Rule question

[Hear da Lamentation]

So my fellow Hammer friend has recently posted this on our local board

 

mixed armour saves

1. Allocate wounds to the nearest model. If models equidistant, player allocating wounds chooses which model.

2. Roll each save individually until the closest model dead

3. LoS! rolls made before saves are made.

 

If armour saves all the same

 

1. Roll wounds and saves

2. Allocate unsaved wounds to the closest model. If models equidistant, player allocating wounds chooses which model

3. LoS! rolls made after saves are made

 

Now, he is usually correct on these things, but I cannot see the ruling for this in the book. LoS specifies it can be used for a "wound (or unsaved wound). And I cannot see anything in the section on mixed wound allocation that specifies any different.

 

Can anyone help clear the issue up for me please?

[Brom MKIV]

The 6th edition wound allocation rules are a little ambiguous but the errata clears things up. If you havent already I suggest reading the errata: linky

 

Basically people were abusing the same armour saves rules with dudes like corbulo and when they did finally succeed in failing (haha wha?) a roll they would LoS it. Therefore GW removed "(or unsaved wound)" from the look out sir rules and added language to the mixed saves and fnp language to prevent/limit abuse.

 

In a nutshell LoS is done before saves are rolled but after wound allocation. Example: 8 wounds are inflicted on a unit with corbulo as the closest model. Wounds are allocated to corbulo using the errata'd mixed saves allocation rules. Corbulo then chooses how many LoS rolls to attempt. Successful LoS'd wounds are instead allocated to closest model. Now saves are taken.

 

Hope that helped and im sure someone will point out that my summary isnt entirely correct but thats the basic jist of it.

 

Edit- LoS rolls are intended to be made individually for each wound. However I/we have never seen the harm in still using fast dice, IF, the controller is willing to accept the risk that comes with fast dicing LoS and this is not always the practice just something we do and have done from time to time.

[Hear da Lamentation]

That is brilliant - thanks for the post it has completely sorted it out. I hadn't seen the errata.

 

To be fair, a 2+ save with LoS (as a IC) was a bit too good, so I can understand why they did it.

 

It still allows us (for a GH pack with a temie IC like a RP and a wolf standard) to allocate most wounds to the 2+ guy with reroll of 1s. OK it only lasts one round, but it is still a hell of a benefit. I suppose really though, you need an IC and a character in the unit because otherwise the IC is going to be challenged by something.

[Hear da Lamentation]

OK - so how does it work when the saves are the same?

 

So ...

 

5 termies and a lord - all with 2+ save.

10 wounds are given to that unit

 

Can you roll the saves - then allocate the unsaved wounds to the lord - then roll LoS?

[dswanick]

OK - so how does it work when the saves are the same?

 

So ...

 

5 termies and a lord - all with 2+ save.

10 wounds are given to that unit

 

Can you roll the saves - then allocate the unsaved wounds to the lord - then roll LoS?

The Lord is an IC, so allocate then save.

 

BRB FAQ:

Page 15 – Shooting Phase, Mixed Saves

Change subheader to “Mixed Saves and Characters”.

Change the first sentence to read “If the target unit contains several different saving throws, or at least one character…”

 

Page 16 – Shooting Phase, Look Out, Sir

Delete “(or unsaved Wounds)” from the first paragraph.

 

Page 16 – Shooting Phase, Look Out, Sir

Change the second sentence of the second bullet point to:

“Determine which model in the unit is closest to the character, and resolve the Wound against that model instead.”

[Hear da Lamentation]

Thanks mate, that is also really well explained and with references too :) :) :)