Dark Vengeance

[Danasdfgh58]

Excitedly picked up the chaos half of dark vengeance the other day. Got me thinking about starting a chaos army and was wondering where to head as I start painting the figures up!

 

What would people recommend adding to put together a decent 1000pt force?

[Kol Saresk]

As a general purpose army or do you have a specific objective in mind?

[Danasdfgh58]

Definitely a general purpose army, I dont have any specific events or anything in mind, aiming to make a well rounded force I can play with at a local gaming group.

[the jeske]

12 bikes

60 csm

12 autocannons

1 aegis gunline

16 plasma guns

1 huron

12 terminators

6-9 oblits

2 HQs on bikes

1 DP

3 preds las sponson preds with autocannon turrets

6 melta guns

 

this should more or less give you a base to build most chaos armies . after getting this concentrate on getting ally .pick demons or IG , and then get stuff for them .

[Brother Ulkesh]

What jeske said ;) . Plus, of course, the codex...

 

If I were you, I'd start with a couple of boxes of Chaos Marines to give you some better troops than what you've got with the cultists. Play a game or two - see what you think might be missing (e.g. anti-tank) - and add something to your army to address it.

 

Have you picked a legion / warband yet?

[Danasdfgh58]

Cheers Jeske!

 

Have not yet picked a warband/legion but have two possible ideas, either Crimson Slaughter or Death Guard.

 

Are cultists not so great as troop options then?

 

To form the dark vengeance kit into a reasonably rounded force would it be sensible to take out the cultists and add something like 2 tactical squads and either some obliterators or terminators then?

[DraneceusRex]

Use the cultists in addition to the CSMs. I'd also advise to keep the chosen in mind as Chaos Champions for the CSMs instead of running them together. Chosen are a bit overpriced. But my other suggestion would be to get bikes, heldrakes, and an Aegis.

[Storm Dragons 3rd Company]

Definitely a general purpose army, I dont have any specific events or anything in mind, aiming to make a well rounded force I can play with at a local gaming group.

 

First, in any CSM army you have to have a demon prince and a spawn just in case you get those rolls on the table, even if you never field them deliberately. Two might be better (though 2 DPs is expensive). The guys above mentioned the DP but not the spawn. If you are not WYSIWYG, you have some leeway here.

 

Second, to me, balanced means you want a fair amount of variety. So I'd consider models and configurations that offer the ability to have a variety of loadouts. for example, you might be able to take the 'Fiend and magnetize it to be able to be multiple things. Likewise, if you picked up 4 missile launchers (probably not too hard to do if you are having to acquire all those autocannons Jeske mentioned), you would have the option to drop them in a CSM squad or put them in a Havoc squad with Flakk missiles.

 

Third, if you are going to be getting terminators, I'd probably consider the land raider (even if it is "junk" according to some). The termies can take it as a dedicated transport and you'd probably want to have that option. Plus, it makes a good centerpiece if you are looking at the painting aspect.

[the jeske]

Cheers Jeske!

 

Have not yet picked a warband/legion but have two possible ideas, either Crimson Slaughter or Death Guard.

 

Are cultists not so great as troop options then?

 

To form the dark vengeance kit into a reasonably rounded force would it be sensible to take out the cultists and add something like 2 tactical squads and either some obliterators or terminators then?

you already have cultists so I didnt put them on the list. Just like I didnt put down power armored HQs[you can make those out of chosen and the lord] .

 

 

if you picked up 4 missile launchers (probably not too hard to do

SW players are driving the prices of RL like few things in w40k . It is not only hard to get them , but they offten cost more then autocannons .

 

 

never buy a LR in 6th for chaos . the same points [200+] spent on more terminators and more gear for them makes the unit a lot better , then a bad transport . our LR are not loyalist LR .

[Sception]

12 bikes

60 csm

12 autocannons

1 aegis gunline

16 plasma guns

1 huron

12 terminators

6-9 oblits

2 HQs on bikes

1 DP

3 preds las sponson preds with autocannon turrets

6 melta guns

 

Add to this list at least one spawn for boon table results. Also, note that the daemon prince should be assembled WITH ARMOR but WITHOUT WINGS, also for boon results. The plastic model can be assembled this way, or you can pick up the finecast (which is slightly cheaper, and I like the sculpt more, but... finecast). If you go deathguard, the Nurgle DP also works, but, again, finecast.

