Dallas Drake Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I was sitting in my class today bored while my students coloured in & I was thinking, what can our allies give us that fills a gap. My conclusion was 1) Flamers, 2) Screamers. IMO Screamers give us a very versatile, dangerous unit that can tackle a lot of things out codex struggles with. I'm adding 6 Screamers ASAP to try them out. Anyone else had any thoughts about what to take from C:CD? Dallas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
techsoldaten Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I was sitting in my class today bored while my students coloured in & I was thinking, what can our allies give us that fills a gap. My conclusion was 1) Flamers, 2) Screamers. IMO Screamers give us a very versatile, dangerous unit that can tackle a lot of things out codex struggles with. I'm adding 6 Screamers ASAP to try them out. Anyone else had any thoughts about what to take from C:CD? Dallas I don't have anything to add, but love the thinking. I believe the 6th edition Codex was tailored to encourage this kind of strategy between armies. I am working out how to add an IG force to compliment my CSM army with an eye towards armor. Thinking about Chimeras and Basilisks atm. The hard part is getting the math to add up, it's very tempting to drop CSMs altogether in favor of cultists. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224556 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 For demons, beyond the standard choices I like grinders and great unclean ones. The grinder helps our armor saturation and provides another template. As far as the GUO, I'm a sucker for the cheap price and high durability. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224585 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 IMO demon armies with csm work better then csm armies with demon ally. there is more realy good options that you want to spam in the demon dex , csm is made out of stuff that can be run as single ally unit . be it a bike sorc +bikers + some camper csm or an ax lord slogging it up [on a mount] inside a unit of terminators with cultists being tax to take him . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224596 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilicate Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 IMO demon armies with csm work better then csm armies with demon ally. there is more realy good options that you want to spam in the demon dex , csm is made out of stuff that can be run as single ally unit . be it a bike sorc +bikers + some camper csm or an ax lord slogging it up [on a mount] inside a unit of terminators with cultists being tax to take him . I disagree. When you take the CSM, you have more options, plus you have to buy two relatively crappy Daemon units to fill out troops choices, while with allies you only have to do one. Yeah, it means you can "only" take one screamer or flamer unit, but I've found that one's often all I need. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224603 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I disagree. When you take the CSM, you have more options, plus you have to buy two relatively crappy Daemon units to fill out troops choices, while with allies you only have to do one and get more flamers , more screamers , and 4-5 flying MC instead of 1 . and those "crappy"[horrors are as crapy as IG] demon troops gain a lot in the form of a 12 csm units maning an aegis and camping objectives. there is no such thing as good unit being enough at 1 squad size , unless its an uber deathstar and even then it doesnt work without some special rules buffing the star. a single units of flamers or a single unit of screamers will get countered by a good list or at least contained . 3 wont. not when there are also flying MC in the list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224619 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 30, 2012 Author Share Posted October 30, 2012 I was thinking more CSM with Daemon allies since I'd prefer to play CSM with Daemons rather than Daemons with CSM. I went off my Daemons army quite quickly & most of it found itself onto ebay. When I look at my CSM army list I think about two things (the jeske will remember this from my army list), the first is fast melta (or melta equivalent) & the second is Terminators & dealing with 2+ armour saves. Personally, I feel that these are two areas where, melta bikers aside, CSM fail. Screamers seem perfect to fill this role IMO since they can effectively do both. Dallas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224696 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 what would you rather have 1 fate/thirster 1 lord 12 csm 2 plas 3 melta bikers plasma terminators 3x flamers 2x8 horrors 3xDPs or csm DP lord thirster 3x10-12/14 csm with plasma 2x3 bikers 1xflamers 1xhorrors Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224759 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 Now that fearless is better, I'd be curious about a blob of daemonettes. Could the sheer volume of rending attacks wear down fancy deathstar units Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224773 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hannibal.Lictor Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I am running TZ allies from CD. No real reason that I stayed mono, it was just the units that I liked. Here is what I am running at 2k: LoC FLamersx6 Horrorsx5 Screamersx5 Thats just shy of 600 points and brings alot to the table. With my CSM DP (MoS, wings, PA and Blackmace) I have 2 FMCs on the table. The rest of my CSM list is: The DP CL with MoS dual LCs and steed (2) NMx15 Sonics13 Blaster and Icon Oblits MoN x3 Its alot of threats. People willoften underestimate the destructive power of flamers....once. I am on the fence with the screamers, they do get to the back lines fast though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224792 Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve shields Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 does anybody know where i can find a copy of the new demon rules? i really really want to have options to ally more than just my guard, but my demons are sitting on the shelves waiting for me to find this update. admittedly I've only looked form my ship, which some sites are blocked on, but i can't find it anywhere. and of course all the stores don't keep back issues. i guess i can keep doing my blood for the blood god thing, but thats more for fun games cause i don't like blood letters as much anymore. