Lagbenektelse Posted October 27, 2012 Share Posted October 27, 2012 Books was fabulous, Toramino is a phallus, and I'm having funny feelings about Perturabo. While I really really enjoyed the depiction I am curious if the portrayal is entirely counter to established fluff or just a more nuanced take. My own interpretation was that Perturabo was, even more than Fulgrim, an artist and that was what poisoned his mind. He spent all his time dreaming of building wonders while actively destroying other peoples things. I like the Imperial Fists because I think combat engineering is a hell of a thing(and that also explains the Iron Warriors love) but I found myself wondering quite often whether or not Perturabo should really have been the one back at Terra working on the Imperial Palace. Anyway starting the thread to hear other's favorite moments. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vaz Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Really good read! Loved seeing all the characters from Storm of Iron, Dead Sky Black Sun, at the start of all this goings on. I really loathe the EC at this point though. Before reading this book I had ideas of doing some squads up because of the rich colors but not sure now! After seeing how far they fall, how they really get the "Chaos" going in things. In the end I actually felt bad for the Iron Warriors. While no pitty party is suggested, Perturabo really gets further betrayed by all those around him. I can see his shame for what happened on his home planet, then his attachment to Horus as having "forgiven" him for this shame. Then he is lead by his brother to his near death. For sure could see IW and EC not being friends after this one. Fulgrim making his transition into demon prince really seals the deal on the book. You see how his legion is now totally gone and done for and can never be saved. I would be interested to further read about the IW fall into chaos, I feel they would wield it as a tool/breaching cannon, but the ultimate corruption is there. Love to hear other people's opinion on this. Has to be my favorite book since The First Heretic Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3221813 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustus Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I was really really impressed with the portrayal of Perturabo. He went from a fairly unknown primarch to one that now has a lot of depth and character. The parts with him in were GREAT. Also with the two characters from Kryptos that make an appearance. Super great! That said I did not like the book all that much. It dragged on to me. Reading about the duo of Fabius and Lucius made me want to bang my head and stop reading. I get that they are important characters, but do they have to deliver a melodramatic and/or cliched line at the end of every scene or chapter? Kroeger.. The parts with him in remind of some 80's teen movie but only its "grim darkness of the future" style. What do I mean? Its like his whole rise to prominence. Its like a a transfer student who befriends the cool/mean girl and has a super rise in popularity. Then Forrix and Falk take it upon themselves to show the "new kid" the ropes. They take him to this super secret cool hangout where...oh snap the coolest kid around shows up (Perturabo) where he engages him in a game. Of course he looses but he shows spunk! And Lucius/Harkor represent the guys that resent his rise to fame and want to see him. And Fabius??Oh God..... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222036 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brannick Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 As an aside, do we know whether Angel Exterminatus will be released in the 'usual' size HH paperback? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222087 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dinks Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 I need to get this book! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222099 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareddm Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 As an aside, do we know whether Angel Exterminatus will be released in the 'usual' size HH paperback? All HH books will be printed in paperback 3 months after the release of the hardcover. Aside from the novellas, which always end up in an anthology years later anyway, none of the hardcover books are exclusive and will definitely get a paperback copy. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222486 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain Posted October 28, 2012 Share Posted October 28, 2012 Haven't finished it yet but so far it's alright. I generally stay away from Graham McNeill, but I couldn't miss out on the Perturabo book so I picked it up. Sure enough he is up to his usual tropes of the antagonists being evil for the sake of evil and engaging in random acts of Saturday morning cartoon idiocy like live fire training drills in which Berossus learns to be a dreadnought by actually killing a bunch of his own men in an exercise. So much for the famed Iron Warriors efficiency. Oh and then there's Fabius. Complete with bouts of evil laughter amid villainous soliloquies. Still, it doesn't seem to be as bad as Fulgrim, or god forbid the Uriel Ventris series but it's nowhere near Know No Fear, The First Heretic, or Legion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222585 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apothecary Vaddon Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I don't recall Berossus killing any of his own men - I remember reading some armor getting split open, and some definite injuries, but no actual casualties. What I have found interesting about the story (about 1/2 way through it right now) is that the Heart of Iron can heal individuals within stasis fields. It's an interesting revelation that may be taken by those who believe that Guilliman is healing within his own stasis field as evidence. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222776 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rain Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I thought it was pretty clear that they were killed, I mean it actually described them having their armor split and blood spattering and and them going down, seems like it was saying he was actually killing them. That whole scene was honestly rather idiotic, it would have made a lot more sense for him to be fighting training servitors. Actually not that you mentioned I checked back and yep, sure seems like he was killing them. Here's a quote They moved with precision, as he would expect, but he swung his rotary autocannon up to kill them nonetheless. The heavy gun chugged out rapid-fire shots, punching three of his warriors from their feet. Blood misted the air as they fell, but the others kept coming Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222813 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lorne Walkier Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I have some questions. Is the "real" fate of Fulgrim spelled out? Who is in the Picture? Are there more then one Daemon fighting for control of Fulgrim's body? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222842 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billuriye Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 A fine read. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3222876 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brannick Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Thanks Jared. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223129 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FallenArtist Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Hmm i wonder if this comfirms that forge worl will make Daemon Primarchs or at least maybe they will make one ;) This is based off that at games day someone said some primarchs would get a corrupt version and what is more corrupt than a daemon primarch! That is my logic at least. