Possible chaos codex replacement

[Crystal Geyser]

Hello,

I was perusing an old copy of the 3rd ed chaos codex and I was wondering - amongst friends, would it still be playable from a competitive standpoint in 6th ed? There are lots of wargear options that don't appear in the current codex or the last one, so I was wondering if I could use that in place of the new 6th ed one for fun with friends. Obviously this wouldn't be okay for official tournament play, but still. I'm just a bit daunted by the $50 price tag attached to the current codex. Thoughts?

[Noctus Cornix]

Ya, its completely broken and out of date but, you can do it among friends, if they let you.

[Warsmith Aznable]

Is it really that broken when put up against Space Wolf and later codices?

[Noctus Cornix]

It is when you can have 7 or 8 squads of bloodletters who have 3+ armour saves or more tanks than you know what to do with And I won't even get started on the old Slaanesh armies. That codex was more broken and retarded than the Space pups could ever dream.

 

My advice, just pay the 50 bucks for the new one, its a way better codex anyway.

 

Then you also won't have to bother with trying to figure out what weapons have what AP and so on.

[Rik Riorik]

Not to mention there might be a fair few cases of the rules not meshing with 6th edition rules. But if the people you play with don't mind then why not? Making your own out of the game is a fine Warhammer tradition.

[Iron Sage]

A bit peculiar that he doesn`t want to play with the brand new one though, when he has played with the Thorpe dex.

[Azekai]

I say go for it- time to break out the Kai guns! :drool:

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

It is when you can have 7 or 8 squads of bloodletters who have 3+ armour saves or more tanks than you know what to do with And I won't even get started on the old Slaanesh armies. That codex was more broken and retarded than the Space pups could ever dream.

 

My advice, just pay the 50 bucks for the new one, its a way better codex anyway.

 

Then you also won't have to bother with trying to figure out what weapons have what AP and so on.

Please explain how it was in any worse even near as bad as Grey knights?

[Noctus Cornix]

First of all, I didn't even bring up the silver boys nor would I want to be reminded of how god awful their codex is.

 

Secondly, if what you're trying to say is 'well the Grey Knight Codex is broken then its alright for us to take a broken codex' then you, sir are some I never want to enjoy my hobby with. Have some dignity.

[Iron Sage]

let`s avoid that horrible Grey Knight codex on our dear chaotic forum, and hope that they won`t come and troll us with their wünder codex of unbalanced nonsense. Let`s not give them any incentives to come and smear their "there is not a single thing in your codex that we cant do cheaper and better, and we have draigo which is god" thing.

 

Also, Noctus, your way too hard on Runepriest. He just had a laughing Grey Knights player in the Sons forum, trolling how they could do everything better, i.e.. so I understand why he wrote that.

 

Then again, I think we should enjoy our new codex and ignore the Ward-mafia.

[Noctus Cornix]

let`s avoid that horrible Grey Knight codex on our dear chaotic forum, and hope that they won`t come and troll us with their wünder codex of unbalanced nonsense. Let`s not give them any incentives to come and smear their "there is not a single thing in your codex that we cant do cheaper and better, and we have draigo which is god" thing.

 

Draigo? meet MURDER BLADE :drool:

 

Murder Blade makes Draigo, and basically any other character into mince meat.

[Iron Sage]

let`s avoid that horrible Grey Knight codex on our dear chaotic forum, and hope that they won`t come and troll us with their wünder codex of unbalanced nonsense. Let`s not give them any incentives to come and smear their "there is not a single thing in your codex that we cant do cheaper and better, and we have draigo which is god" thing.

 

Draigo? meet MURDER BLADE :drool:

 

Murder Blade makes Draigo, and basically any other character into mince meat.

 

The Murder blade should have a short extra rule: "When facing any of Mat Wards codices, the Murder Blade counts as both a Murder Blade and a ranged Rapid Fire weapon with 72" range, Ignores Cover, Strength 8 and AP 1, which does not need line of sight.

