Bearingtheword Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Anyone else a little miffed or disappointed with the fact that on most units it's costing us 25pts to take the Icon that grants our units Fearless in order to get something that's remotely on the level of ATSKNF that comes standard on are loyalist counterparts? Granted VOTLW with it's +1 Ld helps but it's still not anywhere near as good..... Thoughts? ~BtW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Ragnarok Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 So 2.5 pts per marine for 10 marines? Or 1.25 for each marine for 20. Seems ok to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Attomsk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 So 2.5 pts per marine for 10 marines?Or 1.25 for each marine for 20. Seems ok to me. except its an icon bearer can get killed, which is the main trade off with icons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 No, not specifically, why? We're not Loyalists. i thought everyone's mood was to get as far as way from Loyalists as possible. That does mean we have to sacrifice a few things in order to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 We're Chaos Marines. I don't intend on losing combat to those lapdogs of the corpse-god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearingtheword Posted October 4, 2012 Author Share Posted October 4, 2012 I guess my point is that we are still stuck paying for what other marines are getting for free.... It's only one gripe out of a possible handful in what is otherwise a beautiful codex. I've just never understood the point of us not having ATSKNF as we were/are Astartes. The "It's a benefit based on the discipline instilled by the Codex Astartes that I have heard bandied around doesn't hold water as there are Legions/chapters that don't follow the codex that have it. At the very least after living in the warp for 10k years nothing in the material world would hold any fear for us, leading to us being fearless without having to have a metal pole in hand..... Ah well, maybe it will be something that will turn out not to be an issue with having LD 10 thanks to VOTLW .... one can only hope. ~BtW Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Ambroz Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 We're Chaos Marines. I don't intend on losing combat to those lapdogs of the corpse-god. That's the spirit right there. Yeah a little to be honest but then we also have Veterans of the Long War so it's sort of a trade-off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Think of it this way, Chaos Marines are survivors. Sometimes, surviving means knowing to say "Screw it, I'm outta here!". Leave the suicidal charges and Pyrrhic victories to the Loyalists. We get to live longer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AekoldHelbrass Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 No, not specifically, why? We're not Loyalists. i thought everyone's mood was to get as far as way from Loyalists as possible. That does mean we have to sacrifice a few things in order to do so. Well, yes, that was an idea, but we hoped to get as far as possible AND not become worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kol Saresk Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Define worse. We're at a new Codex and even the people who aren't happy with it admit that it has a chance. So, there is light at the end of the tunnel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feste Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 So 2.5 pts per marine for 10 marines?Or 1.25 for each marine for 20. Seems ok to me. And we start off 3pts cheaper so it's a wash... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AekoldHelbrass Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Define worse. We're at a new Codex and even the people who aren't happy with it admit that it has a chance. So, there is light at the end of the tunnel. It's quite easy to define. Let's talk about spherical horses in vacuum, you're composing roster for 2500 points, and you have both options: marines cheaply with possibility to take VotLW and icon of vengeance, or marines more expensive but with know no fear and combat squads. When and why would you take cheaper ones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oojamaflip Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Think of it this way, Chaos Marines are survivors. Sometimes, surviving means knowing to say "Screw it, I'm outta here!". Leave the suicidal charges and Pyrrhic victories to the Loyalists. We get to live longer. Or, I like to think of it this way... Chaos Marines KNOW that Hell is real, and they're going there when they die. I'd wanna make sure I live to fight another day too. Loyalist marines know about Chaos, but they're not told the whole truth. That knowledge is reserved for the Inquisition and Grey Knights. Cult Marines are fearless because they're religious fanatics, so aren't complety sane sanyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 It's quite easy to define. Let's talk about spherical horses in vacuum, you're composing roster for 2500 points, and you have both options: marines cheaply with possibility to take VotLW and icon of vengeance, or marines more expensive but with know no fear and combat squads. When and why would you take cheaper ones? when edition would be strongly flyer dominated and one side would get flakk RL and the other one wouldnt . Try to put yourself in to a SW players shoes who may have a better short range shoty list then ours , but can do nothing with necron flyer builds [unless he "modifies" his dice]. chaos realy doesnt have it as bad as some people think . yes we have to play a happy chaos family [we had 5 years to get used to that] , as cool as demons are IG is the better ally etc but untile loyalist start getting new meq dex we have it better [all round] then they have it . For specific stuff[trying to play fluff AL/NL etc] it may look grim , but as much as I loved the 3.5 dex , it is dead and every new chaos dex will be based on the gav dex . Only thing I wish has happened , is for Ward to make our dex. But you cant have it all . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 Fluff wise, I think Kol Saresk point is right on. On the table top, I'm ok with Ld 10 being enough most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Sage Posted October 4, 2012 Share Posted October 4, 2012 It's quite easy to define. Let's talk about spherical horses in vacuum, you're composing roster for 2500 points, and you have both options: marines cheaply with possibility to take VotLW and icon of vengeance, or marines more expensive but with know no fear and combat squads. When and why would you take cheaper ones? Only thing I wish has happened , is for Ward to make our dex. But you cant have it all . I am pretty happy he didn`t. I like armies to have at least some sort of flavour that doesn`t make one want to vomit with revulsion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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