1.5k: The B&C Special

[spartan249]

Alright, with all our super tacticians in the forum, I figure we can collectively make a super scary list with no problem. So, here is the format.

 

- choose a strategy for the army.

- fill out each FOC section individually (starting with HQ).

- go over final composition and tweaks.

 

Each point will be covered individually to really get into the fundamental thought process of list construction.

 

Everyone will have a say in how each segment will be handled, with either a consensus or majority vote deciding each section. I will moderate in case of any long/serious disputes, but I will not have any say in any of the sections.

 

With that being said, let's start with strategy. While I would be happy with you guys using my outlined archetypes, feel free to be an iconoclast and make your own cool/wacky strategy up ;)

 

Edit: please only post on the topic at hand. Full army lists will be compiled after enough of the steps have been processed. Also, non GK players, feel free to chip in.

 

1500 pts "B&C Special"

Aegis Defense Line - 50 pts

HQ

Coteaz: 100 pts

OM Inquisitor: ML 1 - 55 pts

Troops

Henchmen: 7 Acos (Sbolter), 3 Pcannon Servitor, 2 Jokaero - 179 pts

Henchmen: 7 Acos (Sbolter), 3 Pcannon Servitor, 2 Jokaero - 179 pts

Strike Squad: 10 Knights, 2 Psycannons, Psybolts - 240 pts

Strike Squad: 10 Knights, 2 Psycannons, Psybolts - 240 pts

[Reclusiarch Darius]

- Strategy:

 

Have more stuff alive on objectives by dice down. Also, kill things

 

HQ:

 

Coteaz

(100 points)

 

Inquisitor w/sword+bolt pistol, Divination

(55 points)

 

Elites:

 

Vindicare

(145 points)

 

Flame Knight w/halberd, Purifier w/hammer, 4 x Purifiers w/halberds, 4 x Purifiers w/psycannons

(295 points)

 

Troops:

 

Justicar w/halberd, 2 x Terminators w/hammer+psycannon, 2 x Terminators w/hammers, 4 x Terminators w/halberds

(450 points)

 

3 x Servitor w/plasma cannon, 7 x Acolytes

(88 points)

 

Heavy Support:

 

Dreadknight w/greatsword, teleporter

(230 points)

 

Dreadnought w/2 x twin-autocannons, psybolts

(135 points)

 

2pts under. Lack of scoring, but I rarely find it a problem (only when they murder all the Terminators, which isn't often). Success?

[spartan249]

I appreciate your enthusiasm, but one thing at a time. Overall Strategy is the first order of business, so let's focus on that.

 

Earth/Fire - 1

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Ah k, I misread your OP.

 

Strategy:

 

I'd go offensive, we aren't a very campy army. Shooty Henchmen, PsyDreads and the Vindicare can hang back and snipe, but everything else should be pushing into the mid-field.

You also wanna take something to tank damage. Be it Pallies, TDA blob, multiple PA squads etc. Bodycount is important, Henchmen can halp.

You also want a fast element, something to flank your opponent and catch units out. DK and Interceptors are both good choices.

 

Turn 1 would be advancing into mid-field, looking to cap objectives placed there. Secure home base with a Strike squad or a shooty Henchmen unit.

Turn 2 would be launching assaults with non-scoring units (not necessarily melee charges, but get in close and dump firepower into them as well), looking to murder off enemy Troops/disable problem units (transports, walkers, fast movers like Bikers)

Turn 3 would be more killing

Turn 4 the same

Turn 5 get as much scoring onto objective as possible, contest all others

[Gentlemanloser]

Stragey;

 

Utilise what our Army does best. Midrange Shooting domination, cheap razorbacks, Long Range Autocannons, and one of the best MCs in the game.

 

Utilise Allies to cover what the Codex lacks. Durable 'Deathstars' and efficent Flyers.

[adamv6]

Strategy:

 

Maximize our troop choices using either henchman or Grand Strategy.

Hold 'home' objectives, advance on midfield objectives to deny them using specialist troops capable of high ROF and CQB capabilities.

