Any Forge World in your army?

[ianj253]

Hey all, I'd been contemplating placing an order from Forge world and now that 6th has incorporated FW units into all games it seems more practical to actually get some stuff! I was wondering if any of you guys included any FW in your army or had experience using it? I'd been looking at the deimos executioner and the caestus assault ram so any insight on these would be helpful.

[Paulochromis]

... and now that 6th has incorporated FW units into all games ...

What do you mean by this?

 

Most tournaments (well here, anyway) still don't allow FW rules.

You can still use FW models/figures (e.g. Korvydae as Captain with JP+TH, Storm Eagle as Storm Raven, Contemptor as Dreadnought...).

[ianj253]

Every tourney in my area now allows FW. They just don't allow super heavies ie Titans. Most of the major tourneys now also allow FW. I think NOVA and Feast Of Blades (Major US tournaments) both allowed them this year.

 

Edit: FOB allowed 40k approved FW units. So both the caestus and demios would be okay. Nova is looking into allowing them in 2013 and Adepticon is allowing them at their 2013 event. I'd say allowing FW is going to be the status quo now, so I'd expect to see it in Australia now as well

[Deschenus Maximus]

I have a bad case of butterfingeritis, so that leaves out any resin models for me.

[DominicJ]

I was under the impression FW was now store legal?

[Deschenus Maximus]

The "legality" of FW models matters little in the end. TOs get the final say for their respective tournament, and in friendly games, you can insist as much as you want that you can use your FW models without my permission, if I pack up my models and leave what are you going to do?

[DominicJ]

Your meta may vary.

If you said 'i'm not playing against forge world' and went home.

I would play someone else, and the staff would rig the draw until you played against fw or stopped coming....

[Deschenus Maximus]

the staff would rig the draw until you played against fw or stopped coming....

 

FW would have to become massively more widespread for that to be even possible. And assuming it did, I could only see GW stores having such a policy. Since I don't frequent these, the argument doesn't apply to me.

[Leksington]

Every tourney in my area now allows FW. They just don't allow super heavies ie Titans. Most of the major tourneys now also allow FW. I think NOVA and Feast Of Blades (Major US tournaments) both allowed them this year.

 

Edit: FOB allowed 40k approved FW units. So both the caestus and demios would be okay. Nova is looking into allowing them in 2013 and Adepticon is allowing them at their 2013 event. I'd say allowing FW is going to be the status quo now, so I'd expect to see it in Australia now as well

That didn't sound quite right to me so I looked up the rules for each of those events.

-The Adepticon 40K championship rules say they are not allowing FW rules for 2013.

http://www.adepticon.org/13rules/201340Kchamp.pdf

"Forge World/Imperial Armor units are NOT[emphasis is theirs] allowed in the Warhammer 40K Championships; however players may still use their Forge World models to represent a unit from their codex."

However they are allowing FW rules in some of their other 40K events.

 

-FOB had a no FW rule policy for the most competitive of their events (the Invitational). They did allow FW rules in their soft score friendly Open event (scoring: 60% battle, 20% paint, 20% sportsmanship).

 

-NOVA is looking for feedback from players to see if they will include FW rules this year, but that is hardly a yes.

 

 

Obviously this is not an exhaustive list of tournaments, but it seems that FW is still fairly off limits in the ultra competitive environment (but gaining wider acceptance in the fluffier events).

[DominicJ]

As I said, your Meta may vary.

[mmaarrkk]

I did have a caetus but in wolves colours so sold it and looking to replace it with a new one next year, as for the other stuff I have, Land raider Achilles, Servin Loth and 8 hyperios air defence launchers. Looking to buy a lot more of the characters next year and a storm eagle plus Caetus plus another LR or two.

[ianj253]

Didn't think FW garnered such negative feedback from some players. Some of you are coming across as quite hostile towards the stuff! As this is the first year this stuff has been allowed, I see it becoming a norm in the future. Regardless, my local meta allows FW in tournaments.

 

@Mmarrrk, Thanks for sharing and I'm glad someone has some experience with the stuff. Caestus loaded with TWC seems like it'd be a beat stick! Did you ever run it alongside a Stormraven? I wanted to include a Caestus and a SR in a list at 1750. You think thats a viable and competitive combo?

[Brother_Angelus]

The standard responses are;

"Forgeworld units are overpowered"

"It costs too much to know what each unit can do, and if I don't know what it does, how can I prepare for it"

 

While there are some truely stand out units in some of the books, they're largely flavour pieces which are no better (and in many cases much worse) than codex units. I'm working myself up to buy a trio of contemptor dreadnoughts for a vanilla marine army and a couple of Hades breaching drills for my engineer/artillery themed IG army. The models are undeniably cool, and really break up the uniformity of codex choices.

