the jeske Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 The jeske: I normally try to play 1500, but I'll switch it up occasionally. I don't have the codex yet but from rumors and hearsay, I think I'll be able to fit 1x HQ, 3x Troops and 2-3x units from the other slots. Big things I'm debating currently is how many rhinos, if any, too take and whether or not skyfire havocs are auto includes. try to play games as close to 2k pts as you can man . Trust me If you try to do 1k or 1.5k , you are going to be disappointed. 2k pts , not playing against an IG or Necron army and the book is fun to test around different stuff. as the walker thing goes , am less worried about them blowing up in hth [specialy as its not like we want a shoty platform in hth] , but from shoting . hull points realy go down fast and while some people may not think about it while making their armies necrons and IG do exist . that is the real problem with fiends or other non havock stuff , well that and flakk being havock only. One of tzeench [precog] or slany [uber senses] powers should give skyfire to a unit or model . I think that maul+nurgle lord on bike + 3 plasma bikers with a power weapon asp champ is going to be taken in many chaos lists. I also imagine that a lot of old timers are going to run 2 DPS wings power armor , no psychic powers , nurgle . for shrouding just to use the models and not buy new ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Still hurts, especially for their fairly monstrous points cost and complete lack of ranged attacks. Tzeentch is an okay mark - for characters and terminators, but other than that, this is not a good time to be playing tzeentch aligned marines. Daemons, sure, but not marines. Kind of sad to confess that I agree with you on this (Tzeentch). As for Warp Talons, I think they can have their uses in some lists. But grenades or something which would give an equalent rule, would be nice for sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feste Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 Still hurts, especially for their fairly monstrous points cost and complete lack of ranged attacks. Tzeentch is an okay mark - for characters and terminators, but other than that, this is not a good time to be playing tzeentch aligned marines. Daemons, sure, but not marines. I dunno, I think it's possible that 1k Sons won't have fun but Tzeentchian marines are OK. Jetbike steeds, improvements in the Psyker powers, being able to buy Lvl 3 Psykers all make Tzeentch worshippers happy. Rubric marines less so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 yeah , thing is tzeench players community is mostly 1ksons . On the other hand of course GW does hate them and makes them suck in every codex made by them , including FW . Why doesnt soul fire stack . A single change and they would be at least worth considering as a single unit or something . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 yeah , thing is tzeench players community is mostly 1ksons . On the other hand of course GW does hate them and makes them suck in every codex made by them , including FW . Why doesnt soul fire stack . A single change and they would be at least worth considering as a single unit or something . Stacking Soul Fire would really have helped a lot when I come to think of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feste Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I've thought about it before and a naive stacking Soul fire would be crazy (10D3 bolter hits good golly gosh that would hurt!). However a simple modier like D3+n, where n is the number of counters, might be a little better. I agree with it in principle though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 I've thought about it before and a naive stacking Soul fire would be crazy (10D3 bolter hits good golly gosh that would hurt!). However a simple modier like D3+n, where n is the number of counters, might be a little better. I agree with it in principle though. I wouldn't do it that way. I'd allow stacking from different units, ie, 1KSons unit #1 shoots you, you get one Soul Blaze token. Then 1KSons unit #2 shoots you, you get a second Soul Blaze token. If they stacked that way, it'd be good without being OTT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 As with many things that don't really work, there are a million ways that soul fire could be fixed so that it worked. As it is, it doesn't really work, and I wouldn't voluntarily pay points for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 3, 2012 Share Posted October 3, 2012 As with many things that don't really work, there are a million ways that soul fire could be fixed so that it worked. As it is, it doesn't really work, and I wouldn't voluntarily pay points for it. It works fine for vehicles though. But the reason for that is the appropriate cost. The Icon is simply just unacceptably expensive for its worth since the Sons are not exactly CC specialists, so gain little from the +1 combat res on the icon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trevak Dal Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 OK guys...maybe I'm just having a lapse moment here-and it doesn't really make much sense-I wouldn't do it, and believe it one of those things that's 'Gonna be Faq'd with the Quickness', but Rules as Written, you can give a Daemon Prince a Daemonic Steed... Khorne Marked Daemon Prince, Power Armor, Black Mace...and Juggernaut. 260 points. Though it would be funny to see a Daemon Prince modeled on Juggernought (...or a Maulerfiend...or a Helldrake) Also, the DP being a Monstrous Creature, does that improve the Black Mace's ap4 and bring it down to AP2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 OK guys...maybe I'm just having a lapse moment here-and it doesn't really make much sense-I wouldn't do it, and believe it one of those things that's 'Gonna be Faq'd with the Quickness', but Rules as Written, you can give a Daemon Prince a Daemonic Steed... Khorne Marked Daemon Prince, Power Armor, Black Mace...and Juggernaut. 