Aegnor Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Just starting a (for now) small force of CSM. Will likely be a war band with a core of Black Legion plus some odds and sods. I've got the Dark Vengeance set, and also already had Khârn and five Plague Marines. Today I went and bought a Chaos Space Marine squad box (the 10 marine one). I'm not manic about having a power build - prefer character/fluff and a fun game, but equally I don't want a crappy army. I also am not keen on: Forgefiends (which are ok, just not what I *see* in my CSM band), nor the Heldrake, nor Obliterators. My next purchase will likely be a squad of Raptors, then either some Havocs or a Vindicator. So my question is, does this sound viable as the core of an army? I regularly play a couple of opponents who roll with Imp. Guard (not esp. power-built), or Marines/Dark Angels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve shields Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Just starting a (for now) small force of CSM. Will likely be a war band with a core of Black Legion plus some odds and sods. I've got the Dark Vengeance set, and also already had Khârn and five Plague Marines. Today I went and bought a Chaos Space Marine squad box (the 10 marine one). I'm not manic about having a power build - prefer character/fluff and a fun game, but equally I don't want a crappy army. I also am not keen on: Forgefiends (which are ok, just not what I *see* in my CSM band), nor the Heldrake, nor Obliterators. My next purchase will likely be a squad of Raptors, then either some Havocs or a Vindicator. So my question is, does this sound viable as the core of an army? I regularly play a couple of opponents who roll with Imp. Guard (not esp. power-built), or Marines/Dark Angels. All but one of the tournament lists I've been working on don't use demon engines so i say your pretty good. for Khârn i would say use CSM with MoK and the IoW instead of zerkers. its a bit cheaper and you only lose the 1 WS. Khârn should do enough killing haha. havocs are pretty much amazing now, and its fairly easy to run all foot sloggers. so good luck with your army, and i wouldnt worry about not using those demony things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
totgeboren Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 The only daemon engine that seems to be somewhat worth the points is the Heldrake, so yeah, I expect most competitive new CSM lists to not generally feature daemon engines. Though it must be said that I only own a single Defiler, and have yet to try it out using the new rules. My Pred, Havocs and even Land Raider have been the right tools for the job every battle I have played using the new dex. Though I feel I could do with a flier... maybe a Hellblade.... soo pretty. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted October 27, 2012 Author Share Posted October 27, 2012 That sounds good. Thinking mainly footslogger, plus Raptors and maybe the Vindicator later down the track. Will get some Havocs then as well, when I get the chance. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Honestly, I expect to see far more topics of the reverse, namely can you make a competitive army WITH demon engines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azekai Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Honestly, I expect to see far more topics of the reverse, namely can you make a competitive army WITH demon engines. This. A lot of the new wacky releases are daemon engines, so people want to work them in, but they are just not that survivable, even with saves. Our old daemon engine, the defiler, got a 30% price hike for no reason and now has worse options. Even the heldrake is situational, and only really good at killing MEqs in cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted October 27, 2012 Author Share Posted October 27, 2012 Odd that they've done it that way. Often the big new kits seem to be good value points wise to encourage people to buy them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circus Nurgling Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Odd that they've done it that way. Often the big new kits seem to be good value points wise to encourage people to buy them. Yeah they really shot themselves in the foot there, didn't they. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meeper Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 I was personally thinking about running a multitude of demon engines to help with armor saturation. I like the dragon due to the reach it gives my army and AA ability. I am taking defiler for the 72 inch threat range. I am really deciding between a forgefiend or a autocannon havoc squad. Range and BS vs Str and Immunity to small arms fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve shields Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 i like the heldrake but im not sold on defiler. 200 points for an AV 12 guy is not so good in my books. sometimes he will live forever cause of his rules, but when he dies to a single lascannon thats gonna really hurt. id much rather take preds higher AV and cheaper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 bikes are better then raptors . csm with mark of khorn are better then zerkers . vindicators were bad and got worse because 6th is shotier , they do nothing against flyers , have the same crappy armor they have before and give a free turn of shoting for your opponent[which means they may never get to fire at all]. + blast templates dont work well with short range/assault armies. first chaos buys should always be 50 csm to make csm and havocks , then bikes . sorc/lord as HQ . rest is a taste thing and while it can change[not much] how the army works , it doesnt realy matter for learning how to use csm . In fact not using stuff like DPs or huron/ahriman makes it easier . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted October 28, 2012 Author Share Posted October 28, 2012 Thanks for all the replies. Useful advice there. Jeske - you make some good points, although I'm afraid I'll be getting at least one squad of Raptors, and possibly some Warp Talons, just cause try look that awesome! :devil: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Well it is not like I stop you or anything. Still raptors/talons or not ,one should start with models that make the base of an army . starting with 15 troop models and double that elite/fast/hvy does not make a good list and I dont mean good as in tournament , good as in better to learn and better to find out what you would like [gameplay wise] to have in your army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted October 28, 2012 Author Share Posted October 28, 2012 Yep, point well taken on that. Will be getting another squad of CSM as well in the near future. Although must point out you're ignoring my two mighty squads of Cultists! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agerjag Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Havoks are very solid you might want at least 2 squads, with autocannons. There is alot of daemon-engine hate here, while you certainly dont need them at all, I have found them usefull for their points on many occasion, especially the helldrake which can torch squads all day. Str 8 off the forgefiends instant kills alot of mutliwound models and can put some hurt on armor and MCs as well. Plus 8 shots you can take down fliers as well if needed. BS3 doesnt hurt you then ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffeineated Chaos Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 30 man cultist squad lead by Commisar Khârn! Use him as warlord, they'll get Hatred: Everything, Rage, Furious Charge, and his Leadership, they'll bubble wrap him and on the off hands he does kill a cultist(w/ hatred he'll have to roll 1 then reroll 1, or whatever you're fighting will have to make it to round two.) it didn't cost you much and it's just him keeping the mob in line. Might not be super viable. But seems uber fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanctimonius Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 30 man cultist squad lead by Commisar Khârn! Use him as warlord, they'll get Hatred: Everything, Rage, Furious Charge, and his Leadership, they'll bubble wrap him and on the off hands he does kill a cultist(w/ hatred he'll have to roll 1 then reroll 1, or whatever you're fighting will have to make it to round two.) it didn't cost you much and it's just him keeping the mob in line. Might not be super viable. But seems uber fun. Possibly the most fun unit combination I've heard of so far :wallbash: I'm interested in hearing more from people who have used the daemon engines. What kinds of lists do you run them in? One or two or a full mecha list? And how have they been performing for you? I feel like you need to take at least three or four for saturation but that becomes very expensive quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 30 man cultist squad lead by Commisar Khârn! Use him as warlord, they'll get Hatred: Everything, Rage, Furious Charge, and his Leadership, they'll bubble wrap him and on the off hands he does kill a cultist(w/ hatred he'll have to roll 1 then reroll 1, or whatever you're fighting will have to make it to round two.) it didn't cost you much and it's just him keeping the mob in line. Might not be super viable. But seems uber fun. Am so doing this. And starting every turn with "a lot of people don't understand that Khârn is a great guy!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanctimonius Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Bonus points to anyone who chops off his bunny ears and puts a commissar cap on him instead... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffeineated Chaos Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Bonus points to anyone who chops off his bunny ears and puts a commissar cap on him instead... HE MUST HAVE BOTH!!! CUT THE CAP TO FIT!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aegnor Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 Just bought some more gear in a job lot on eBay. 10-15 CSMs, a unit of Havocs, some Possessed, and a few other odds and sods (some C.Terminators, the jump pack lord model etc). Not hugely excited about the Possessed from a gaming or collecting perspective, but the whole lot altogether cost half what it would new, so I'll deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacefrisian Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 I will be trying double Defiler in some upcomming tourneys, i know they arent great but i like them, besides that with dirgecaster spam iam less concerned about charging into a Melta spamm unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacelizard Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 The funny thing about the new chaos dex is that the best/most competitive stuff in the dex is stuff that has been around forever. Most people tend to agree that most of the new stuff isn't all that spectacular. None of it really sucks (besides warp talons) but it is just that the staples of a 6th edition chaos army are the same units that we have been using for years in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacelizard Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 Thanks for all the replies. Useful advice there. Jeske - you make some good points, although I'm afraid I'll be getting at least one squad of Raptors, and possibly some Warp Talons, just cause try look that awesome! :cuss Raptors are not bad by any means its just that bikes are so good right now. Warp talons on the other hand do suck hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 either your good or your bad. if raptors could do different stuff then bikers [lets say better at melee because of hit and run] then yes they wouldnt be bad. but a unit cant do the same stuff[small anti tank , bodyguard for an HQ , melee] worse then a unit and still be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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