[Ifrit446]

let`s avoid that horrible Grey Knight codex on our dear chaotic forum, and hope that they won`t come and troll us with their wünder codex of unbalanced nonsense. Let`s not give them any incentives to come and smear their "there is not a single thing in your codex that we cant do cheaper and better, and we have draigo which is god" thing.

 

Draigo? meet MURDER BLADE :P

 

Murder Blade makes Draigo, and basically any other character into mince meat.

 

The Murder blade should have a short extra rule: "When facing any of Mat Wards codices, the Murder Blade counts as both a Murder Blade and a ranged Rapid Fire weapon with 72" range, Ignores Cover, Strength 8 and AP 1, which does not need line of sight.

 

Give this man a medal, and then PROMOTE HIM TO DAEMONHOOD!!

[Urauloth]

Draigo? meet MURDER BLADE :P

 

Murder Blade makes Draigo, and basically any other character into mince meat.

Well, you still need to get past his 3++ save several times. Even with the murder blade it isn't a sure thing. Drop a few forgefiend plasma templates oh him to soften him up first. ^_^

[Chimerical]

First, 3.5 wasn't broken in the way that GK and SW are with bizarrely under-costed core units.

 

There were 3 builds that got abused:

1) Iron Warriors with spammed under-costed Toughness 5 Obliterators in the Elites slot plus spammed Heavy Support choices. This was the most well-known abuse.

2) Alpha Legion all-infiltrating army, with super-killy lords running in 18" to assault you before you could even move (if the AL player got 1st turn). This was surrounded by a horde of marines sitting 12-18" away from your face. This was secretly the most powerful build, IMO.

3) The so-called 'Siren bomb' build, which involved a Slaanesh sorcerer using their powers to be invisible to the enemy, walk right up to them, then summon a bunch of super-rending daemonettes (rending on hits rather than wounds) in the enemy's face. This was the most gimmicky list, and veterans should have been able to counter it easily, but it could pwn noobs. It also relied getting the right rolls on a psychic power table (ironically akin to how powers are beginning to work again).

 

The only problem aside from these builds was that the construction of lists with the marking system was slightly complicated.

 

In the current edition, the rules changes would go a long way to mitigating the codex's power. To illustrate a few major ones:

 

1) Only troops score. The main power of 3.5 was in non-troops choices, and the rules for taking objectives in 4th meant that you could use the minimum two troops without sacrificing your ability to score objectives. This alone seriously limits the level of abuse that would be possible.

2) HQs can be targeted if they're not with a unit. You used to be able to hide your HQs if they weren't attached to a unit and weren't the closest unit to the enemy. Since we had the most killy HQs who could be made very mobile, this was often used to ensure they got into whatever combat they needed to, when they needed to. Having to be attached to a unit to stay safe now means that their mobility would be hampered.

3) Rending is on rolls to wound only. That nerfs the siren bomb build.

4) No assault on player turn 1. Largely nerfs the AL build.

 

IMO, it would still be a more fun codex to use than the new one, just because it has so much flavour and customisation. But believe me, it would not be on the level of GK and SW.

 

I'm getting all sentimental now... I miss my Sonic Dreadnaught and Sonic Terminators :(

 

I'd also love to introduce Storm Shield terminators to my old Daemon Prince with a Dread Axe. Warscythe overlords can only dream about that level of awesomeness.

[AekoldHelbrass]

I played few games with 3.5 recently. You know, you don't need to abuse it every time you play. 3.5 gives you possibility to gear up your lord to be worth living 10 000 years and kick any other character in CC, your chosen can get extremely expensive but they will put to shame sanguinary guard, and you can use veteran skills on your troops to make them better than opponents. You still lack Vindicators, defilers are quite expensive, and undivided sorcerers are quite useless, so I'd say it's not that broken unless you're TRYING to abuse it. It just has another feeling to the game, when you can gear up any champion to kick asses.

