Quick question about Cultists

[EricBasser]

I'm taking them as allies. Sticking them behind a defense line with a unmarked sorcerer. I have 20 cultists with combat weapons and pistols. I plan on Biomancy for the sorcerer. Hoping to get the feel no pain power. Would Mark of Nurgle benefit this squad a lot? I know it's just one toughness, but Toughness 4, 4+ cover, and Feel No Pain just seems like it's too good to pass up on objective holders.

 

What does everyone think about that?

 

Second, if I go the tally route, does the psyhic power that grants Feel No Pain work along with the tally if they are marked?

[Spacelizard]

So it sounds like you are allying in CSM to Daemons? Why? If you are only allying in CSM for cultists why not just take plaguebearers?

[EricBasser]

My primary is daemons. I'm allying to be somewhat fluffy

For CSM allies, I need a HQ and troops as mandatory before take anything else. So a Sorcerer and Cultists seem the cheapest solution. I'm also taking a heldrake and some obliterators. I'm taking a Aegis Defense Line with Comm Relay. Most games I've played with the ADL and Cultists, everything came in by turn two. It's more of a overwhelming factor when 2 Flying Monstrous Creatures and a Flyer are backed by screamers and. flamers in 1850 points.

[Azekai]

Well, if cheap is what you are shooting for, I would not opt for the MoN. Increasing the cost of your cultists by 50% does not seem like the way to go. They are just there to be cheap and cower, after all.

 

If you are going with the tallyman, then I would use MoN, but that is because it offers other benefits beyond an expensive Toughness upgrade.

[Fibonacci]

Hoping to get the feel no pain power.

I would like to talk you out of this reasoning if I could. At ML3, there is a 62% chance of getting the one buff you want. Even if you do, you will be spending the game risking a perils just to keep FNP up on a unit that is still easily wounded.

 

Let's break out some math. First, MoN increases the cost of a cultist by 50%. The increased T means they take 17% fewer wounds. With a 6+ armor save they wont save much that way. It is a very straight trade off. for that same cost, you can add 50% more cultists (that would be adding 50% more wounds) or negate 17% of the wounds recieved. When you also figure in that more models means more shots and attacks plus the bigger squad size is fluffy as well, it really makes more semse to me to put more models on the table over taking a mark.

 

But that's just the +1T; what about FNP? FNP will negate 33% of the wounds the mob takes. This along with the 17% fewer wounds from MoN gives a total of (drum roll ...) 50% fewer wounds! The same as spending those points on more models. The down side is, this only happnes 62% of the time. The rest of the time your sorc just does not get the Endruance power. So all in all you are getting a total of 31% wound reduction across all games.

 

You could use the points spent on MoN alone and be as good as mark + psyker and not have to watse almost 40% of your games because you did not get the power you wanted. Adding cultists is not only a better objective sitting survival stratagy, it is more reliable and cost effective as well.

 

On the other hand, if you only have 20 cultists and want to get the most out of them, think about taking the mark and icon of slaanesh to get your FNP 100% of the time and let your sorc spend his warp charges on killing the enemy.

Scratch that. No icon for cultists. just go with as big of a blob as you can.

[Dallas Drake]

Keep it cheap. 20 Cultists & Aegis. Never take an Icon.

 

Alternatively? Ally in Typhus & run Plague Zombies.

 

Dallas

[EricBasser]

Thanks for the advise. I'll keep it cheap. I just got too sidetracked with all the options.

[zyl-]

Well if you value effective, I would seriously recommend allying in plague marines with a marked lord. Plasma plague marines are frightningly effective in my experience, and have become my favorite unit. And they always have fnp, so they work well with a tally list ;)

[Azekai]

Just remember a MoN lord does not make the PMs troops in an allied detatchment, because GW thinks that synergy is for the birds.

You can take a single unit of them as elites, of course, but they can't score, which is a big part of why they are good. :/

[allwaysoffside]

Fibonacci: not wanting to be confrontational, but whats your maths based on? What S waepon? Increase in survivability, due to increse of T is soley based on attking waepon strength. So a blanket 17% is in acuarte.

I assume this is using a S3 attack (which fits the maths). Even then the 50% increase is (slightly) inaccurate. Agsint S3 weapons with T4 and FnP your chances of survial (ignoring armour) are incerased from 50% of landed attacks to 78%. A gain of 56% of the orginal.

Working out below using the and/or rules for probability.

 

S3 - T3 dead 50%

S3 - T4 - FnP. 33% chance of wound . FnP dose not work 66% of the time, so chances of being wounded 33% x chances of FnP not working 66% = 22%.

Which is close to your I will admite.

 

However the real benifit come when you are fighting S4+

 

S4-T3 dead 66%

S4 - T4 - FnP. 50% chance of wound. FnP works 33% of the time, so chances of being wounded 50% x chances of FnP not working 66% = 33%. Dead 33% of the time.

This means against S4 weapons you are twice as likely to make it.

 

S5 T3 dead 83% of the time

S5 T4 -FnP. Wound 67% - FnP only saves 33% of theose so your survive 45% of time. A big saving.

meaing from 8 out of 10 dying, only 4 out of ten die.

 

Benifit also in S6 and 7 weapons thecultist have 100% chance of dying it with T3. But with T4 and FnP they have a 54% chance of dying. So from 10 out of 10, to 5 out of ten dying.

 

 

Is it worth is though. I don't think so. I'd by the addtional toops.

[Brother Nathan]

if you want nurgly youd probably be better taking typhus and his zombie friends(ie fnp and fearless cultists, fewer attacks but better survivability) for only the cost of typhus...