Use specialist troops or deep strike capabilities to acquire enemy objectives and 'linebreaker' in late phase of the game.

DECIMATE enemy specialist units with withering fire, demoralising opponent.

[spartan249]

Interesting, consensus on earth/fire so far. Not unexpected given how adept the codex is at this style. I'll wait to see if anyone makes a case for water or fire (or even air... I can already smell #6 dreaming something up), but right now, looks like rolling thunder.

[Aethernitas]

Strategy:

 

turn 1: deploy 2-3 small units in good cover and/or objectives including something with psychic communion; also NDKs with porters are an option

turn 2: bring in the reserves by deep striking/stormravens to critical locations (meaning weak units, objectives or to use those to deny a flank); move the troops that don't hold objectives in order to change that, shunt and flame

turn 3: CHARGE!!! nuff said

turn 4: rince and repeat

turn 5: table the OPFOR

turn 6: celebrate with barrels of amasec

[spartan249]

Or Mr. Aether... whatever works.

 

Ok, now that there is a dissenting opinion, the real discussion begins. Consensus needs to be reached before we go on. Why choose an Air strategy over an Earth/Fire strategy? If you can persuade the others that this is the correct course of action, then we may well be designing an air army.

[Aethernitas]

I can at least try :)

I'll try to keep my reasoning as general as possible:

 

I like that playstyle cuz it gives me the advantage of perfectly controlling which of my units go up against the OPFORes ones.

 

With the flyer and shunt rules and the new DS rules extremely forgiving I have a myriad of options to position. Combine this with the superior overall versatility of Grey Knights it becomes truly awesomely. Normally I hold back turn 1 and deploy everything on turn 2. I can either spread and take every single objective to force the OPFOR to split and try to push me out of enough objectives to win (especially effective if the OPFOR stick together for better deep-strike defence). I can also easily deny a flank and apply the full force of my army to a fraction of his. I also circumvent any long range firepower to pummel my army early on and normally only have to take one turn of fire (at most keeping in mind that some armys would wanna charge me first and only have rapid fire guns) before cc.

[Gentlemanloser]

Disesntion? :)

 

I'd say that mobility is one of our stronger points.

 

Not the lease PTing DreadKnights (and to a *much* lesser extent Interceptors), the shunt move is powerful and unique to us.

 

On top of these, we have cheap and potent transports, that with the changes 6th bring can quickly get us into our prefered Midfield range. 18" move, coupled with (unlike Rapid Fire marines) the ability to potentially Assault after shooting.

 

On top of that, we have solid self reserve manipulation.

 

On the other hand;

 

Normally I hold back turn 1 and deploy everything on turn 2.

 

Isn't valid any more. If you don't deploy something turn one, you auto lose.

[spartan249]

So, are you in favor of abandoning earth/fire for air, or are you saying it is a valid and viable strategy, but you prefer earth/fire?

[Gentlemanloser]

Who said I was for any of the elemental distinctions? ;)

 

I'm in favour of utilising the strengths of the Codex.

 

Of which Shunting MCs is just as much a part as S8 Autocannons.

[spartan249]

All good lists have focus and purpose in composition, and deciding those factors is the point of this section. Unit particulars will come later, but first, overall structure. I'll count you in for your original stance unless you change it.

 

Ok, any rebuttal? Agreement?

[Aethernitas]

Normally I hold back turn 1 and deploy everything on turn 2.

 

Isn't valid any more. If you don't deploy something turn one, you auto lose.

 

I was refering to units (shunting or not) that start the game on the table to make the 50:50 ratio for the reserves work. With "holding back" I meant that I don't shunt in turn 1 and instead prioritize surviving (cover) over shooting with all units on the table to prevent exactly the point u brought up: getting tabled first turn.

[Gentlemanloser]

Ah! :)

[spartan249]

Earth/Fire it is then.

 

Let's begin the festivities with the HQs.

