Pre-Heresy Blood Angels Markings

[the color purple]

Hey, with the release of Betrayal I'm finally embarking on a pre-heresy army. I find the focused heresy story much more interesting than the vast, vague 41st millenium, all things considered.

 

I've decided to do the Blood Angels, who I always end up coming back to when I foray into other varieties of power armor. I'm currently reading Fear to Tread, but it doesn't describe their looks in detail besides the obvious bits like "red and gold", so I've got some questions about how much we know. I don't want my guys to look totally out of place when BA get their own featured HH book. Anyone with input would be welcome, whether sourced or conjecture.

 

1. Would the legion badge be worn on the left shoulder or would it vary?

2. Squad/company markings: is anything said about what or where these would be? Would different companies have different paint schemes, like perhaps Amit's "Flesh Tearers" incorporating black like the chapter eventually would?

3. Helmets: painted blue/gold/yellow for squad type or all red?

4. Gold armor in general: reserved for sanguinary guard or could captains/veterans wear some? And again, gold or red helms for vets?

5. Armor, how mixed should it be? I was thinking of doing about 33% MkIV squads, since I figure it would be distributed by squad and not on an individual basis, and a mix of II and V on the rest, with some III and a tiny bit of VI. Some foot CC-type squads where it makes sense would have mostly III, and some sergeants and the like might get IV while the rest of the squad doesn't.

[TennisBall]

I don't think Forge World are interested in that sort of detail. The heresy marines they've done so far have next to no unit markings on them. I suspect you'll be able to get away with making your own up. The problem you may have is when the Blood Angels are done, there may be a legion structure that contradicts the unit names and numbers you've assigned to yours.

From what has been shown so far, they've even done alternative paint schemes for legions like Death Guard.

 

Maybe for the loyalists, the chapter symbols of the successor chapters were specific Legion markings. Maybe Amit's marines had black helmets.

 

Legion icon goes on the left pad just like the chapter icon. I think this only changes when the left pad is studded or otherwise covered in something that prevents the icon from being placed there.

[ulllyssies0110]

I would asume that Blood Angles markings and helemt color is from the Great Crusade. Do to the fact that most of the first founding chapters didn't chang there look that much after the heresy. As for gold armor all my Blood Angles Captains are in gold armor with Honor Gaurd having gold helms. Sargent should be in red with black shoulders. I also paint my Vets shoulder trim black to show there status. Third ed codex Blood Angles had Chapter symbol left shoulder pad, Unit symbol w/ company color right shoulder pad, Squad markings right knee, Army marking right grieve below the knee. But we won't know for shure till FW does the Blood Angles book.

[Nova_Dew]

I would assume that Blood Angles markings and helmet color is from the Great Crusade. Do to the fact that most of the first founding chapters didn't change there look that much after the heresy. As for gold armor all my Blood Angles Captains are in gold armor with Honor Guard having gold helms. Sargent should be in red with black shoulders. I also paint my Vets shoulder trim black to show there status. Third ed codex Blood Angles had Chapter symbol left shoulder pad, Unit symbol w/ company color right shoulder pad, Squad markings right knee, Army marking right grieve below the knee. But we won't know for sure till FW does the Blood Angles book.

 

 

The Blood Angles are noted as one of the first to adopt Codex organization as well as it been noted that Gold was reserved for the Sanguinary Guard and Sanguinius within the Legion.

 

As for unit markings unless GW has changes the Codex Asrtartes fluff Chapters change their markings every so often to confuse the enermy so what we see now as 41M..... unit markings could have been differant from when Dante was a scout and it could have been him who changed it to what it is now

[ulllyssies0110]

I would assume that Blood Angles markings and helmet color is from the Great Crusade. Do to the fact that most of the first founding chapters didn't change there look that much after the heresy. As for gold armor all my Blood Angles Captains are in gold armor with Honor Guard having gold helms. Sargent should be in red with black shoulders. I also paint my Vets shoulder trim black to show there status. Third ed codex Blood Angles had Chapter symbol left shoulder pad, Unit symbol w/ company color right shoulder pad, Squad markings right knee, Army marking right grieve below the knee. But we won't know for sure till FW does the Blood Angles book.

 

 

The Blood Angles are noted as one of the first to adopt Codex organization as well as it been noted that Gold was reserved for the Sanguinary Guard and Sanguinius within the Legion.

