Rizara Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Hey guys. I am working on building up my army and I have always loved the look of the axes on marines, and spacewolves tend to get alot of them, but with the new rule changes, I am wondering are they now worth taking. My main concern is I that i was ordering parts for my Battle Leader before I got my hands on the rule book today, and now I am not sure I want to give him the cool looking double bladed axe. His load out orginially was going to be a frost axe and storm shield, and before it was just a +1 str power weapon, which gave him that added punch in combat without slowing him down, now with the changes it makes me wonder if I should just go with a thunderhammer instead. I plan to have him in a unit of grey hunters with wolf guard leader, that has a fist from the hunters, frostblade from the leader, and then the frost axe, but since his initiative is last anyways, it almost feels like I should go with a thunderhammer instead to get the concussive bonus. Is it me or did the cool axes that spacewolves were known for toting around get hit. Sure we get a better str bonus, and we can go thru armor, but to swing back at the same speed as fist or thunderhammer seems like a waste. I would have rathered just taken a -1 initive instead to strike slower, not last. It also means all the cool axes I wanted on my termies are gonna get replaced as well. Since I am doing that does that mean I can choose to give them a power maul in place of a power sword for the power weapons? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mullinstron Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 I am having the same problem with frost axes since they are the same points cost as a power fist. I keep looking at it going I get 1 less attack with a power fist for the same cost but its going to ID a lot more people and wound on 2. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3213073 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reichfaust Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 As someone who had a *lot* of axes modelled onto his Space Wolves, I was pretty pissed with the whole Power Axe situation, because I would always rather take a Power Fist or Thunder Hammer. My inelegant solution is just to make sure to tell my opponent that all the axes in my army are counts-as Frost Blades. If I ever find myself lacking in High-Str, AP2 CC weapons I'll just take more Fists and Hammers. I refuse to compromise a look that I've loved over the years just because of new rules! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3213121 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafdan Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 They're totaly worth it when they come for free on our TDA, depending on how you model them. 2+,5++ and AP2 with a strenght bonus, thats a pretty sweet deal. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3213401 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SamaNagol Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Power Weapons are free on TDA, not a Frost Weapon Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3213406 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hafdan Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Power Weapons are free on TDA, not a Frost Weapon Right, woops. Note to self: read titles thoroughly before posting. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3213421 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Well, Poweraxes are great on Grey Hunters- cant be challenged out, more attacks, good stats.... Frost Axes though are WG only, wich changes things. I love me a good axe, but rules wise its harder to justify. Especially with a price difference of five points. On a PA WG the extra attack can make all the difference- especially if youre keeping the AP2 weapons otherwise to a minimum in the squad and leaving standard PWs etc on your TDA members. For HQs? Id never even consider it, sadly. If I was making a melee badass itd be a Wolf Claw and Powerfist- all the attacks, all the versatility, and a good looking model. If the rules ever change, then the one fist is just the clas retracted. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3214751 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wispy Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Nothing makes me angrier about 6th Edition than the axe rules. Way to make them an uncompelling Wolf Lord weapons by away their initiative. I know you're reading this, Phil Kelly. Make them cool again! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3214756 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Yeah Frost Axes are pretty pointless when consider other options, though you don't have to throw away any axe wielding loonies as you still get power axes for the same price as normal power weapons. Sure they strike last but they are generally significantly cheaper than power fists, plus you get the extra attack on the model if you want the option. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215256 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadir Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Yeah, and if you realy need that +2 Str., and don't need low AP wapon you can always take power maul. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215347 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belfast Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Nothing makes me angrier about 6th Edition than the axe rules. Way to make them an uncompelling Wolf Lord weapons by away their initiative. I know you're reading this, Phil Kelly. Make them cool again! Yup, SW's are in a tough spot atm when it comes to cc since the only way to get AP 2 is attacking at initiative 1. Honestly, I think power axes should've been +1 str, -1 initiative and changing frost axes to +2 str, -1 initiatve, at least for independant characters to give them a better chance in challenges. Even with a 2+3++ i find myself losing my warlord in the first round very often and I still have trouble justifying the points for eternal warrior. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215355 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rizara Posted October 21, 2012 Author Share Posted October 21, 2012 Totally Agree with you their belfast, axes should have a trade off. they should hit harder, as it makes sense that they wouldn't be as wieldy as a sword or a mace, but reducing them down to same iniative as a fist was a bit much. Even just simply reducing your initiative in half would have been suffice. I can see arguements for the wolf guard in TDA, as its not a bad tradeoff to take an axe as a pw, since its free, but as a frost weapon, might as well go for a fist on terminators. For PA WG, if you are going with a pistol you still get that bonus attack which is still nice to have at times. I was just looking forward to converting a character to look bad@$$ with the cool double bladed axe from the thunderwolves box set and a storm shield on foot to pack some extra punch in a grey hunter unit, but then I got the rulebook and was like...man that sucks, might as well just go for a thunderhammer instead or fist if I am going to be going last. Already wont have the extra attack, but that axe just looks so cool. It almost makes me want to smack the guy who came up with the nerf cause it puts a huge damper on characters looking cool while taking something that isn't as awesome ruleswise. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215477 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted October 21, 2012 Share Posted October 21, 2012 Nothing makes me angrier about 6th Edition than the axe rules. Way to make them an uncompelling Wolf Lord weapons by away their initiative. I know you're reading this, Phil Kelly. Make them cool again! Yup, SW's are in a tough spot atm when it comes to cc since the only way to get AP 2 is attacking at initiative 1. But that is how it is for almost all units in all of the 40k armies. 6e has forced a trade-off - sure you can carry an AP2 weapon, but you're going to have to sacrifice your Initiative for it. This design tenet forces everyone to make a choice, and it isn't always easy or clear. That's good design. When there is nothing but advantages, then choices become no-brainers. 5e was filled with no-brainers, but 6e not so much. That being said, Power Axes are great on regular Joe-Hunter, because he keeps the extra attack, gets the extra point of Strength, and doesn't care about the loss of Initiative, because he can't really be singled out. Frost Axes, however, can only be selected by Characters, and Characters can be singled out. Frost Axes also cost too much, and don't compare well to the other I-1 weapons (like Power Fists, Chainfists, and Thunderhammers), which cost about the same, but double the Strength instead of just added +2. So, Frost Axes aren't generally worth it now, which means you might want to reconsider what you've armed your Heroes with. Valerian Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215479 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I think Frost axes should be +3 strength rather than +2. Possibly superior to a power fist when paired with a pistol/sword. Probably inferior when given to a strength 5 model or somebody without a pistol/sword. It would be a trade-off. Making Frost swords +2 rather than +1 would make them more competitive with lightning claws, too. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215481 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 It might, *might* be worth it to put a frost axe or two in a mixed TDA/PA WG squad. You'd be down 2 strength relative to a power fist, but most likely up 1 attack, assuming that you've stuck with a bolt pistol and your terminators have storm bolters (go from 2 attacks to 3). Against terminators, this would be an improvement. Against vehicles, not so much, but you'd give a chainfist to one of the TDA guys anyway. Of course, if your PA guys have combi weapons or your terminators are CC specialists, this goes out the window. And now that I think about it, you'd probably have done that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215485 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blacksad Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I gave my TWlord a frost axe, cuz it looks cool. then again, runic armour and belt of russ should keep him alive (alongside of eternal warrior) and the plasmapistol makes him a real TDA-killer Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/263717-frost-axes-are-they-worth-it/#findComment-3215653 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.