Milez Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 pg 101 on CSM dex, lists the heldrake as a vehicle. Exactly! Now look on page 123 of the rule book for the description of Denial Units. all units (including troops) are denial units, save for a few exceptions given below: If it is a vehicle, Vehicles are not denial units. son of a b.......my apologizes.....looks like i cheated my roommate on that rule then...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killax Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 This codex is good because it's a chaos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt_Reaper Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 I'll just list things I love about the new codex...easier that way: 1) Stronger Daemon Princes 2) Cheaper HQ's 3) More HQ choices 4) I don't feel obligated to include any unit 5) My army wasn't made obsolete or underpowered :) 6) I don't need to sacrifice fluff for playability Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pariah Mk.231 Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 I think I'll be stronger than the last codex which is good. I also hope they put out a FAQ to fix some of the confusion about certain things ( zombie rules, terminator equipment, why the demon axe grants rage). I really want to make a zombie/deathguard force to fight along side my Pyre force! LOL!!! I hadn't picked up on that double Rage bit, maybe it's meant to be Rampage? A Demon Prince of Khorn doesn't have rage, but with the axe he goes to 7 WS8 Str7 attacks on the charge... :P Well, wouldn't you know it, my prince is armed with a massive axe. :lol: Since Tzeentch princes no longer get a 4++, and he must have a mark I guess he'll join everything but my lord and termies when they do a mess conversion to Khorne worship. Lord and termies will be going Tzeentch for the lovely 4++, while the lord will have a whopping 2+/3++, powerfist and lightning claw so he can kill power armoured axe/fist wielders before they strike, deflect most Init2+ strikes and most likely inflict mutual destruction on other termy/fist characters. All up, a more versatile hammer/shield termy captain, that hates that same captain and gets an extra attack from two specialist weapons. Sure, he's expensive, but at least he's not offing himself with his daemon weapon anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Just be aware that until the FAQ is released, khornate daemon princes technically can't take that axe, since it requires the Mark of Khorne, and daemon princes don't get "marks", they get "daemon of". It's petty, and I'm sure it will be fixed, but if you're playing in a rigid rules environment you should be aware of the distinction that currently exists there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfbiter Posted October 9, 2012 Share Posted October 9, 2012 Something else I like about the new Codex: The 6E Chaos Army feels to me, thematically, a lot like a debased version of the army structure portrayed in the Horus Heresy novels during the Great Crusade. You've got non-Codex Marine forces for the Astartes contingent, Cultists can be kitted out like a remnant of Imperial Guard forces, while Maulerfiends and Forgefiends are reminiscent of small Titans/Legio Cybernetica detachments. I know Fiends really aren't Titan-scale, but when I first saw a Forgefiend, my first thought was that it looked like the old 1990s baroque Warhound Titan minis for Epic. You know, the ones with curved backs, armor with scrollwork, two big gun arms and giant wolf's heads? I like that the new book feels signifcantly different in forces than the Codex Marines book (though admittedly with 6E, Loyalists could take Imperial Guard allies. But we still get big monster mechano-demons and they don't. Nyaah to you, loyalists. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slayer le Boucher Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 Something else I like about the new Codex: The 6E Chaos Army feels to me, thematically, a lot like a debased version of the army structure portrayed in the Horus Heresy novels during the Great Crusade. You've got non-Codex Marine forces for the Astartes contingent, Cultists can be kitted out like a remnant of Imperial Guard forces, while Maulerfiends and Forgefiends are reminiscent of small Titans/Legio Cybernetica detachments. I know Fiends really aren't Titan-scale, but when I first saw a Forgefiend, my first thought was that it looked like the old 1990s baroque Warhound Titan minis for Epic. You know, the ones with curved backs, armor with scrollwork, two big gun arms and giant wolf's heads? I like that the new book feels signifcantly different in forces than the Codex Marines book (though admittedly with 6E, Loyalists could take Imperial Guard allies. But we still get big monster mechano-demons and they don't. Nyaah to you, loyalists. :) They are called Armorcast Warhounds, and the range is from the 89 to 92 year span. http://www.coolminiornot.com/pics/pics6/img4084128389ee8.jpg And yes, i also though about armorcast titans when seeing the Forgefiend for the first time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Asvaldir Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 Props to the person who started this thread, it's nice to see people focusing on the good things the new codex has brought for once rather than hearing more whinining a complaining about GW did this and that and they are terrible game designers. I like a lot of things about the codex. First would be cultists...nice that chaos now has a cheap infantry unit and they make sense fluff wise. New deamon engines look pretty sweet, and it's nice to have a warpsmith. Overall the best thing is that you can't really say anymore "CSM are space marines with spikes!" With all teh deamon engines, cultists, chaos artifacts and such, it's really a much distinct army now and much more chaos like. Thank you to GW for that change! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 Everything makes me happy... until I add up the points cost for it :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Dakath Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 Alright, so yes this is copy and pasted from my post in the disappointment thread but I'll post it again here: Here are things I'm terribly happy about: 1: Daemonic Possession on vehicles randomly eating people and restoring Hull Points. Very fluffly and characterful IMO. 2: Dark Apostles (Even though they didn't come as I would have preferred them I do like them.) 3: Cultists! Finally some cannon fodder for my marines to be behind, again very characterful. 4: Sigil of Corruption, finally an Iron Halo equivalent, no more giving HQs Mark of Tzeentch to get them a better save. 5: Possessed's Daemonkin table. It's still random but at least there's no "useless" rolls anymore. 6: Marks on Terminators again, finally. 7: The different Icons. They can be dreadfully expensive but I think it adds a cool little bonus if you're willing to buy them. 8: The Gift of Mutation. I can see some people as seeing it as a rather silly upgrade but I like it. 9: The Chaos Boon table. Every since I had picked up a copy of Warriors of Chaos for WHFB, I never understood why something like that was never in 40k. Now I have it, and I do like the randomness especially since the model could end up as a Spawn or a Daemon Prince! 