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3224901 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 31, 2012 Author Share Posted October 31, 2012 does anybody know where i can find a copy of the new demon rules? i really really want to have options to ally more than just my guard, but my demons are sitting on the shelves waiting for me to find this update. admittedly I've only looked form my ship, which some sites are blocked on, but i can't find it anywhere. and of course all the stores don't keep back issues. i guess i can keep doing my blood for the blood god thing, but thats more for fun games cause i don't like blood letters as much anymore. I think it will be available as a digital update at some point. You basically need WD whatever number it was, although I have been told that it is out there on those sites I do not condone :blush: Dallas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225097 Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_f Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 Posted this on the Nurgle board but I might also give it a shot here: Well, I obviously wanna try the Epi/CSM combo but I am also tempted to include some screamer and flamers since they got really good in the latest update. The question is, is this viable or will the tally be lacklustering because I'm investing some 200 points into deamons without MoN? Has anyone had any experience with this? Edit: In short, a 1750 list would look something like this: Epi Plaguebearers Screamers Flamers ~400p Nurgle lord Oblit MoN Bikes MoN Plague marines Cultist ~1350p What do you think? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225124 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lepaca Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I'm just waiting for the new Daemons book so I can finally begin to figure out what allies I want to take. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225179 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 what can our allies give us that fills a gap. We really have a lot of gaps to fill, so may I ask the opposite question: what gaps are we able to fill for our allies? or: what do we do better than anybody else? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225269 Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_f Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 what can our allies give us that fills a gap. We really have a lot of gaps to fill, so may I ask the opposite question: what gaps are we able to fill for our allies? or: what do we do better than anybody else? I'd say hordes. Our cultist are imho one of the best troops out there. Cheap and very dynamic (ranging from Tar pit zombies to shooty units with the potential of 3 flamers per unit for some nasty overwatch fire.). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225292 Share on other sites More sharing options...
heralds of excess Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I use daemonettes and fiends/seekers to act as a counter-assault/ last turn objective grabber unit whilst my noise marines shoot like crazy at anything that the daemons can't handle. I think that the Slaanesh combo is great because it means that i don't have to waste points kitting out my noise marine squads for both close combat and shooting; i can just focus on making them super shooty. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225296 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 hordes. guard does it better. +1pts/model, but you gain orders, armor, grenades, better options for the other slots and battle brothers with most codices. or take orks for melee. what else is there? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225393 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted October 31, 2012 Author Share Posted October 31, 2012 I'm just waiting for the new Daemons book so I can finally begin to figure out what allies I want to take. Don't expect drastic changes. The GW WD update & recent FAQ is likely the lines it will go on. I'm thinking no 4++ on anything except Tzeentch GDs & DPs, then maybe a few new units like the ones linked with new Furies models. Personally, I haven't got an issue with the Daemons codex as it is now & think there are some strong options in there either as an army allied to CSM or as a CSM army taking them as allies. Dallas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225967 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minsc Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 I guess if you want to win badly, you could always hire some cheap IG troops/HQ, a Vendetta and a Manticore. If you do this however, you sell your soul to GW, cause that is what they want you to do. :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225981 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Caffeineated Chaos Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I guess if you want to win badly, you could always hire some cheap IG troops/HQ, a Vendetta and a Manticore. If you do this however, you sell your soul to GW, cause that is what they want you to do. ;) We all did that when we bought full-size armies. I fully intend on doing that for traitor guard. Except maybe not the vendetta when I can help it. I'm looking into Vraksian allies Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3225993 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sanctimonius Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I've always wanted to do a decent Traitor guard army, probably fluff them as a detachment for my Night Lords, but whenever I look at them I can't help but see the IG as the main army and CSM as allies - IG for the numbers and armour, and a few units of CSM to tear the crap out of anyone who gets too close. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3226049 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dallas Drake Posted November 1, 2012 Author Share Posted November 1, 2012 Traitor IG are cool but I see two problems; 1) The IG models are not 'cult' enough without lots of conversion work. 2) FW IG necessitates a re-mortgage. If & when GW gets its act together & releases some multi-part new pose Cultist kits, that's when I'd consider it. Until then it's Daemons all the way for my allies :tu: Dallas Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3226765 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azekai Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 1) The IG models are not 'cult' enough without lots of conversion work. Actually that is a pretty easy fix. Get some alternate heads and change the paintjob- hey presto, traitor guard. Not difficult at all. I have about 60 catachans with various Pig Iron heads. Gave 'em sallow skin and a few boils and now they are doing sterling work serving Papa Nurgle and catching bullets for my Plague Marines. By the way, I also own a spiky vendetta, and it is awesomely destructive (my counts-as Marbo is a lot of fun too). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3226778 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vilicate Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 I have ~60 Fantasy Flagellants with Cadian arms that work great for traitor IG. Plus I've got a boat load of cool tanks, and what WB host doesn't want to add some fast flamer tanks to BBQ the enemy with? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/264627-allies/#findComment-3226802 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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