Outflanking Wolf Guard

[Meatcaber]

Hi all,

 

I originally got some SW packs as allies for my BA and am thinking about turning them into a fully fledged force.

 

The unit I have in mind is 680 points of a 2,000 point list, that includes a Wolf Priest with SotH, 10 WG in TDA and Arjac Rockfist. Some of the WG are made to be included with other packs but the majority of them will be outflanking.

 

I've opted for an 'all-rounder' unit all in TDA with a mix of different power weapons (2 sword, 2 axe, 2 maul), 2 combi-meltas and a chainfist for anti-tank, 2 combi-plasmas for anti-TEQ and a heavy flamer for anti-horde. Arjac will kill or stun most things, also included a 'challenge monkey' (PF;WC) to accompany the GH pack my RP is with and a CML dude to accompany a pack of LFs.

 

Really just wanting to know if this is a massive waste of points or not, as with a lot of things, the theory looks and sounds good on paper, but having never tried it myself, I don't know how viable it will be in practice.

 

 

Generally speaking, however, is outflanking WG a good idea?

 

Should we keep 'em cheap and cheerful or go all out?

 

Is Arjac worth his points?

 

Should we go for a dedicated unit or an all-rounder unit?

 

 

What are your thoughts?

 

Thanks in advance :)

 

MC

[Brom MKIV]

Hmmm its a huge pts sink but it also has a few inherent bennies.

One, its the only way to get more than 5 TDA deep in enemy territory without an allied gate libby.

Two you dont need to bring 2+ drop pods to get the unit to come in second which can actually be better than first turn when built as a reaction force. I apply this concept to all my drop pod armies.

 

Anyway if your goals for the unit involve these reasons id say yes, outflanking WG are worthwhile. However I wouldnt invest quite so much because fate is fickle.

 

If designing a similar unit I would want to maximize impact on the turn they arrive, like with tons of combi plasmas + dual asscans for example since they are both high strength/volumn and same range weapons. Then id either include arjac OR max the squad, but not both. A smattering of chainfists and storm shields should make the unit hard enough along with the priest without costing half a great company.

[hendrik]

i'd include the CML in the outflanking squad, this way if they end up on the wrong side of the table with nothing in reach they are still able to hurt tanks etc with shots at their side/rear. Given the extra survibality of TDA these days in combat i'd stay low on upgrades. you could then also opt to change out 2-3 terminaotrs (or arjac) for a runepriest with jaws+murderous hurricane. creating an additional denial area on the board for deepstrikers,skimmers etc

[greysquigg]

I agree with the general consensus on this.

 

Having less in the way of fancy upgrades seems like a good thing when coupled with their lack of support outflanking. I would say you need to specialise them to be effective, these wonky 'all-round' units never seem to work.

 

So I would say if you need combi weapons, choose one option for the whole squad.

 

Strictly speaking, you don't need those combi weapons when you are getting all those power weapons hits + two bolter shots off of each + you can shoot and charge.

 

Keep em simple, but I like your idea of the 2 axe 2 maul 2 sword idea. It doesn't cost in points, but gives you that bit of flexibility if needed.

 

Maybe your upgrades should go towards upgrading the two swords to wolf claws. I think you can get them for 5 points if you upgrade the cc weap. Might be wrong don't have my dex on me.

 

GS

 

P.S maybe a chainfist wouldn't go amiss

[Quillen]

Wolf scouts work better. Not at living but at coming in the side you want. It's your call thou. I love my Wolf Guard Termies. I just drop pod them so I can get the close to where I really want. Everyone has their way of doing it thou. Find what works for you. Also I love the Cyclone and Wolf Claws combo. It costs but the guy is a death machine. I also made a Stormshield and Frost Axe with cyclone and he is a huge point sink that has yet to not make his points back. Which blows my mind but makes scense really. His a death machine.

[Brom MKIV]

CML vs the asscan is a tradeoff, both are fine but I wouldn't be too concerned about board edge since acute senses means only 1/9 of hitting the wrong side.

