skeletoro Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Hey, just a quick question. For TDA wolf guard, it seems that the WC+PF combo is exactly the same cost as dual WC. Is that right? Or has there been an errata, or am I counting/reading poorly? I'd been thinking about how I'd equip wolf guard terminators for CC, and had envisaged doing one guy with WC+CF, 1-2 with WC+PF, and the rest with 2xWC. But it seems there's no benefit to 2xWC at all. I know that WC+PF is awesome, but I had assumed that this awesomeness had a points cost associated with it... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reichfaust Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Hey, just a quick question. For TDA wolf guard, it seems that the WC+PF combo is exactly the same cost as dual WC. Is that right? Or has there been an errata, or am I counting/reading poorly? I'd been thinking about how I'd equip wolf guard terminators for CC, and had envisaged doing one guy with WC+CF, 1-2 with WC+PF, and the rest with 2xWC. But it seems there's no benefit to 2xWC at all. I know that WC+PF is awesome, but I had assumed that this awesomeness had a points cost associated with it... I guess the only real "cost" per se is the fact that you can't take something else, such as a combi-weapon (or any ranged weapon for that matter, short of a Cyclone Missile Launcher) or a Storm Shield. The "specialist weapon" rules in 6th are nifty, I quite like it. I now have a "Tyberos the Red Wake" inspired Wolf Lord with a Claw/Chainfist combo--modelled with two Wolf Claws w/Chainsaws in the palms of his gloves. Still in the process of building him, but he looks pretty fantastic so far if I do say so! :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3216727 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iacton Qruze Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 Your reading is correct. The only downside would be that which Reichfaust mentioned, of not having any ranged attack beyond a possible CML, which you've already written off if you were planning twin WC's anyway. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3216747 Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerbeard Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I've been looking at this too. Right now my army is painted up to the 1500 point level, and all my Wolf Guard are leading GH packs. The next step is to start a unit of terminator WG, and this combo, at least for a couple of them, is very interesting. I think it would work well on a Wolf Lord too, as long as you gave him the Belt. bb Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217203 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 My take currently is that if you're doing 5 assault specialist WG in TDA, WC+PF should be the base. But I think it's probably worth paying 5 points to upgrade one to a thunder hammer + WC, and definitely worth it to upgrade one to a CF. So something like: 3x WC+PF 1x WC+TH 1x WC +CF That said, I'm kinda wondering whether it might be worth it to mix 1-2 guys with a SS + PW (either sword or axe). I.e. guys to stand at the front and suck up the hits. What do you think? Also, yeah, PF+WC+belt is pretty mean for a lord, I think. In some ways though, I think a SS+PF or TH might be the better option. Lords have so many attacks already, and with a 2+/3++/2+ LoS!, I'm guessing that you're unlikely to die before your initiative comes up. Although wolf claws are going to kill, say, guardsmen slightly easier than thunder hammers, there's not a lot in it at all, and guardsmen are wimpy anyway. :) On the issue of thunder hammer vs power fist for a lord, I'm leaning towards PF if he's base strength 5 (because you'll kill anything you wound, excepting eternal warrior) but paying the extra 5 points if he's only base strength 4 (because you won't auto-kill toughness 5 enemies, which seem to be a little more common). Anyway, that's my thinking. What do you think? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217416 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadir Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 3x WC+PF1x WC+TH 1x WC +CF Anyway, that's my thinking. What do you think? For my taste, too many points on 1W models. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217433 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iacton Qruze Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I think that for what they do, you'd benefit more from scattering them among GH packs than you would keeping them together. That kind of hitting power and versatility, combined with a wolf banner, will allow the WG to decide most combats. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217442 Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerbeard Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I think that for what they do, you'd benefit more from scattering them among GH packs than you would keeping them together. That kind of hitting power and versatility, combined with a wolf banner, will allow the WG to decide most combats. They just get challenged out. Either by something that can kill them or something that can't. Either way they don't decide the combat for you. I put them in GH packs mostly to take a round or two of shooting if I'm lucky, and to challenge out bigger nasties if at all possible. Because of that I run the pack leaders with TDA and a Power Axe, least amount of points you can spend for a degree of hitting power. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217452 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zagar Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I am abit confused regarding the TH-WC, PF-WC and the CF-WC combos.. Are they able to gain the extra attack from the additional specialist weapon? and are do they get the bonus from both the WC and from the TH/CF/PF? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217480 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 I am abit confused regarding the TH-WC, PF-WC and the CF-WC combos.. Are they able to gain the extra attack from the additional specialist weapon? and are do they get the bonus from both the WC and from the TH/CF/PF? You choose which weapon to use and only get the special rules from that weapon. BUT you get an extra attack (if they're both specialist). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217484 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iacton Qruze Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 I think that for what they do, you'd benefit more from scattering them among GH packs than you would keeping them together. That kind of hitting power and versatility, combined with a wolf banner, will allow the WG to decide most combats. They just get challenged out. Either by something that can kill them or something that can't. Either way they don't decide the combat for you. I put them in GH packs mostly to take a round or two of shooting if I'm lucky, and to challenge out bigger nasties if at all possible. Because of that I run the pack leaders with TDA and a Power Axe, least amount of points you can spend for a degree of hitting power. Challenged out by what? if we're talking an HQ type, you've lost (maybe) one guy instead of several, and potentially done some damage back. If we're talking a marine sgt with a fist, use the Wolf Claw to stomp him at I4, and next round eat the rest of the squad, leaving you open to act on your own turn. If we encounter an HQ that isn't AP2, you most likely will decide the combat, as you're saving on a 2+ with a reroll, and then potentially inflicting instant death. Deciding the combat isn't as cut and dry as purchasing the cheapest WG you can get and hoping he doesn't get challenged At that point, you're better served simply buying the axe for a GH. Plan for the challenge, and then control it. I am abit confused regarding the TH-WC, PF-WC and the CF-WC combos.. Are they able to gain the extra attack from the additional specialist weapon? and are do they get the bonus from both the WC and from the TH/CF/PF? You get the bonus attack, and must choose whether to use the WC or the PF rules in a given round of combat. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217492 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeletoro Posted October 23, 2012 Author Share Posted October 23, 2012 I think that for what they do, you'd benefit more from scattering them among GH packs than you would keeping them together. That kind of hitting power and versatility, combined with a wolf banner, will allow the WG to decide most combats. I'm not that big a fan of putting CC specialists into a shooty squad. I generally put a wolf guard in my grey hunter packs but I would normally go for a combi plasma + power axe. At the moment, I think I might field something like this as my death star unit: 5 TDA 205 2x Heavy flamer + P. Sw. 1x storm bolter + WC 1x storm bolter + PF 1x storm bolter + CF 5 PA 165 3x combi-plas + P. Ax 2x combi-melt + P. Sw. Wolf priest, artificer armour, storm bolter, saga of the hunter. 133 Land Raider Crusader /w multi melta 260 Total: 763. I'd magnetise all models' right arms, so that I can fielding CC specialists rather than a counterassault unit if I feel like it. I'd swap the HF for SS, the storm bolters for WC (TH for the guy who already has a WC), and give the PA guys, including the WP, bolt pistols. This would work out slightly cheaper in points, but I'm not sure it would be as effective, to be honest. And outflanking CC specialists might make for a looong wait before I could assault. I would like to bring the points cost down to about 600-650, though. Also, I'm not sure about the heavy flamers. Also, given that the PA guys don't have relentless, giving them combi-weapons prevents the unit from charging after rapid firing. This might not be my first choice necessarily but it is a pain to lose that option. Perhaps I should just have 7 terminators instead of the mixed armour squad? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264036-wolf-claw-power-fist/#findComment-3217530 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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