[Noctus Cornix]

That's the same answer I can give you when it comes to both the Blood Angels and the Space Wolves Codex. Both codexes, for the most part, are fine. Its when you look deeper and see find those broken options, does your codex become broken, because :cusss are willing to abuse it. The same goes for the 3.5 chaos codex,

[Vesper]

I don't think that's so simple. As Chimerial (a true membrer of the 3.5 brotherhood) pointed out, 3.5 could be abused (Daemon bomb, mainly. The AL ultra pissed list could also be mean), but it wasn't an instant win codex, even with those builds. Because yes, let's say it, some armies, today, don't have the fire power to beat a draigo wing. Some armies don't have the means to counter a flying army of necrons. They just can't freaking do anything. 3.5 on the other hand had some weaknesses (mostly damn costy things)... and of course the n°1 weakness of a 40k codex : it wasn't a no brainer.

 

Back on topic, the mechanics of the codex itself work very well with 6th. Some stuff got to be adapted, some point costs ajusted, yet, it's still quite playable (I used it during 5th).

[Noctus Cornix]

Lol, the 3.5 brotherhood? What, do you guys have little decoder rings now, or something?

[TheDarkApostle]

(mostly damn costy things)...

What, like the 6040 points 20 man Chosen Terminator Champions of Tzeentch squad? <_<

 

EDIT: And no, that is not a typo on the points.

 

TDA

[Brother Ambroz]

Let him do what he wants. If his friends let him play it then go for it. As someone else said, alot of the rules actually do mix well with 6th edition. Really guys how many times are we going to bring up 3.5? I loved it too (and I played TS back then who were considered crappy) and we can always remember the good times but we need to let it rest in peace.

 

Noctus, Draigo would still probably rip the bearer of the murder sword apart because of that 2+/3++, EW and FW.

[Vesper]

(mostly damn costy things)...

What, like the 6040 points 20 man Chosen Terminator Champions of Tzeentch squad? :devil:

 

EDIT: And no, that is not a typo on the points.

 

TDA

 

Forget Paladins :lol:

That's a Deathstar.

[Iron Sage]

Meh, I find this an incredibly dissapointing topic in every possible way.

 

We just got a brand new codex (most people won`t even have it until tomorrow), which even the jeske claims is good (few are more cynical), and some of you choose to discuss the ancient 3.5, and how you want to use that one instead of the new one??? Talk about being an arch romantic :/

 

 

There are no words which can describe how utterly underwhelming and sad I find this topic. Seriously??? There is a new and shiny codex and your harping endless on about 3.5??? Its borderline pathetic :(

 

Makes no sense and its all just very, very sad.

 

Can`t you guys at least play a few games with the new codex before you go back to 3.5? Many of you played with the thorpe dex, so why this topic then?

[Iron Sage]

Hello,

I was perusing an old copy of the 3rd ed chaos codex and I was wondering - amongst friends, would it still be playable from a competitive standpoint in 6th ed? There are lots of wargear options that don't appear in the current codex or the last one, so I was wondering if I could use that in place of the new 6th ed one for fun with friends. Obviously this wouldn't be okay for official tournament play, but still. I'm just a bit daunted by the $50 price tag attached to the current codex. Thoughts?

 

Sorry, didn`t notice that you created this topic mostly because of the price of the new dex. I wouldn`t have called your topic borderline pathetic if I noticed that.

 

Get a scan, and then buy it when you can afford it imo.

[AekoldHelbrass]

There are no words which can describe how utterly underwhelming and sad I find this topic. Seriously??? There is a new and shiny codex and your harping endless on about 3.5??? Its borderline pathetic :D

 

Somehow I was under impression that people play 40k to have fun. And CSM 3.5 is fun, that doesn't mean you have to play it instead everything else, it's just changing of paradigm using the same models. Personally for me all 4-5 edition power armoured armies have the same idea - when you're composing roster you're using the same template, the same steps. While new codex changes that, instead of "3 for 1 slot of elite" it's oriented to use double FOC, some others things to consider. And so does 3.5. It's like learning new language from another family of languages, it's interesting because you have to think differently to use it.