10: Obliterators having to switch off weapons. I love this. It adds to the chaotic feel of them. I never really liked how people would only use them for one weapon the whole game. Personal style issue only. 11: Chain axes. This is going to be in both lists, but it's up in the likes due to the AP 4. I never really liked how a guardsman had a chance of an armor save against a Khorne Berserker. 12: Chaos Spawn. They don't seem to me to be such a stupid list entry anymore. 13: Havoc squad weapons. This could be a moot point but I seem to remember their weapons costs (and their loyalist conterparts) being much higher. Like half again as many points for a lascannon. 14: The Forge/Maulerfiends. I like the fact we actually have demon engines now. I might never use them but I like them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskie Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 I still need to read the book in it's entirety and play some games, but I'm happy overall. There were a few surprises like the Dimensional Key, I immediately made plans to use it. Plaguemarines in small squads seem to be cheaper. Champs are effectively free as they are included in the cost of most every squad. I like having my squads led by an individual for narrative and role playing purposes. Most of my models are still legal, the Blastmarker Billy build remains decorative and I don't have many plans for "Hellbrutes" though I'll probably paint another one or two. Defilers and the other walkers seem more valid. Both Havocs and Predators are cheaper so ultimately I see myself painting more in my 'goal' army. I think all four gods have goodies that make them appealing and hopefully more variety of Chaos forces will result. Nurgle is still tough and capable in both H2H and in shooting at 18" or so. Khorne will let people roll a pile of dice on the charge. Slaneesh has a steed that outflanks, noisemarines that are shootier and I think higher Initiative has always been underrated as a boost. Tzeentch has perhaps the best special character due to Arhiman's Warlord Trait, they are clearly the spell casting god, and folks who enjoy the magic phase will include or just fancy their luck in rolling unmodified saves have someone to worship. Chaos Undivided is also viable and mixing and maxing will be popular I don't know what the optimal build is and neither does anyone else so experimentation will become the norm rather than the_jeske assuring everyone that they are fools for not using the obviously optimal list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aothaine Posted October 10, 2012 Author Share Posted October 10, 2012 Props to the person who started this thread, it's nice to see people focusing on the good things the new codex has brought for once rather than hearing more whinining a complaining about GW did this and that and they are terrible game designers. You're welcome! ^_^ I think people are still getting used to all the new toys. I am sure in a few weeks more people will start to understand just out varied, themed and FUN out new codex can be. For instance, I'm making my Iron Warriors finally. :wacko: Warpsmiths :lol: Dark Apostles! At the same time I'm working on my Fallen Angel army. No, not an army of Fallen Angels, just one Fallen Angel. A Dark Apostle with a whole hell of a lot of Cultists, possessed Vindis/preadators and a few of our new vehicles. I honestly think it will do well. Just have to nurgle up the cultists so they can take a charge and then cover the field with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khestra the Unbeheld Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 I received the Codex today and have given it a once-over, and so far I'm liking quite a few things about it. Enough that I went out and scored a 5-man box of Warp Talons on the fly shortly thereafter to run alongside my 10 Raptors. I'll trickle the monsters into the collection over time, because I want Helldrakes (I wonder how one sizes up compared to a LotR Fell Beast). I'm gratified to see that Khârn is back to striking at his I and not at I1. I'm seeing a potential new lease on life for my neglected Havocs. DPs kind of took a hit in the cost and benefits department, but gained some statline boosts that are pretty welcome so they're not completely eclipsed by Lords, who seem to have made out like bandits. I'm liking seeing a resurgence of the Armory, I think that was one of the things I most missed from 3.5. I'm also going to have to see about finally getting a Warsmith for my Iron Warriors auxilia as well as converting a Dark Apostle. Then I can start seriously list-experimenting. Lot of missed potential, but I think I can work with this. I think I can work with this greatly. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plaguecaster Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 I was a bit negative of the new codex but after I played a game with it against dark angels I love it mostly for a few things 1. Plague marines have plague knives and can get VOTLW pretty good as one of my squads of 7 plague marines wiped out an entire squad of terminators with storm shields and thunder hammers without losing a single guy with my champ with poweraxe killing the sarge in a challenge gaining an extra wound on the chaos boon chart 2 new wargear, love the new stuff we can give our hqs especially sigil of corruption, gift of mutation palanquin of Nurgle, spell familiar and the Murder sword 3. Chaos sorcerers are epic I fully kited out mine with all the wargear above, MON and mastery level 3 whilst 250pts he did pretty well gained eternal warrior with the gift of mutation and wiped out a command squad slaying that dark angel Librarian special character with the sword turning into the daemon prince There are plenty of other good stuff like defilers, typhus (as long as he doesn't get massacred by mass plasma which happened in my game failing to get anywhere near Azrael with a few tactical squads), hellbrutes and Havocs with flakk missiles If anything we probably have the best and funniest codex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanguinius Chosen Wing Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 Im surprised at how much I missed the old item table. To be fair the fact that they made a viable codex that is half decent and interesting makes up for all the flaws really. Sure there are things I would personally change but with chaos you could ask thirty different people to tell you about chaos and what should be in and end up with thirty different answers so the fact that there are so many different bits that people are enjoying is very impressive and another good job to Kelly. The release as a whole however was just bad not the codex and I think that is where a lot of complaint is coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lokkorex Posted October 10, 2012 Share Posted October 10, 2012 codex is a disappointment, but i love the new models! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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