requesting war support!

[DavidKits]

Hello everyone, I could really use a hand with some ideas... there is a local player around here who has a brutal Sisters of Battle army that i personally... haven't seen him loose with. he recently has started taking Grey Knights as allies but that is another matter in its full. my problem is every time I play against him with the old book or this new one I get... curb stomped.. and as much as i put up a good fight i ALWAY get tabled... normally right towards the end of the game but ya.. :/

 

so i am requesting some help in ideas or anything you guys can give me to help with this force! i can't remember all the parts but I'll mention what i do remember and we can go from there. this is only 1250 of the list i can't remember the rest apart from i know its... well ... grey knights >,<

 

his army:

HQs: Jackabus (the hero priest)

Leads an Inquisator Retuine that is made of 4 crusaders, and something like 4 to 6 deathcult assassians.

 

Saint Celestine(sp)

 

Troops: 3x units of regular battle sisters with a flamer, melta, and power weapon in each squad.

 

Elites: 1x Dominion Squad (think these gals are elites maybe elites) they are armed with 2 flamers, 2 meltas, plas pistol on the sister superiour all in a rhino and outflank.

 

Heavy: 2 exorsists(sp) Battle Tanks

 

this is all i remember and its painful as can be... i have never seen him loose a game or even have a nail bitcher close one... please! give me any support you guys can @.@ i don't expect to just flat out beat em but i like at least a fightning chance to pull the game in either direction... at least!

 

David.

 

p.s. he only uses jack and the saint because he mentions repeatedly every time you cannot play a sisters army under any circumstance unless you have them both as he has shown... don't know if its true but *shrugs* oh well what can i do ;) *waits for inboard chaos support to lend a land*

[Warsmith Aznable]

Heldrakes with Baleflamers is the first thing that pops to mind. That list has no anti-air, and the AP3 torrenting template will drop Sisters every time it launches one.

 

What have you tried?

 

EDIT: and remember the Sisters are Toughness 3, so they die much easier than MEQ. Havocs with Autocannons also comes to mind. And our Obliterators get Assault Cannons now, too. So avoid engaging Jacobus and retinue and shoot up his regular SoB so he has no scoring units.

 

What allies do you have access to?

[DavidKits]

nearly everything in my collection short of all the newest deamonengines (don't own any yet) a defiler, or the new hq choices @.@ they all seem to just get stomped... my terminators once almost took out the jackabus squad but *sighs* jack made like ALL his invul saves... >,<

[DavidKits]

if i remember correctly in his 1850 list when he starts to bring in the grey knights they bring a storm raven with em :/

[Warsmith Aznable]

How about a jump pack or biker Lord with the Brand of Skallathrax? Drive-by AP3, yo.

 

Abaddon is always a giggle, if you have enough points.

 

Drop the Defiler and take more troops, unless you're in a high points game.

[DavidKits]

sadly don't own a defiler, but i've tried playing with 4 troops units... the saint just seems to eat em alive... <.<

 

though the jump pack or more so the biker lord sounds interesting.. *taps my chin*

[Warsmith Aznable]

sadly don't own a defiler, but i've tried playing with 4 troops units... the saint just seems to eat em alive... <.<

 

Living Dead Girl is a hilariously effective HQ, in my limited experience with her (I also occasionally play SoB). If he isn't hiding her in a retinue of Seraphim you should be able to burn her down with Obliterators, though. EDIT: I take that back, because I forgot about her Invuln.