 

Some other things that you might consider:

 

- single spawn (as mentioned above)

- second daemon prince, this one with armor, wings, and a mace (the mace will take some conversion, as will the wings if you don't start with the plastic model).

- khorne lord with axe on jugger (on bike works just as well, if not better, but jugger is still good & looks awesome)

- unit of spawn (to escort jugger lord)

- 1 to 2 Heldrakes (outclassed by other AV12 fliers, but still a major pain for several factions to deal with)

- note that the aigis comes with a quad gun, but you may want to consider converting a icarus las just to have the alternative option, if AV12 fliers become common in your area

 

- maybe a terminator HQ, if you like deep striking terminators. Bikes are probably better, but termies are an option, the 2+ save makes unwieldy weapons viable. If you go death guard, Typhus in particular is an interesting HQ choice for unlocking both plagues and zombies, and being reasonably badass himself.

- 1 to 2 units of plague marines, if you go death guard and opt to field Typhus (can replace some of the CSMs you would otherwise collect).

- 1 to 2 zombie units, if you go death guard and opt to field Typhus (can be converted from some of your cultists, or just use mantic zombies)

 

 

A couple boxes of Chaos Space Marines, plus the prince & spawn for chart results, are definitely the first priority, though. After that, probably bikes + a bike HQ.

[Danasdfgh58]

Cheers for the advice guys!

 

Sounds like if I got Crimson Slaughter I should grab a box of tactical marines and a demon prince, and if I go Death Guard I should grab Typhus and a box of plague marines. Ive noticed no-one has mentioned vehicles at all, and only malisteen and draneceusrex mentioned heldrakes, are they not really worth investing in for chaos?

 

Also this may be me being retarded, but what is the ''boon table'' ?

[Hymirl]

Helldrakes are awesome, they burn infantry stuff on the ground, they eat airplanes and they heal their lost hull points!

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

The boon table is a table we roll on after our characters, who have to challenge (despite the fluff of a good half the legions being about cowarldy/not challenging) that can be good, but most of the time is not REALLYuseful and pray you never get daemonic ascension with any of your HQ's. And that's what we get instead of ATSKNF...

[Iron Warrior w/ Servo Arm]

Actually, the first thing you need to think about is if you want to play in tournaments or not. If you don't ever have the intention to play tournaments, then you should play with what you have, figure out what you like, and build your force accordingly.

 

If you want to be uber-competitive and play in tournaments often, then jeske gave a very good list on what to buy. However, you will have to buy new things every few years as new codexes come out.

 

I would honestly recommend you playing the units you like and figuring it out from there.

[Sception]

For vehicles in general, the 6e changes only emphasized the old philosophy of 'all or none'. If you can spam the table with high AV hull points, then it's still worth doing. But one or two mid to light vehicles in a mixed army are going to drop faster than ever. While we can't really spam high AV like guard, if you want to go more vehicle heavy, we do have some options. Las or Las/Autocannon Predators are cheap & effective. Forgefiends are ok. If you're already taking some vehicles anyway, helbrutes can help out with armor saturation.

 

The problem is that, apart from predators, most of our vehicles are pretty expensive for what they're actually capable of doing, and our daemon engines rely on their 5++ save rather than a respectable armor value to keep that investment functioning (and brutes don't even have the daemon save), when regular tanks can just take cover behind an ADL and have the best of both worlds.

 

It can work, particularly in a casual setting, and I love my defiler dearly. But it's definitely a case of choosing style over substance, as the unit selection that is starting to look like it might turn into the new chaos monobuild (axelord & maybe a sorcerer on bikes, plasmamarines in troops w/ maybe some cultist objective squatters, little to no elite presence, fast split between drakes & bikes, heavy split between ADL autohavocs & nurgle oblits) does seem much more effective on the table against a much wider range of opponents.

 

 

Heldrakes are, of course, a major exception to this. The flier rules in general are pretty borked, and many factions still have no good means of dealing with them outside of heavy ally investment*, and this is especially the case for armor 12 fliers. The baleflamer wreaks havoc on infantry up to and especially including meqs, and can decimate a marine unit a turn from the time it arrives from reserve.

 

A single Heldrake can be an effective and imposing centerpiece for your army. Two, depending on your opponents and the availability of flyer or antiflier options in their forces, can be downright unfair.

 

 

*nids don't even have that option, and on top of that they can't operate their own ADL guns. Assuming a casual setting, I wouldn't field even a single heldrake against nid opponents.