes smoothly.

 

One of the major strengths of bikes is that they have the mobility to get anywhere on on the board fast. Make use of this when you play them. Be everywhere your opponent doesnt want them to be.

If you wanted something that could dominate in combat, you take thunderwolves, not bikes.

[Rift Blade]

I would tend to agree with Meat Grinder. Bikes are a very good support unit. Their strength lies in their mobility. I've had the most success with them us a roving support squad. Don't forget that the bikes are armed with TWIN LINKED bolters. Use them to help a unit already locked in combat or to pick off smaller units of your opponent or even Turbo Boost down one flank & start making a nuisance in his rear areas. DON'T let them get bogged down. You might be surprised what your opponents will send after these guys if you keep slipping away. Just my 2 cents.

[Bearingtheword]

HQ unit with runic armor to take armor save rolls can help with some durability

 

Proper timing on attacks will help as well.

 

Use them as a scalpel for surgical strikes instead of death star taking on all comers. As others have said, the GH do the heavy lifting

 

Also, do a forum search for littlbitz. He is the biker expert with many great informational posts and battle reports

 

I'll definitely do a search for littlbitz. Thanks. I appreciate the info

 

 

I would tend to agree with Meat Grinder. Bikes are a very good support unit. Their strength lies in their mobility. I've had the most success with them us a roving support squad. Don't forget that the bikes are armed with TWIN LINKED bolters. Use them to help a unit already locked in combat or to pick off smaller units of your opponent or even Turbo Boost down one flank & start making a nuisance in his rear areas. DON'T let them get bogged down. You might be surprised what your opponents will send after these guys if you keep slipping away. Just my 2 cents.

 

I did use them as a flanking/ assist unit in my game tonight and they did very well. They managed to assist and save a Grey Hunter unit that had got itself tied up with Hive Tyrant. In fact, it was the Swiftclaws that finally brought it down, even if the Wolf Priest did cause the majority of the wounds...

 

@Valerian I'm still trying to figure some of that out, to be completley honest.. but I did find using them as a flanking/ assist / backline threat unit worked well.

 

I'm still wondering though if it's worth dropping 1 bike and taking a power wep of some sort though... currently I am running 6 bikes (1 flamer) and an attack bike (heavy bolter) led by a wolf priest, but I wonder if dropping one bike and taking a power wep would be more effective in most possible situations that the unit may find itself in.... Thoughts?

 

~BtW

[space wolf]

I'm gunna have to partially disagree here. These guys will chew through quite a bit. Granted you have to be a little more careful on what you charge with them, but I've had these guys hold my entire flank by themselves, quite easily. Granted I usually run about 8 bikes total, with MM attackbike, Melta, pfist, and either WP or WGBL.

 

~BTW: These guys just like most of the units in our codex, are absolute monsters if you support them. Don't be afraid to let these guy hang back just a little. Let your GH do some heavy lifting, getting the enemy softened up. Then ram these guys down their throat! It doesn't necessarily mean, charging an already engaged unit, but it could. Another tactic is to use them as a massive distraction. This will limit their survivability, and also depend on how many bikes you're fielding, as they will be taking much more fire. But if done right, there will be less things shooting at the rest of your army.

 

A unit of bikes costs in the range on 200+pts for 5 or 6 ws/bs3 3+ no invul models. They are t5, but a single power fist will smash a unit of them if you can't wreck the enemy in the first combat phase. It is very easy to overestimate them, considering what youre paying for them.

 

@BTW: I mean both man, for example, your GH get charged by something nasty that they cant deal with themselves, get the bikers in there to help them. GH doing the charging? Is it a charge that may go wrong? Get them bikes in there to make sure it all goes smoothly.

 

One of the major strengths of bikes is that they have the mobility to get anywhere on on the board fast. Make use of this when you play them. Be everywhere your opponent doesnt want them to be.

If you wanted something that could dominate in combat, you take thunderwolves, not bikes.

 

 

I'm not saying they are a deathstar unit, but I AM saying it's also easy to underestimate them as well. Bottomline, I think we can both agree you should know capabilities of whatever you are having them charge into.

[Rift Blade]

If you are running 6 bikes, then yes, I would say it is worth it.