[Meatcaber]

Alrighty! Thank you all for replying :P

 

With SW I'm probably going with all infantry/cavalry/beasts - my BA has Drop Pods, Dreads and Flyers, will want to do something different with the SW.

 

680 points has now turned into 600 points plus a pack of Fenrisian Wolves. With the rest of the army footslogging it across the board, would be nice to have a reactive unit to get into my opponents deployment zone, or wherever else they might be needed. I think even just the threat of having 8-10 outflanking Termies will give my enemy some concerns.

 

If it was a choice between Arjac or maxing out the unit, then the unit will get maxed out. As good as Arjac looks I don't know if he's 188 points worth of good and I can give the WG equipment to do similar things for cheaper.

 

Have a RP included already (he's my allied HQ) but he's going to be with a GH squad + the WC/PF WG (to take a challenge on the RP's behalf).

 

Already included a chainfist, greysquigg, how about another? Swapping the power swords for wolf claws is an excellent idea, only an extra 10 points! Might still keep a single sword just for the sake of variety ;)

 

So, the 'less is more' approach seems to be the way to go, trimmed the unit down a bit, might still be a bit 'wonky' but I think it's a little more focussed now instead trying to cover everything. Trading the 570 unit for a 470 point unit, it will look something like this:

 

10 Wolf Guard in Terminator Armour;

2x Wolf Claw; 2x Chainfist; 2x Cyclone Missile Launcher;

1x Wolf Claw & Powerfist; 1x Storm Shield; 2x Combi-Plasma

 

Still leaves me with 5 power weapons, sword, 2 mauls and 2 axes?

 

The WP has a maul and a plasma pistol, SotH and a Wolftail Talisman (got the limited edition DV chaplain - need to use him for something, right?) so he gives the WG quite a few benefits - outflank, fearless, preferred enemy and some protection vs psychic powers (you guys probably know all of this already, though :D ). Plus, it will be a very rare occurrence if he gets into a challenge so the WG will continue reaping the benefits he brings.

 

 

Some interesting load outs there, Quillen, rather on the pricey side and I'm trying to keep 'em cheap and effective - don't think I really managed the 'cheap' part. Glad it works for you, though!

[Brom MKIV]

That's much better but be aware that as a unit wolf guard have no characters so no challenges. They only become characters as pack leaders so it might be advisable to get runic armour for the priest. Note that it is commonly accepted that runic is power armour so the priest can still take Hunters saga.

 

Lastly one more try at convincing you on the assault cannons: preferred enemy has really nice synergy with 8 rending shots plus ACs are great for hordes and better vs flyers too which wolves generally suffer against. leave the missiles to your long fangs and give those guards some serious dakka!

[skeletoro]

My ideal unit of wolf guard at the moment:

 

6 in TDA

1x WC + CF (killing tanks)

1x storm shield + PA (allocate AP2 attacks to this guy first)

1x combi + WC (can dash in at initiative 4 to intercept AP3 attacks, ensuring that even if you're charged, you have some TDA to allocate AP3 attacks to)

3x combi + PA

 

4 in Power armor

4x PA

 

I'd probably make the combi 2 or 3 plasma, the rest melta.

 

And then I'd put them in a LRC. I think outflanking is a waste on units with relentless. And wolf guard are an inferior shooting unit, and not very survivable (for the points). Charging out of an assault ramp vehicle is the way to go, imo.

[Meatcaber]

That's much better but be aware that as a unit wolf guard have no characters so no challenges. They only become characters as pack leaders so it might be advisable to get runic armour for the priest. Note that it is commonly accepted that runic is power armour so the priest can still take Hunters saga.

 

Well, that does suck! Having read through the FAQ confirms this, thanks for highlighting it for me :P

 

Assault Cannons? Okay then, I'll try them!

 

 

Skeletoro, totally agree with some of your equipment choices, I'll adopt some. Keeping 'em all in TDA armour, it's only an extra 5 points and the unit has plenty of attacks already!

 

Is one chainfist generally enough, even with the CF +WC combo for that extra attack? I like this set up, but I've also got another chainfist in the unit currently.