What's the problem with the Thousand Sons?

[Lucien Eilam]

It's the Aspiring Sorcerer that for only 2 points less than the HQ version... is apalling.

 

37 points less. The Aspiring Sorcerer has Veteran of the Long War, Mark of Tzeentch and Aura of Dark Glory. It's not fair to compare that with a basic Sorcerer with no upgrades. Inferno Bolts and Fearless would probably cost more than grenades too.

[Daedalus81]

New to the forum and I would like to weigh in.

 

Doombolt :

As good and better than the old Doombolt. Also almost as good as the old Bolt of Change minus 6".

 

The old Doombolt was assault 3 and required rolling to hit. So, 2 hits at S5, 1.33 wounds on T4. The new spell as a beam auto-hits. Being able to draw across at least 2 T4 models gives 1.66 wounds. If you're close enough to hit 5 models then it can put out 3.6 wounds against even terminators.

 

Boon :

Tzeentch hates Nurgle, right? Get a naked Nurgle termie lord as a "torture subject". He has a 5.5% chance to take a wound. One in power armor is an 11% chance. If you want strict tzeentch then use a termie champ or lord - 8.3% chance.

 

In the case of champs the spawn and the dp are almost always better. Anything but the 'no result' rolls are just gravy. If you get the spell and don't have anyone to use it on then use it on your sorcerer. Why not? Its a 1/6 to die with potentially big benefits. Otherwise he won't be casting anything and the unit doesn't suffer without him - still LD10 - still normal move.

 

Breath :

Same as wind - not much else to say. Decent and usable especially with a sorcerer on a disc.

 

Firestorm :

Anti-horde help. Can glance AV13 (if you're desperate). Can ID T3 models. Inferno stacks with soulfire. Not amazing, but reasonable against most other primaris powers.

 

Thousand Sons :

Focus fire is the best friend of Thousand Sons. If you have a squad of 9 at long range (8 shots) and they have at least 3 models out of cover then focus them.

The average out of cover kills is 2.66. In cover its 1.77.

 

Thousand Sons are now CQC. Infiltrate them - Ahriman has the trait - its like they are prodding us to do it. Get them as close as possible, rapid fire, and charge - because now they can. The closer you are the better Doombolt is as well. Use cultists to block charges to you and let them flee to give you the next turn rapid fire and charge. Sorc champs are 4 attacks on the charge.

 

 

All that said you can't make an army with just Thousand Sons, but you can make a really strong list with a couple squads of them as the core and keep your Tzeentch theme.

[Emperors Immortals]

New to the forum and I would like to weigh in.

 

Doombolt :

As good and better than the old Doombolt. Also almost as good as the old Bolt of Change minus 6".

 

The old Doombolt was assault 3 and required rolling to hit. So, 2 hits at S5, 1.33 wounds on T4. The new spell as a beam auto-hits. Being able to draw across at least 2 T4 models gives 1.66 wounds. If you're close enough to hit 5 models then it can put out 3.6 wounds against even terminators.

 

Boon :

Tzeentch hates Nurgle, right? Get a naked Nurgle termie lord as a "torture subject". He has a 5.5% chance to take a wound. One in power armor is an 11% chance. If you want strict tzeentch then use a termie champ or lord - 8.3% chance.

 

In the case of champs the spawn and the dp are almost always better. Anything but the 'no result' rolls are just gravy. If you get the spell and don't have anyone to use it on then use it on your sorcerer. Why not? Its a 1/6 to die with potentially big benefits. Otherwise he won't be casting anything and the unit doesn't suffer without him - still LD10 - still normal move.

 

Breath :

Same as wind - not much else to say. Decent and usable especially with a sorcerer on a disc.

 

Firestorm :

Anti-horde help. Can glance AV13 (if you're desperate). Can ID T3 models. Inferno stacks with soulfire. Not amazing, but reasonable against most other primaris powers.

 

Thousand Sons :

Focus fire is the best friend of Thousand Sons. If you have a squad of 9 at long range (8 shots) and they have at least 3 models out of cover then focus them.

The average out of cover kills is 2.66. In cover its 1.77.

 

Thousand Sons are now CQC. Infiltrate them - Ahriman has the trait - its like they are prodding us to do it. Get them as close as possible, rapid fire, and charge - because now they can. The closer you are the better Doombolt is as well. Use cultists to block charges to you and let them flee to give you the next turn rapid fire and charge. Sorc champs are 4 attacks on the charge.

 

 

All that said you can't make an army with just Thousand Sons, but you can make a really strong list with a couple squads of them as the core and keep your Tzeentch theme.

 

 

Some really interesting points here, especially the infiltrate/rapid fire/cqc idea with cultist screen - can any of the 1k experts weigh in here? I think ill run this unit next game :D

[*Furyou Miko]

Dunno about the Cultists screen, but infiltrating Doombolting Thousand Son squads are ace.