[DavidKits]

knocking her down isn't much of the hard part believe it or not... as in my games she always seems to run around on her own. the problem is making her STAY down.. @.@

[Spaz431]

As both one of the only Memphis area sisters players and night lords players, take a piece of advice. 2 teams of havocs in an aegis. 1 Las cannon his exorcists. 2 auto gun troops. I normally run 3 exorcists and use them in a cross fire pattern even if only one shot. Seraphim are best utilized deep strike with either hand flames or inferno. Big point games I run two just to vary my force and to keep opponent guessing. If Jacobus is warlord, though doubtful, skill allows him to reroll faith points but must take second roll even if worse. Saint gets one chance to get back up. If she fails good for you. That has been the bane of my buddy's Lilith hexperax. If you deploy first and have vehicles, pop smoke first action, take your cover while you get it. His whole army will have ++ force him to take them. Use second round to break him. Load your troops with plasma and your champs with combi plasma, force him to assault you. Troop choice champs have no need for combat weapons. Boon table likely to fail. Nurgle lord on bike with brand and power sword. We are not the good guys. We do not fear the slaves of the false emperor. We will break the Imperium and the Golden Highchair. Now show them why they whisper our names in solitude.

[Warsmith Aznable]

Saint gets one chance to get back up. If she fails good for you.

 

What? No. She rolls at the start of each subsequent turn to come back.

[Spaz431]

Yes on the subsequent turn she dies she has to roll a 4+ or bye. Not each turn after.

 

Correction. At the beginning of each of your subsequent turns.

 

My bad. Damn I was playing her wrong.

[DavidKits]

could ya do an anti-necron move and stand on her corpse and stop her from getting up? do you guys know? just curious as if i take my big blob of cultists that i was thinking off i could just stand on top of her after cutting her down and let em just stay there as i wonder if they would cover enough space to prevent her return. if so that would save me so much grief right here..

[Spaz431]

She gets a token to be placed outside 1" away. So, no.

 

Remember your opponent has to roll 2x 5's to give her back 3 wounds.

 

But you can take you blob and surround her at 2" circle force to move or keep fighting. A long drawn out 100 point fight will keep her busy and possibly out of your hair because you can keep overwatching her.

[DavidKits]

what if you kill her then run over and stand on top of her? could t.. that do it? *is being really hopeful here* ^.^;;

[Spaz431]

You can not park anything on her it doesn't work.

 

Read previous entry for a vicious idea for cultusts

[spafe]

Can you take black mace, kill someone nearby (as I assume ehr save is pretty good) or jsut dforce enough saves she fails one and hope she fails T test, tehn shes not been kileld, shes been 'removed from play'. would this work?

[DavidKits]

she can always come back even from removed from play i know that much from the FAQ :/ the only thing that stopped her from what I read at least was turning her into a spawn.. at that point you take control of her model... in a more... nasty spawn like way and i would imagine she can't really come back if she belongs to someone else :/ so i think they got to kill her as a spawn before trying to get her back... again. *shrugs*

[Khestra the Unbeheld]

I miss how it was before GW FAQ'd the Sisters rules, back when Jaws of the World Wolf took that harpy right off the board forever. Oh, there were lamentations from the Celestine-centric Sisters players at many a tournament during those times. Jaws was like the ultimate answer to Celestine, Thawn and Yarrick's stupid comeback rule mechanic.

[Brother Ambroz]

I haven't played against her, does she have any anti-tank abilities? If not could tarpit her with a dread or walker.

[John_f]

Epidemius. Plague marines and plasma. AC Hovocs w/ MoN.

[Khestra the Unbeheld]

I haven't played against her, does she have any anti-tank abilities? If not could tarpit her with a dread or walker.

 

Krak grenades. She's really only dangerous vs Infantry at I7 with a power weapon when she's by herself, but she can be buffed with Acts of Faith depending on if she's attached to a unit. I think Retributors grant her Rending. She's Jump capable, so tarpitting her with a slow Walker may not be possible if you can't pin her down in CC.

[Jacinda]

First, follow the basic rule of thumb; assault the shooty and shoot the assaulty. What this primarily means is to stay away from Jacobus and that conclave of crusaders and assassins. Shoot them. They have a 3++ from the crusaders and FNP so volume of fire is needed but they will fold under bolter fire alone. [ETA] oh, and S6 weapons will deny FNP since they are all (as in every model in the codex) only T3.

