Chaos Landraider variants

[Brother Ambroz]

This seems like it's getting personal. We were discussing the lackluster codex but really we should be discussing LR variants.

 

So the LR we have access to are the current one and the Proteus?

[Ammonius]

This seems like it's getting personal. We were discussing the lackluster codex but really we should be discussing LR variants.

 

So the LR we have access to are the current one and the Proteus?

And the Spartan...

 

Unless it's an Apocalypse game, in which case, the kid gloves come off, but that's sort of out of scope for this thread.

 

Sometimes, I catch myself thinking that the best LR "variant" we have is the Bastion. I know that my one remaining unbuilt LR kit is in the "Modelling project" category.

[Zhukov]

including the one about me "not wanting you to stay around."

Ah, I think I found one of your problems. You sometimes assume that people assume things. Yes really. I nowhere got the idea that you didn't like my post, nor that you don't like my presence on this forum, nor that you dislike me. That particular thing about 'staying around' was meant as a joke. Sorta. Depends, was it funny?

 

but if something happens that I don't like, then it is my problem to deal with. No?

Yes, although everybody also has responsibility towards other people I believe, in the sense of treating others with respect when possible.

[Kol Saresk]

including the one about me "not wanting you to stay around."

Ah, I think I found one of your problems. You sometimes assume that people assume things. Yes really. I nowhere got the idea that you didn't like my post, nor that you don't like my presence on this forum, nor that you dislike me. That particular thing about 'staying around' was meant as a joke. Sorta. Depends, was it funny?

 

but if something happens that I don't like, then it is my problem to deal with. No?

Yes, although everybody also has responsibility towards other people I believe, in the sense of treating others with respect when possible.

Fair enough. I apologize because I didn't see it as a joke, so in a way I am guilty of what I am saying others are guilty of. I read the post with a serious tone and I didn't see it as a joke. One of the many fallacies of written vs spoken word. So I will apologize about that.

 

Yes, I do agree that there should be some level of mutual respect as well. Although coming to a uniform agreement with so many varied interpretations of "respect" is a very hard thing to do and one which I sadly believe will not happen. But such is life.

 

So as Tanith and Ammonius have tried to do, let's get back to Chaos Land Raider Variants!

[RapatoR]

Well there was rumour of one chaos LR variant that was specialised for siege and with bigger transport cap than the current one. Rumour said it was dropped last moment before relase, so I would not be surprised if something like that would be released in second wave (or later).

Personally I am not sure if rumour was true, but in a way it makes sense. Drop 3 max cap from mutilators and add this LR variant and suddenly mutilators are much better.

[Brother Ambroz]

Hmm yeah I think I actually like the Spartan. Transport capacity of 25?? Finally being able to switch out the dumb heavy bolters! Really they're not that much more expensive than their regular land raider counterparts either. Only problem I could see apart from people not allowing FW is it can't take a Dirge Caster.

[Zhukov]

Yes, I do agree that there should be some level of mutual respect as well. Although coming to a uniform agreement with so many varied interpretations of "respect" is a very hard thing to do and one which I sadly believe will not happen. But such is life.

A uniform agreement isn't needed in the case of respect. It's something based on common sense. Even if you could exactly define respect, you still can't force people to show it.

 

 

Let me add something on the matter of the 1 Land Raider variant we actually have:

 

It got way better. Yes really. How? The edition change:

 

You can now move 6" and fire both Lasscannons. Lasscannons are pretty potent weapons, especially when Twin-linked. (Chaos ain't heavy on anti-flier, every little bit helps and TL basicly counts as shooting double the amount at fliers).

 

When disembarking and charging with something, the Land Raider only moves 6". This means it has to get less close to opposing units (being able to avoid CC or melta maybe, who knows) and it means you can actually fire your 2 Lasscannons that turn too.

 

On top of that people steared away from masses of melta. Sure, there are things which still kill a Land Raider with ease, but overall it should be less prone to getting destroyed easiliy.

 

8/9 Berzerkers + Khârn + Land Raider. It's not terrible, really.

[the jeske]

Well there was rumour of one chaos LR variant that was specialised for siege and with bigger transport cap than the current one. Rumour said it was dropped last moment before relase, so I would not be surprised if something like that would be released in second wave (or later).

wasnt there a LR for the HH armies ? technicly some of those are chaos .

[Brother Ambroz]

Two TL lascannons and AV14 all around is never a bad thing Zhukov but it's just too expensive to me for what it does. Especially something that is such a hybrid, it's the only assault vehicle we have yet it's also the only AV14 tank we have. I just can't justify taking it honestly. Think I might convert a normal GW LR into a Spartan and use the Spartan rules.

[Zhukov]

Two TL lascannons and AV14 all around is never a bad thing Zhukov but it's just too expensive to me for what it does. Especially something that is such a hybrid, it's the only assault vehicle we have yet it's also the only AV14 tank we have. I just can't justify taking it honestly. Think I might convert a normal GW LR into a Spartan and use the Spartan rules.

I'm not implying its good, just better and not terrible.

 

Being the only av14 tank actually isn't that much of an issue. You could even take 1 Land Raider as your only kind of vehicle, simply because taking Av11/12/13 vehicles along with it doesn't really increase its survivability, because it takes different kind of AT to take out in general.

 

More Av14 vehicles would be better in some ways, but on the other hand: 1 vehicle is easier to protect by the rest of your army. (It can be difficult to get to a Land Raider when your whole army is around it and when it actually move into midfield with that army.)

[the jeske]

your looking at this from the wrong perspective . it is not that LR[well at least ours] are bad for assault armies. it is that assault armies are worse in general in 6th ed. LR as moving bunkers used to hide a troop choice for 2-3 turns are ok . LR as bunkers that draw fire and anti tank units to themselfs are ok .they arent great ,they still suffer from melta drop pods or outlfanking attack bikes . SR or flyer transports are better.

 

I just noticed I wrote that LR are ok . When I wrote that I ment ok , as in ok to do this thing , not in ok as ok=good unit.

 

 

To go with Zhukovs example . Imagine playing chaos/IG and taking 1-2 Lemmans and a LR and a landing pad to form your fire base with a IG blob in front of those tanks. Battle cannons are awesome against meq , they struggle with av13+ even with las hull weapons because of bs3 . and here comes the LR [or predator] with 2 twink linked lascannons . now am not saying this is the only way to play Land raiders , but it could work .

[Brother Ambroz]

Oh yeah I know but is it worth the 200+ points? That was my point. I do realize it takes a whole different sort of AT for a LR. Usually opponents I've faced will only bring 1 or 2 things that threaten AV14 so you could feasibly kill those off before they damage the LR.

 

Now if we were allowed by the opponent to take a Spartan, that would limit the threats to AV14 even more because of the Ceramite Plating.

 

Edit: Jeske I know they're not ok as in a unit or just at the specific job you're assigning them to. That's why we're discussing LR alternatives.

[the jeske]

well the only non FW replacment for LR [a transport and gunboat in one] is a storm raven .

[Sception]

To go with Zhukovs example . Imagine playing chaos/IG and taking 1-2 Lemmans and a LR and a landing pad to form your fire base with a IG blob in front of those tanks. Battle cannons are awesome against meq , they struggle with av13+ even with las hull weapons because of bs3 . and here comes the LR [or predator] with 2 twink linked lascannons . now am not saying this is the only way to play Land raiders , but it could work.

 

I could see one working this way. Seems like, if FW stuff is allowed, the proteus might be better in this role. Same armor 14, same twin lascannon sponsons, trades some of the transport abilities you aren't using for scout (which you also wouldn't be using) and reserve manipulation (which might actually be helpful).