[Hear da Lamentation]

With the new bonus to fearless, a 2+, 4++ save with 2+ look out sir! And attacking with str6 the wolf priest is a hell of an hq choice for these boys. But as has been said, I find them an excellent support unit, but they are no death star, so you need to think carefully about how many points you spend on them

[Grey Mage]

I like to give them a powerfist just for the versatility and AP:2. You never know when youll need it. The Rune Priest I run with them has AP:3 covered, and squad as a whole just throws out a monstrous number of attacks, wich is nice at their price per model.

 

I usually use them as a counter-assault unit, and if its less than 6 I really do reccommend it that way. When they get larger than that they make a good spearhead unit- tying up dangerous enemies and pulverizing them in bloodclaw fashion while your GHs close in. You are more likely to get the unit killed this way- but with the higher numbers comes more survivability.

 

They actually seem to couple quite well with a biomancy priest, and I somewhat prefer to to the Wolf Priests rerolls and powermaul.

[narf]

I had a good run at a local tourney with swiftclaws.

 

The unit was 10 Swiftclaws, and a wolfpriest within runic armour and melta bombs on a bike.

 

IT worked as a really good threat unit, coming in at around 400pts though it was a big spend.

 

However, in the first game it mowed down a unit of gretchin, charged through a mob of orks, a mob of loota's and the wolf priest challenged the warboss in the last turn to pummel him. lost 4 bikers

 

2nd game against necrons, got outflank as the warlord trait came in on turn 2, survived 2/3rds of his army shooting then multi charge 2 tesla things and two of the large transports, took them out in combat with grenades. Finally taken out in combat with a destroyer lord and barge lord, but paid for themselves

 

3rd game against eldar, came on turn 2 (special deployment in this mission run by the store) zoomed up the board, took hits from broadsides, crisis suits, rangers, bladestorming dire avengers, all for the loss of 2 bikers, bikes split and the unit went for the dire avengers whilst the priest when for the rangers, total wipeouts on both units, the bikes then proceeded to fail 8 3+ saves after being shot at by 2 units of rapid firing fire warriors, whilst the priest went on the batter a unit of crisis suits, eventually being stopped by eldrad.

 

They absorb alot of fire power, they dont need to be tricked out, but they do need support (the rest of the amry was 3 untis of DP GH, a rune priest, and a guard command and 2 units fo veterans). The main bonus is the hammer of wrath followed by 4 attacks each, that means a full unit can get the following

 

22 twin linked bolter shots

11 HoW hits when they hit combat

40 swift claw attacks

4 power maul attacks

 

all rerolling 1's to hit and 1's to wound if the right preferred enemy is there.

[Blacksad]

might be a stupid question, but can swiftclaw bikes use those twinlinked bolters and their pistols?

[narf]

alas no, they are relentless, but are only able to fire as many weapons as there are riders, which is why an attack bike gets to fire its bolters and the sidecar weapons

[Lord Ragnarok]

I'm planning on using mine as a fast mobile supporting unit. Helping out my 1 slogging GH pack and three drop podding GH packs as needed. 8 models with WG, Rune Priest(Biomancy/Master of Runes), Wolf Priest. It will be expensive but should get a lot of attention and soak up fire power. The trick will be timing of their use..making them a threat to limit focus of the GH's but have them last long enough to count. It will be a pts unit and I'll adjust based on experience.

 

I really like them in theory. They can both support with shooting and/or assaulting, they will be a distraction, A rune priest caddy to potentially buff all packs, and they allow me to represent Blood Claws. We'll see how it works. I like the thought of increased livability if I can get Endurance and Forewarning.

[narf]

having used the 10 man unit, i would recommend buying an attack bike, the extra wound, attacks and shots for the point costs is better than just a normal swiftclaw

[Bearingtheword]

Yeah, I run an HB Attack Bike with mine now, along with 6 reg bikes with 1 flamer. I am thinking that I will be dropping that down to 5 bikes with a flamer and the HB Attack Bike, and then using those points saved to add a power wep to the unit. Just trying to decide between the axe or the sword. With WS 3 I figure I'll need that extra attack, not to mention S6 while good is not S8, so not thinking Pfist on him. Anyhow, those are my thoughts at the moment....

 

~BtW

[Lord Ragnarok]

Naked attack bike is almost mandatory based on cost/benefit.