 

Saint Celestine is a trap. She is a nuisance that will distract you from the real problems. If you want to tie her up, use something with a lot of wounds and FNP but weak attack. Killing Saint C is just giving her a ghetto Hit & Run.

 

Take out those Exorcists. In fact you generally want to be fighting on that side of the board as much as possible, but the sooner you kill those tanks, the sooner you will be in control of the battlefield. Termicide deepstriking squads work wonders here. Get in the backfield, melta the tanks and draw the whole army back against you because it gets hard to kill terminators, IC and armor without those Exorcists. Well, they still can but not as easily or with the safety of 48" ranged AP1 missiles.

 

You also have access to two torrent flamers that will instant kill almost anything the Sisters of Battle have. Jump pack Sorc with the brand or the heldrake will cause a world of hurt for the Sisters. Open up the rhinos with plasma and flame the girls inside.

 

So bottom line ... here is your target priority.

Exorcists

Troops not in a vehicle

Rhinos holding troops

Everything else. Really, once Jacobus and crew are on the table, just walk away from them.

[CitadelArmyGuy]

CSM shouldn't be losing to SoB.

 

Not to be a jerk, I promise I'm not-- but how long have you been playing, and how long has he been playing? Difference in experience may have a lot to do with it.

 

Also, how are your tactics? But more important, how are your Strategies? Do you just attack at his list or do you play for the objectives?

 

It seems to me his list has a few weaknesses. S3, T3, I3, and low Mobility. So thinking on how we can exploit those weaknesses:

• Melee-Bikers or anything Mobile&T5. S3 only wounds T5 on 6+
  
• Heavy Bolters wound S3 on 2+, so HB are better than Autocannons vs SoB. Sure the AC allows hitting against the Exorcists so they're still good too.
  
• Terrain placement to ensure he can't shoot-- block off key Avenues of Approach so Bikers or Raptors can get close without payment
  
• Obliterators are good for their 2+ armor; just make sure you muck-up the Fire Lanes in midboard to mitigate the Exorcists. You gotta hide those Oblits best you can.
  
• Jugger-Axe Lord is also pretty nice here, with Spawn delivery-- but you've gotta run them behind Bikers for a cover-save otherwise he'll easily shoot the spawn away.
  
• Outflank Dominions are not a problem-- just central-deploy. Or even better, screen off all along your desired board edge so they can't even come on.
  
• As mentioned, Baleflamer Drake is a good choice.
  
• Stop worrying about Celestine. She's annoying. She's good. But stop thinking she is a game-changer (she's no Mephiston). If your Strategy is sound, I'm not sure she can single-handedly tilt the balance off a win. Her melee is AP3 Poison (4+). So Fix her with anything cheap (Spawn=great here) and move on.
  

The mathematics are in your favor. CSM have more ways to get the important T5 than anyone else. Just don't dump points into your Chaos Marines-- keep 'em cheap, then put your combat power into Fast Attack and Heavy Support. Coupled with solid fundamental strategy and tactics, I don't think you should have a problem.

 

The GK allies are the scariest part of his list. The SoB are pushovers.

[Agerjag]

My normal answer to sisters is to kill them with fire. Brand and Helldrakes will cook their squads, brand is even better vs their T3. Bolters actually wound alot as well. The only things you really need to focus are the exorcist via lascannons(pred, oblits or havoks) and I would also shoot down Jacks squad trying to keep my distance from it. Either plague marines or normal marines with plasma should work. Volume of fire, even bolters can be pretty solid. Bikers as suggested already are really mobile put out some descent fire themselves and can deliver juggerlords, or nurgle bike lords. You can also deep strike some raptors or terminators with melta to kill tanks and draw fire away from havoks. You should be able to kill off exorcists by turn 2 then its just a matter of keeping moblile and whittling down his other squads.

[Spaz431]

Force him to use his invulns and you will win the day. Volley of shots.