Emperor's Furor Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I was wondering, how to best exemplify how an ultramarine force would fight and it got me thinking about the attachment system the Empire from warhammer fantasy used. For example you'd regularly see big formations with two detachments of either missile troops or melee troops or a combination of both and behind them or next to them you'd have your firing line or close quarter support units like cavalry etc, would this be a good basis for Ultramarines? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeremy1391 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I would say no. the codex astartes would be the layout you would want, now mind you in the heresy I would think things would have been bigger like company and squad sizes but the tenets of the codex astartes are what I believe Gulliman used as the basis for the way his legion fought. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3243678 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 For example you'd regularly see big formations with two detachments of either missile troops or melee troops or a combination of both and behind them or next to them you'd have your firing line or close quarter support units like cavalry etc, would this be a good basis for Ultramarines? Isn't that basically what a Battle Company is? Six line squad, backed by two long range support units and two fast assault units. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3243709 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 Yeah I guess. The problem though is that the codex astartes is different to the list presented in Betrayal. In Betrayal tactical squads can't have support weaponry instead you need to have support squads which focus on those weapons, the legion list is actually less flexible than the codex astartes. I was thinking the ultramarines would always have support elements, so a full tactical squad may have an apothecary with them but then have two supporting squads, one short range and one long range, so maybe a support squad of flamers and a heavy support squad of missile launchers? It's just in other armies, they tend to focus on one aspect, while Ultramarines are notoriously flexible and I'm trying to figure out a way to build this into the army I'm making. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3243726 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nova_Dew Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 my take for the smurfs would be 3 tactical squads with additional combat weapon so they can shoot and or function in CC, 1 assault squad, 2 tactical support squads and maybe some heavy support squads. To me that kinda says smurfs but that's me, maybe change a tactical squad to a Reconnaissance squad Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3243745 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legatus Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I don't know the Betrayal lists, but if the Forgeworld guys know what they are doing, the Ultramarine Legion list will not be that dufferent from a Codex Space Marine force. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3243749 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 I don't know the Betrayal lists, but if the Forgeworld guys know what they are doing, the Ultramarine Legion list will not be that dufferent from a Codex Space Marine force. Betrayal has a standard Legion list that all legions use, and then additional rules and alterations for each legion similar to original Index Astartes rules that slightly altered the standard codex list. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3243769 Share on other sites More sharing options...
caprera Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 I do really hope this time to see some serious/practical differences for Smurfs, not just a different power armour... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3245434 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emperor's Furor Posted November 25, 2012 Author Share Posted November 25, 2012 I didn't want to start a new thread, so I thought I'd ask here, what was the common hair colour of the Ultramarines? Was it blonde? I'm painting my Eikos Lamiad at the moment and I'm not sure what colour to do his hair. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3246321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
KarkassBC Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 Blue of course... Really I think they have a mixed colour black and blonde because they recruit from 500 planets. So they would not have a fixed pattern. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3246351 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cactus Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 Yeah I guess. The problem though is that the codex astartes is different to the list presented in Betrayal. In Betrayal tactical squads can't have support weaponry instead you need to have support squads which focus on those weapons, the legion list is actually less flexible than the codex astartes. I was thinking the ultramarines would always have support elements, so a full tactical squad may have an apothecary with them but then have two supporting squads, one short range and one long range, so maybe a support squad of flamers and a heavy support squad of missile launchers? It's just in other armies, they tend to focus on one aspect, while Ultramarines are notoriously flexible and I'm trying to figure out a way to build this into the army I'm making. That's what I thought of too when you mentioned Empire detachments. A large tactical squad supported by two smaller specialist squads. Precisely which supporting squads will, I imagine, vary with the mission requirements. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3246395 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veteran Sergeant Posted November 25, 2012 Share Posted November 25, 2012 I didn't want to start a new thread, so I thought I'd ask here, what was the common hair colour of the Ultramarines? Was it blonde? I'm painting my Eikos Lamiad at the moment and I'm not sure what colour to do his hair. As said, their recruitment base is probably wider than any of the other Legions, by far. At the time of the Heresy, Ultramar was hundreds of planets (assumedly broken up at the Second Founding, with many of the planets given to 2nd Founding Successors or reintegrated into the Imperium). Your Ultramarines can probably look like anything you want. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/266275-theoretical-on-ultramarines-combat-doctrine/#findComment-3246427 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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