Did the Ravenwing Exist During the Horus Heresy?

[Joasht]

It appears that the Ravenwing are based on an older tradition dating back to The Order - so did they exist as a branch of the Dark Angels Legion even pre-Heresy??

 

Thanks!

[DIDM]

in the collected short stories called Tales of Heresy there is a story about the Dark Angels. In it 2 DA marines are talking and one asks the other about the markings on his shoulders. So I'd assume they were formed during the heresy?

[TennisBall]

They probably did. Their background suggests that they've always been a hunting type unit. They started off hunting the beasts on Caliban, they currently hunt the Fallen so during the Crusade and heresy they probably went after high profile targets like enemy commanders and specialised in hit and run attacks - my guess anyway.

[DarkChaplain]

The Ravenwing was a knightly order on Caliban.

Chapter Commander Belath was bearing their icon on one shoulder pad during the events described in "Call of the Lion" from Tales of Heresy.

It does not appear that the Ravenwing has been formed as an institution within the Legion yet, though.

 

The events took place after the return of Luther and the others to Caliban, and before the events on Diamat and Isstvan V. There has been no mention of the Ravenwing that I am aware of since then, neither in "Savage Weapons" from Age of Darkness, "The Lion" from The Primarchs or elsewhere.

 

One could speculate that Belath and/or other Ravenwing members did something cool during the Heresy's later years and got formed as a result of it, but there's nothing that'd even suggest that yet.

[Joasht]

My thanks guys. Perhaps they never existed as an official entity in the Legion, but was kind of like an unofficial brotherhood within it? I've always loved the Ravenwing "look", so I'm eager to include them in my preheresy army :D

[Captain Semper]

The Ravenwing was a knightly order on Caliban.

 

Nope. It was a formation of the knights of the Order - not a separate knightly order.

[Haranin]

They are referenced in Decent of Angels as been the mounted fighting force (v. the infantry).

[DarkChaplain]

The Ravenwing was a knightly order on Caliban.

 

Nope. It was a formation of the knights of the Order - not a separate knightly order.

 

Nope. They apparently existed before the Order swallowed them all.

 

'That is the symbol of my order,' replied Belath, somewhat taken aback. 'The Order of the Raven's Wing.'

Astelan turned an inquiring look to Galedan.

'One of the knightly orders,' the captain said. 'A Calibanite rank badge.'

[Legatus]

FWIW, the 2nd Edition Codex Angels of Death, and in part the 4th Edition Codex Dark Angels suggest that the Deathwing and the Ravenwing were formed specifically as a response to the Fallen.

"The organisation of the Dark Angels Chapter has been shaped primarily by events in its history. As a result it is different from that of any other order."

(2nd Edition Codex Angels of Death, p. 14)

"The Ravenwing is the name of the 2nd Company of the Dark Angels Chapter. Instead of the usual dark green panopy of the rest of the Chapter, the Ravenwing's bikes and Land speeders, as well as their power armour, are painted jet black, and it is this which gives the company its unique name. Although a highly specialised formation exceptionally skilled at scouting and assault missions, the Ravenwing is much more than a reconnaissance force. Its true function is vital to the ten thousand year mission of the Dark Angels.

Although only the company's highest ranked officers know it, the Ravenwing's primary role is to hunt down and capture the Fallen Dark Angels."

(4th Edition Codex Dark Angels, p. 17)

[Captain Semper]

The Ravenwing was a knightly order on Caliban.

 

Nope. It was a formation of the knights of the Order - not a separate knightly order.

 

Nope. They apparently existed before the Order swallowed them all.

 

'That is the symbol of my order,' replied Belath, somewhat taken aback. 'The Order of the Raven's Wing.'

Astelan turned an inquiring look to Galedan.

'One of the knightly orders,' the captain said. 'A Calibanite rank badge.'

 

Before we play the quote game, have you read Descent of Angles? You know the book that describes in (unneccesary) detail Caliban and the Order in the days before the Emperor? All you need to know is there. Belath's badly worded one-liner in a short story can hardly retcon the established lore that the Ravenwing was a scout/light horse unit of the Order.

 

And where did you get the whole "existed before the Order" thing? Even if you assume that it was a seperate order (which it was not) where is the information that it was older than the Order?

 

If it is to save us time you can also check the Lexicanum here: Ravenwing. Check out the last sentence.

 

 

 

@ OP: As regards the existance of the Ravenwing in the pre-Heresy Legion as a distinct formation akin to the post-Heresy one I'd say that there are no indications so far to support it. It goes without saying that the mission of the RW (even if such a formation did exist pre-Heresy) would be purely a military one since the concept of the Fallen did not exist. As new BL books come out, and of course when the FW HH series touch upon the DAs we'll get a more definate yes or no on the matter...

[DarkChaplain]

I am not disputing the existence of the Ravenwing during the events of Descent of Angels - far from it. I am not even disputing the fact that the Order made use of the Ravenwing.

 

However, nowhere did Descent of Angels clearly state that the Ravenwing was part of the Order. Quite the opposite, even in the prologue of the novel was said that the Order brought other orders to join them and support their campaign to eradicate the beasts of Caliban, and at the end of their crusade, when the Emperor arrived, there was basically only the Order left of the knightly orders, with the remnants who did not join them being scattered across the planet and getting mad about their loss of power (see: Fallen Angels). Heck, we know that one of the highest ranking members of the Dark Angels on Caliban was of the Lupus.

 

We however do know that the Ravenwing were highly specialized knights with strong and fast horses, and that the Order might have contributed horses once they received enough training via their supplicants - which is hardly surprising, considering how much political stuff was going on to keep the other orders in line.

It is even said that the Ravenwing would not ride to certain areas unless called to do so unless called to do so by their masters. That's a direct quote from Descent of Angels, chapter 6, speaking of the Northwilds and how the Order -and their allies- hadn't entered them yet.

However, there was mention of the Ravenwing being with the Order after the victory at the fortress of the Knights Lupus (after the battle was won, though), when the Northwilds were finally free to be purged.

 

Of course the Ravenwing "existed" during the Great Crusade, or even before that, but not within the Legion, if we rely on sources we have access to right now. We have no proof that the Ravenwing was a formal institution within the Legion, but we have proof that it was an informal one, albeit in the form of shoulder badges. The way it is depicted, it wouldn't even surprise me if the original Marines from Caliban were bearing their old order-iconographies just like Belath.

 

However, if the Ravenwing DID exist during the Crusade or the Heresy, why wouldn't one of the highest-ranking commanders of the Legion know about them?

We have not seen the Ravenwing on the battlefield after the Emperor picked up the Lion. Don't get me wrong, I'd very much like to see the Ravenwing being reinstalled as a mobile fighting force by the Lion sometime down the road, but as it stands, they aren't raiding the Thramas worlds on their jetbikes as of yet.

[Thunder Raven]

The Ravenwing are definitely mentioned in the HH books as being a cavalry formation that was in some way linked with the order. But I don't think they were officially part of the Dark Angels legion until much later. On a tangent slightly but one of the first white dwarfs I ever bought had Ravenwing bikers in it (Way back in '92/'93 when the bikes were still metal and designed to fit the plastic RTB01 marines as riders. My god I'm getting old.

 

 

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