Jolemai Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 On the thread How do you find Blood Angels in 6th many people are quoting that Hybrid styles are the way forward for this edition. As a Hybrid player myself I can understand their perspective but it amazes me that even our more fluffy builds seem to need to be more hybridised with this edition in order to achieve anything. Example 1 The Dantewing Tactica thread has been bumped lately and the conversation has turned to the use of dealing with hordes. Here they are discussing using Death Company as reply, but coupled with lists already including an Honour Guard (to soften up tanks), Scouts with an Aegis Defense line (to stop flyers/assist with reserve rolls) the question becomes when does this stop being a Dantewing force? Example 2 As close combat has become arguably harder to do following various nerfs and the shooting phase has become a more prominent part of the game, people are beginning to suggest adding things like Tactical Squads and other various things (Scouts + Aegis lines, etc) to Death Company lists. So the question again becomes when does this stop being a Death Company list? What I'm getting at is, are our more fluffy builds to become a thing of the past? Have they become harder to use this edition and require "watering down" in order to remain effective? Has anyone else noticed this or is it just a local thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 "Hybridised" lists have always been more balanced than "pure" forces. Overspecialisation breeds in weakness. Can "pure" forces still win? Yes, but they are certainly stacking the deck in their opponent's favour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I fail to see how 'Dantewing' or pure DC lists are fluffy in any way. ;) Snorri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Maybe "themed" lists is what he meant? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Ah, very well. That sounds much better. :tu: I agree with Deschenus, however. Even though the all Sanguinary Guard list is very tough and DC lists are brutal, they lack long-ranged fire power without an arsenal of Stormravens, Landspeeders, Devastators or Bikes. Snorri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DominicJ Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Why is Dantewing NOT fluffy? Dante is Chapter Master Sanguinary Guard exist to guard the Chapter Master..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted October 22, 2012 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Using the Dantewing example, I've considered my army list Dantewing for years but never played pure SG. Always mixed in RAS, bikes, devs, maybe scouts, maybe Storm Ravens. I think a list can still fit a theme while only being 40-50% that theme and the rest good supporting stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 I fail to see how 'Dantewing' or pure DC lists are fluffy in any way. :P Snorri Maybe "themed" lists is what he meant? Ah, very well. That sounds much better. ;) You are right, themed would have been a better phrase to use. What would you consider fluffy for Blood Angels? This perhaps? ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jolemai Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 "Hybridised" lists have always been more balanced than "pure" forces. Overspecialisation breeds in weakness. Can "pure" forces still win? Yes, but they are certainly stacking the deck in their opponent's favour. Using the Dantewing example, I've considered my army list Dantewing for years but never played pure SG. Always mixed in RAS, bikes, devs, maybe scouts, maybe Storm Ravens. I think a list can still fit a theme while only being 40-50% that theme and the rest good supporting stuff. Always nice to read other opinions :P I would agree that it wouldn't be a stretch to think that a DC/SG list would go to war without a supporting force, but do you feel that more support is necessary these days than previously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnorriSnorrison Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 You are right, themed would have been a better phrase to use. What would you consider fluffy for Blood Angels? This perhaps? :) Yes, in a way. I always thought 'hybrid' builds the closest to the background, as mixed forces are well equipped to deal with any situation on the battlefield. Tacticals in tanks/pods, Assault Squads with JP, some aircraft(new fluff) and some devastators as well. Or, as written in many stories, small squads that can operate quite independently, or scouting forces of speeders, 'Ravens and stuff. You know, the kind of force a wise commander would choose when leaving for a campaign, a good mix of everything. ;) Why is Dantewing NOT fluffy? Dante is Chapter Master Sanguinary Guard exist to guard the Chapter Master..... From what I know, the Sanguinary Guard don't exist to guard the Chapter Master, that is the duty of Honour Guards. I haven't found any pieces of fluff saying that they're guarding the Chapter Master as they guarded the Primarch. There are, however, more examples where the SG did leave Baal and fought without the Chapter Master. Snorri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deschenus Maximus Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Always nice to read other opinions :) I would agree that it wouldn't be a stretch to think that a DC/SG list would go to war without a supporting force, but do you feel that more support is necessary these days than previously? I suppose, in a sense. Allies a brought a whole new level of efficiency to competitive lists, so pure themed forces are even more at a disadvantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesI Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 "Hybridised" lists have always been more balanced than "pure" forces. Overspecialisation breeds in weakness. Can "pure" forces still win? Yes, but they are certainly stacking the deck in their opponent's favour. Using the Dantewing example, I've considered my army list Dantewing for years but never played pure SG. Always mixed in RAS, bikes, devs, maybe scouts, maybe Storm Ravens. I think a list can still fit a theme while only being 40-50% that theme and the rest good supporting stuff. Always nice to read other opinions :) I would agree that it wouldn't be a stretch to think that a DC/SG list would go to war without a supporting force, but do you feel that more support is necessary these days than previously? hmm, more support than in 5th? Not sure. I used my attack bikes then, devs then and RAS to support the SG. I guess I added the storm ravens or Aegis defense line, that is about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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