 

Let's not just list HQ choices with no explanation. Write down your thoughts about why you are advocating a particular HQ, specifically why you think your particular selection will contribute the best to the overall strategy of the list.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Coteaz, Lord of Space and Time:

 

Pros: He's cheap. He unlocks Henchmen Troops (for both shooty and hacky support). He is a Mastery 2 Divination psyker. He has built-in anti-Reserves defence for guarding a refused flank. He can re-roll to 'Seize', or force the enemy to do so. He has artificer plate and a nemesis hammer. His eagle pecks people's eyes out like a storm bolter.

 

Cons: None

 

Srsly, he is the auto-include of 6th edition. He ticks every box we want when it comes to HQ. Other armies are understandably jealous of him.

 

Tactics:

 

I usually stick him up back with a unit of three plasma servitors and two Jokaero, where his 'Prescience' and whatever other people he rolls (Ignore Cover is brutal with plasma cannons, 'Scriers Gaze' is hilarious if you have Reserves). He's equally at home in a melee unit though, the lack of TDA means no Deepstrike but that's usually not an issue. His lack of invul is a problem in challenges, but the number of things with AP2 at Initiative is pretty small.

[Gentlemanloser]

HQ: Coteaz

 

For the reasons above. I'd stick him with a GK squad, depending on list.

 

HQ: OM Inquisitor, TDA, Hammer, Psycannon, PML1, Servo Skulls

 

Coteaz Light. But gives you another Psycannon. Stick with a GK squads to maximise Precience and Psycannon rerolls. Servo Skulls are awesome to mess up enemy Infiltrators/Scouts

 

HQ: Inquisitor

 

Cheapest option for Manditory HQ. Use if you want to maximise spend elsewhere (especially if GKs are used as allies)

 

HQ: GKGM

 

Used only for TGS, usually if you want to make unusual units scoring.

[adamv6]

HQ: Ordo Xenos Inquisitor

 

Cheapest option for Mandatory HQ. Easy access to Rad Grenades, drop him in Power armour and join him to his Inquisition warbard (normally made of DCA's and Crusaders).

 

Can be a good choice as a secondary HQ unit, with Coteaz at the first (also being your Warlord)

[spartan249]

Ok, so Coteaz is winning the popularity contest (unsurprising). For now, he'll be the main choice. Now the question concerns secondary HQ. Yes or no? If so, which one? Any ear marked retinue for it?

[redbomber3683]

At 1500pts I don't think there is enough spare points to advocate a second HQ. I don't feel that there is another HQ that could be a force multiplier that wouldn't push the points invested over 350-400. Having nearly a third of your points in HQ isn't a sound choice. Now building on that if you must take a second HQ I would take a BrC. He gives what a Coteaz henchman army lacks, a serious threat to deathstars. He can tie up a single unit for an entire game.

[Reclusiarch Darius]

Nah, don't take the Champ. You are unlikely to fight any of the 'uber heroes' of other armies at 1.5k. He's more relevant at larger point levels, where you have 4 HQ slots and you need someone to take challenges for your Librarian or Grandmaster.

 

For a secondary HQ, I'd go for the Terminator Inquisitor w/nemesis hammer+psycannon. He's only slightly more expensive than Coteaz, but he brings same durability and hammer, plus a Relentless psycannon. He is also another source of 'Prescience' and prevents Mind-Lock, so he can go with either TDA or Purifiers, or with a shooty warband, or even a melee warband.

 

I agree that at 1.5k, we should stay away from the GM, Libby or Draigo. Too many points in HQ leaves little for Troops, Elites and Heavy.

[spartan249]

So one vote for OM inquisitor TDA version, one for no secondary. Anyone else?

[adamv6]

I normally work on taking 10% maximum of my points cost in HQ's. At 1500 points that is 150 points;

 

1st Choice - Coteaz - 100 points

2nd Choice - OX Inquisitor with Rad Grenades and Power Armour - 48 points

 

or

 

1st Choice - OM Inquisitor with TDA, Pyscannon and Psyker Lvl1 - 110 points (can't quite remember without codex)

2nd Choice - Another Inquisitor to match specialist unit / shooty units.

 

There is always the option of the trusty Librarian as HQ (150 dead on) as well, some people forget just how good some of our codex Psyk powers are :D