Lone Wolves

[Stormbrow II]

Something came up in conversation last night that brings up a question about Lone Wolves and not giving away Victory Points. The SW FAQ says:

 

Page 29 – Lone Wolves, A Glorious Death.

Replace the last two sentences with: “Furthermore, in missions

that award Victory Points for each enemy unit that has been

completely destroyed, a Lone Wolf does not concede a Victory

Point if he dies in battle. Instead, to represent his failure to

meet a spectacular end, a Lone Wolf awards a Victory Point in

such a mission if he survives until the end of the game!”

 

Now its obvious that this applies in Purge the Alien but my question is does it affect First Blood? The BRB says:

Page 122 - First Blood.

The first unit, of any kind, to be removed as a casualty during the game is worth 1 Victory Point to the opposing player at the end of the game.

 

It goes on to state in Purge the Alien its worth 2 and Heavy and Fast are worth 2 in the missions where they are scoring.

 

From the above, my understanding is the answer in the FAQ means the Lone Wolf does not give away any Victory points at all if he's dead so does he give away First Blood, seeing as that is a VP for destroying the first unit.

 

Have I read this right?

[Panzerbjørn]

While this could be argued both ways, I would say that yes, the lone wolf gives a VP because he is a unit, and he is killed.

 

The rule for the Lone Wolf state that he doesn't give a VP for being destroyed in missions that award VPs for units that are completely destroyed, however, this id different from First Blood.

 

And while it can be read either way as RAW, I think applying some RAI here would be worthwhile.

[Stormbrow II]

The rule for the Lone Wolf state that he doesn't give a VP for being destroyed in missions that award VPs for units that are completely destroyed,

Cool, I'm with you.

 

however, this id different from First Blood.

If it is different could you explain how it is, please? There were a few of us scratching our heads but couldn't differentiate it but the extra input is always appreciated.

 

And while it can be read either way as RAW, I think applying some RAI here would be worthwhile.

I'm lucky in that I get to travel and play games with lots of other groups on a regular basis and one thing we agree on is the exclusive use of RAW when we play so I'd appreciate it if we could leave the RAI out of a response, even if other groups of people are happy to use it, as I'm far more interested in getting the RAW on it. Thanks.

[Panzerbjørn]

Very understandable, when you play with people you haven't had an opportunity to discuss rules with, the only thing you have in common is RAW.

 

The BRB states that it is any unit, and that this is in addition to giving a point in Purge The Alien. Their intention is pretty clear to me, but as I wrote, the RAW can, IMO, be read both ways.

However, since this is only relevant in one out of 6 missions, maybe it would just be best to discuss it with your opponent before you deploy.

 

however, this id different from First Blood.

If it is different could you explain how it is, please? There were a few of us scratching our heads but couldn't differentiate it but the extra input is always appreciated.

 

I see it as different due to one being mission specific (Purge The Alien) while the other is a secondary objective in all the missions.

To me it doesn't make sense if the Lone Wolf does not count for first blood in one mission, but does in the other five.

But again, this is getting RAI involved. IMO, in cases such as this where there is no completely clear answer, unless I've missed, then I tend to take a look at what the designers probably intended. Some times this is the only way out of a rules discussion.

As examples, take the 9GH+1WG = 10 man squad when C:SW first came out or the Zombie Cultists can only be 10 in a squad when C:CSM came out.

 

Having said that, if you posted this in the Official Rules forum you would probably get more feedback...

[Wulfebane]

First Blood is separate.

 

Assume for a second that it wasn't a Lone Wolf. The unit gets destroyed. Your opponent gets 1 VP for First Blood and another for wiping a unit. Now assume it is a Lone Wolf. Same scenario, except your opponent gets 1 VP for First Blood and 0 VP for wiping the unit.

[Stormbrow II]

However, since this is only relevant in one out of 6 missions, maybe it would just be best to discuss it with your opponent before you deploy.

Done already. :lol:

 

I've mailed the TO for the next tourney about it too. He reckons the LW doesn't give away a point because there's no distinction made by First Blood vps for destroying a unit while the SW FAQ provides a clear exemption for the LW from giving away a VP when destroyed (it does not say it does not apply to First Blood vps: sorry for the use of double negatives). It was the bracketed bit that made him settle on his decision, fwiw.

 

To me it doesn't make sense if the Lone Wolf does not count for first blood in one mission, but does in the other five.

This is true, but I was never arguing for that. I didn't mean to say that it applied only for Purge the Weak. Apologies if there was any confusion.

 

Having said that, if you posted this in the Official Rules forum you would probably get more feedback...

Cool. Thanks for the suggestion, although I try to avoid such fora in general because they tend to have posts that end up getting heated before being locked down with little in the way of anything constructive being achieved.

[Shaggy12009]

Normally in purge the alien you get two points for the first unit killed. One for killing a unit and one for first blood. I read this as the opponent doesn't get the point for purge the alien since this is a "mission" victory point but you would get the first blood point being that relates to secondary objectives. Even though that's how I'd personally apply the rule, I can understand both sides. The easiest way to solve this is to ask before the dice start flying.