260 points. Though it would be funny to see a Daemon Prince modeled on Juggernought (...or a Maulerfiend...or a Helldrake) Also, the DP being a Monstrous Creature, does that improve the Black Mace's ap4 and bring it down to AP2? You cannot. Phil Kelly even made a series of footnotes on the rewards/gifts page, to tell you that you categorically can`t :P Black Mace is AP 2 on a prince though, due to Smash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Anyway to get Soul Fire on the Helldrake's flamer? I see 'Tzeentch' Cultists (don't bother with Mark), Sorcerors on Disks, some 1KSons allied with Tzeentch Daemons working well. Dallas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lepaca Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Anyway to get Soul Fire on the Helldrake's flamer? The bale flamer comes with soul fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Anyway to get Soul Fire on the Helldrake's flamer? The bale flamer comes with soul fire. Really!? Well that's a no brainier upgrade if you take a HD then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Anyway to get Soul Fire on the Helldrake's flamer? The bale flamer comes with soul fire. Really!? Well that's a no brainier upgrade if you take a HD then! Yeah, I would claim that it is a far more characterful upgrade than the Hades for the Drake, and it also happens to be better overall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Yeah, I would claim that it is a far more characterful upgrade than the Hades for the Drake, and it also happens to be better overall. Unless the plan is to hunt-annoy Flyers, then again they still have Vector Strike :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Yeah, I would claim that it is a far more characterful upgrade than the Hades for the Drake, and it also happens to be better overall. Unless the plan is to hunt-annoy Flyers, then again they still have Vector Strike ;) Exactly! Vector Strike whatever you want & then flame something within 12'' with S6 AP3 Soul Fire. The Helldrake is growing on me too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attomsk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Yeah, I would claim that it is a far more characterful upgrade than the Hades for the Drake, and it also happens to be better overall. Unless the plan is to hunt-annoy Flyers, then again they still have Vector Strike ;) Exactly! Vector Strike whatever you want & then flame something within 12'' with S6 AP3 Soul Fire. The Helldrake is growing on me too... Vector striking with a vehicle flier is going to be a bit tougher than with a FMC. I forsee vector striking then flying off the table a turn or two later. Luckily that flamer has torrent or it would be hard to use. Does the torrent flamer still only have a 45 degree arc in front of the flier it can shoot with, or it fire it wherever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Excessus Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 In my first game with it I managed to vector strike three times during the five turns it was on the board without flying off the table again(while flaming a ton of critters though)... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Yeah, I would claim that it is a far more characterful upgrade than the Hades for the Drake, and it also happens to be better overall. Unless the plan is to hunt-annoy Flyers, then again they still have Vector Strike ;) Exactly! Vector Strike whatever you want & then flame something within 12'' with S6 AP3 Soul Fire. The Helldrake is growing on me too... Vector striking with a vehicle flier is going to be a bit tougher than with a FMC. I forsee vector striking then flying off the table a turn or two later. Luckily that flamer has torrent or it would be hard to use. Does the torrent flamer still only have a 45 degree arc in front of the flier it can shoot with, or it fire it wherever? It can shoot within 12'' but page 16 in the BRB is quite clear about Out of Sight, templates AFAIK need LOS just like any other shooting attack so it looks like you need that 45 degree arc for LOS. Dallas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attomsk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 In my first game with it I managed to vector strike three times during the five turns it was on the board without flying off the table again(while flaming a ton of critters though)... nice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 4, 2012 Author Share Posted October 4, 2012 Visually I'm not impressed with the hellchicken, so my goal is not to use it if I don't have to and rely on other units for flyer suppression. I'm still struggling to prioritize AA firepower in the new edition because not everyone uses flyers but some bring multiple tough ones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Visually I'm not impressed with the hellchicken, so my goal is not to use it if I don't have to and rely on other units for flyer suppression. I'm still struggling to prioritize AA firepower in the new edition because not everyone uses flyers but some bring multiple tough ones. Paper/Scissors. Just the way GW likes it. I'd say pick at least one unit that can handle flyers. If that means giving one unit of Havocs Flakks then do it. Personally I'm allying with Daemons & taking a Bloodthirster (& 8 Bloodletters). Dallas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rik Riorik Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 I haven't read the new Codex yet but it doesn't seem to have changed my idea from what I've heard thus far. I've always been a fan of trying to use a number of units so that there is something to do in all phases and that use differnt parts of the rules (tranports, infiltrate, deep strike, tanks for example). That hasn't changed. I am however thinking of giving up my dislike for games over 1500pts. Because there's just so much to fit in that 1500pts feels too restrictive. I like the restriction of not being able to field everything you'd like into a list but 1500pts seem a tad on the low side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer le Boucher Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Look what i've found in my FLGS this morning!!! http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/4156/img1505f.jpg http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/9356/img1506g.jpg http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/9167/img1507l.jpg He so gonna get converted..., my bit boxes was laying there for the past 8 months..., i'm all itchy to cut and glue... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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