 

As for unit markings unless GW has changes the Codex Asrtartes fluff Chapters change their markings every so often to confuse the enermy so what we see now as 41M..... unit markings could have been differant from when Dante was a scout and it could have been him who changed it to what it is now

 

This is from the Codex: Blood Angles page 8 talking about the breaking of the legoin in to chapters. The Blood Angles themselves, who maintain the old legion's heraldry and traditions. Also so having units with diffrent color helm would be an easy whay to identify them if say you were flying.

[Nova_Dew]

I think the heraldry refers to the Legion Insignia and Armour colour more than squad markings but that's me... guess we have to wait for FW but we do know their Armour was quite bland compared to other Legions and that Gold was reserved for Sanguinus and the Sanguinary Guard

[the color purple]

Fear to Tread generally refers to "a sea of red" when talking about groups of them, which implies that everyone's wearing red helmets.

 

Is the blandness referring to decoration or to color? I was planning on using a few plastic DC bits, like the MkIV helmet, some pads and weapons. Would those be too ostentatious?

[Nova_Dew]

The blandness is referenced in one of the shorts that links 40K to HH and i cant remember the name of it

[Bat33.1]

Index Astartes shows Heresy era BA as chapter symbol on left, tactical arrow in yellow on right, and plain red armour but it is a MKVI beakie in the illustration. That said much of the IA books illustrations are somewhat different to today's version of HH armour.

[Nova_Dew]

Seeing as Bl has changed when the armour marks came into being and were mass produced.. (MKIV being warn by every marine and their mother and MKVI being sent to the Raven Guard way before the heresy comes to an end) who knows we may see the RT era markings come back I for one would welcome some of it like the Apothecary white/red

 

Seeing as Bl has changed when the armour marks came into being and were mass produced.. (MKIV being warn by every marine and their mother and MKVI being sent to the Raven Guard way before the heresy comes to an end) who knows we may see the RT era markings come back I for one would welcome some of it like the Apothecary white/red

[Blindhamster]

The blandness is referenced in one of the shorts that links 40K to HH and i cant remember the name of it

 

mind finding which one? I thought I'd read em all and don't remember that being mentioned, but it's quite likely I simply missed it ;)

[Nova_Dew]

Bloodline by james swallow

[Blindhamster]

He saw more clearly now: the other Blood Angel wore the white and the crimson of an Apothecary, although the company colours and unit symbology were strange – not wrong, but somehow unfamiliar. The warrior’s wargear was of an elderly design, the old Mark IV Maximus pattern that few Chapters still deployed.

 

And other things were subtly amiss: the other warrior’s wargear was ornate and oddly proportioned, chased with much detailing, and tapers of parchment dense with lines of text that Meros could not read.

 

for the strictures of the IX Legiones Astartes forbade any but the primarch himself and his personal guard from donning such armour.

 

I just reread the short story, these are the only notes on armour I could find, nothing says that the armour of the legion was 'bland', just that the modern armour is more ornate, theres also implication that they didn't tend toward wearing the parchment stuff till later. Oh and no Gold apparently.

[mysteriousmaskedmystery]

i think that's true of most legions though in some ways, the armor was more functional, and less a work of art that is hundreds or even thousands of years old as it is in the current time line. back then a marine could actually expect to have his armor scrapped and replaced, or field repaired without being hounded for tech-heresy. they were even creating new marks of armor back then, so why would a suit have that much effort put into it when it was probably going to be replaced eventually?

[Blindhamster]

mk8 is a 'new' mark, which shows they are still very slowly creating new tech as well as finding lost tech. but yeah, you sum up my view of it, the armour of a legion marine would likely be less ornate, but I'd still expect them to have some chapter trappings on them. whereas technically a chapter marine should have filigree and murals on their armour, essentially I'd expect what the BA kit comes with to not be totally out of place on a legion marine, where really a 40k marine should require an extremely detailed paint job... there were some BA marines on CMON that had little swirly designs all over the armour and boltgun, as well as extra detail both sculpted and painted - thats a 40k marine IMO.

[Arachnid99]

Though of course the most baroque and ornate sets of armour the 40k Chapters have are those that date back to the Heresy era, though that's because they have been decorated and "improved" over the millenia. It would be quite funny if a 30k era Legionary walked into a 40k Reclusiam and saw some massively ornate piece of armour labelled "Armour of Marine _____, worn at the Battle of Terra" and he did a massive double take and went I'm Marine ______ and my armour looks nothing like that.