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223207 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ubermensch Commander Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I thought it was pretty clear that they were killed, I mean it actually described them having their armor split and blood spattering and and them going down, seems like it was saying he was actually killing them. That whole scene was honestly rather idiotic, it would have made a lot more sense for him to be fighting training servitors. Actually not that you mentioned I checked back and yep, sure seems like he was killing them. Here's a quote They moved with precision, as he would expect, but he swung his rotary autocannon up to kill them nonetheless. The heavy gun chugged out rapid-fire shots, punching three of his warriors from their feet. Blood misted the air as they fell, but the others kept coming Have not read the book but it rather fits in with their portrayal in the Dropsite Massacre in The First Heretic and Mcneil's portrayal of the Iron Warriors in books such as Dead Sky, Black Sun. Callous and uncaring of causalities on their own side. @Vaz Your description actually made me laugh. A traitor being betrayed? Particularly the Iron Warriors? Hilarity. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223223 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apothecary Vaddon Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I thought it was pretty clear that they were killed, I mean it actually described them having their armor split and blood spattering and and them going down, seems like it was saying he was actually killing them. That whole scene was honestly rather idiotic, it would have made a lot more sense for him to be fighting training servitors. Actually not that you mentioned I checked back and yep, sure seems like he was killing them. Here's a quote They moved with precision, as he would expect, but he swung his rotary autocannon up to kill them nonetheless. The heavy gun chugged out rapid-fire shots, punching three of his warriors from their feet. Blood misted the air as they fell, but the others kept coming Missed that first time around. Yeah, pretty callous, weird stuff. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223246 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billuriye Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I have some questions. Is the "real" fate of Fulgrim spelled out? Who is in the Picture? Are there more then one Daemon fighting for control of Fulgrim's body? Fulgrim is Fulgrim but less so. He and daemon reached certain "compromise" so that he could regain control of his body while part of his soul is forever devoured by the daemon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223288 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blindhamster Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I have some questions. Is the "real" fate of Fulgrim spelled out? Who is in the Picture? Are there more then one Daemon fighting for control of Fulgrim's body? Fulgrim is Fulgrim but less so. He and daemon reached certain "compromise" so that he could regain control of his body while part of his soul is forever devoured by the daemon. Doesn't really seem to be how it wax explained in the short story where lucius persuades the various EC captains to take on Fulgrim due to learning that Fulgrim is possessed... in that Fulgrim explains that he let the Daemon use his body whilst he was essentially dealing with things for himself... this is backed up by the conversation between Daemon Fulgrim and Lorgar where Lorgar essentially tells the Daemon to enjoy the body whist it can, as Fulgrim would simply take it back once he was good and ready. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223512 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustus Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Fulgrim is Fulgrim. The Demon took possesion of him but he was able to to reassert control. I think it is because Slanesh itself wanted him as its Champion helped. Also explains why he killed Eidolon. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223826 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratboy1664 Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 How do you turn the spoiler savers off? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3223845 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron-Daemon Forge Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 How do you turn the spoiler savers off? If you mean for reading the post with the spoiler tags, just highlight the part that has been spoiler tag & the post will show up Spolier Just highlight that & you get [spoiler]Spolier[/spoiler] Almost finish reading Angels Exterminatus just that the stage where the Emperor Children started slaughter them selfs out side of that Eldar building/dome, while the Iron Warriors watch on, Forrix gose out to talk to there first captain. IP Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3224163 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Listening to the Audiobook version right now. Really liking that it ties very well into a couple of other stories and novels. Obviously The Crimson Fist, but also Kryptos, The Reflection Crack'd and even McNeill's Storm of Iron and the Iron Warriors' parts in the Ultramarines series. Those who were complaining about Berossus' fate in The Crimson Fist should be satisfied with his treatment in this one, and the whole "who controls Fulgrim" debate can now be put to rest as well. I'm surprised nobody brought up the resurrection of Eidolon yet, though. If only the Dark Angels had a Fabius available to undo the Lion's facepunch-victim's demise.. But what I like the most so far, 8 chapters in, is the way Perturabo is depicted. Suddenly he's interesting and not just the Emperor's step-child who's never gonna live up to dear Rogal's example. Though I admit, the Kroeger's initiation into the Mournival-equivalent of the Iron Warriors really reminded me of Loken, in a way. Not to mention that Fulgrim's theatrics were fantastically described so far - great job, Graham! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3224317 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apothecary Vaddon Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I loved how Sharrowkyn killed Lucius. It was pretty epic. That a Raven Guard got to do it was extra special, and the fact that he was apparently blindingly fast and pulled some serious disappearing acts was even cooler. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3224891 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkChaplain Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Regarding Guilliman's close combat skills... I remember some debates about him: Fulgrim had by now unsheathed his sword and the golden blade drew fresh gasps of astonishment and roars of approval. Fulgrim spun and leapt like a dancer, yet Perturabo saw the fierce skill in his every move, the lethal grace that had made his brother a matchless swordsman, beyond even the technical ability of Guilliman or the enraged purity of Angron. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3225081 Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdT Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Anyone else notice the throwaway line implying that the Chemosian book predicted Robute and Fulgrim's battle? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3225103 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billuriye Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Regarding Guilliman's close combat skills... I remember some debates about him: Fulgrim had by now unsheathed his sword and the golden blade drew fresh gasps of astonishment and roars of approval. Fulgrim spun and leapt like a dancer, yet Perturabo saw the fierce skill in his every move, the lethal grace that had made his brother a matchless swordsman, beyond even the technical ability of Guilliman or the enraged purity of Angron. Well, Perturabo is wrong in this since Angron got WS 9 while Fulgrim got 8. Obviously he doesn't know what he is talking about. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264418-angel-exterminatus/#findComment-3225107 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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