[mmaarrkk]

Didn't think FW garnered such negative feedback from some players. Some of you are coming across as quite hostile towards the stuff! As this is the first year this stuff has been allowed, I see it becoming a norm in the future. Regardless, my local meta allows FW in tournaments.

 

@Mmarrrk, Thanks for sharing and I'm glad someone has some experience with the stuff. Caestus loaded with TWC seems like it'd be a beat stick! Did you ever run it alongside a Stormraven? I wanted to include a Caestus and a SR in a list at 1750. You think thats a viable and competitive combo?

 

 

In the uk FW is becoming a lot more widespread in tournies.

 

Only once did I bust out the Caestus and 2 storm ravens against chaos list a few months back, didnt use the caestus as a transport though and it didnt really do much!, even when shooting at bunched up defilers, it was as a apoc table and because of the short range of the weapon couldnt quite get into 12inch range for the first shot (well i could have but then 2nd turn on the table would have been useless as too far forward) so i shot at marines behind a aegis....

[MrSocks]

Every army I have has something forgeworld in it, whether it is just a converted captain or commander or a unit. However since the GW stores near me seem to frown upon the use of forgeworld miniatures unless you brill your £100 10kg book with you I generally use them as normal units within the codex.

 

So my Blood Angels Sternguard are made from Mark III Iron Armour

 

I like the additional individuality the kits bring to your units and to your army as a whole, and buying some units are not much more expensive than their GW counterparts. With regards to using forgeworld units, I haven't tried it with space marines but I have used my Tau battlesuits from there, and they're not overpowered, if anything they're far too expensive once they've been upgraded to being useful however they do add a bit of flavour to your list and make things a bit different for your opponent (especially if you fight them a lot).

 

I think I'm a bit of a forgeworld addict though, so I may be a little biased hence I'm hoping to get a contemptor in the near future :cuss.

[the jeske]

The standard responses are;

"Forgeworld units are overpowered"

"It costs too much to know what each unit can do, and if I don't know what it does, how can I prepare for it"

 

While there are some truely stand out units in some of the books, they're largely flavour pieces which are no better (and in many cases much worse) than codex units. I'm working myself up to buy a trio of contemptor dreadnoughts for a vanilla marine army and a couple of Hades breaching drills for my engineer/artillery themed IG army. The models are undeniably cool, and really break up the uniformity of codex choices.

your forgetting one more thing . FW is imperial only with some eldar units , if you play something like nids , sob or orcs there is absolutly nothing to take which may compare to taking of lucius pods in 5th , castus rams , armored company in 3ed etc.

[JamesI]

I have some FW models and bits, but I don't use any FW units. Can't take them to local events, so I can't see much point in buying a rulebook I won't get to use often.

[IK Viper]

I have only limited experience with and aginast FW so this is simply my opinion but from a quick look through several of the IA books you can quickly figure out why they are titled IMPERIAL ARMOR... FW really likes IG and SM's of all chapters... I play BA and this would be a great advantage to me but honestly I don't see it as fair that the books lean so heavily toward some factions while ignoring others. For this reason I think FW should NOT be allowed because it is even more unbalancing to the game then it already is due to the Golden Rule (the Goldend Rule of GW "he who has the gold to buy the most NEW stuff wins"). GW should just add a few (playtested) FW units to the each codex and leave it at that. But until then FW is to inconsistant to be considered for a competative setting,

[Chaplain Admetus]

I own two FW things - a Shas'o R'Myr battlesuit for my tau (and he's been occasionally used, mostly the model is just awesome but the rules are a bit poop), and one of the land-speeder variants (I forget the exact name), and that's been used purely as a land speeder with assault cannon. I have a bit of a high-horse about playing against FW stuff personally... I've yet to say no when an opponent asks if he can use FW stuff, but I don't like it when I get a pick-up game against someone and suddenly its all forge world nonsense with the bare minimum codex choices. Essentially I'm normally fine playing against it unless I'm getting practice in for Throne of Skulls or something (where no FW is allowed), but I appreciate having my opponent check first. Some of the FW stuff is fine, but some of it is a bit too strong for friendly games, especially if the other player isn't using forge world.

 

Oh, and Jeske, FW has a lot of tau stuff too (and its much better than the codex stuff... don't get me started on that ridiculous drone fighter thing) - Imperials and Tau seem to have gotten the most love from FW. I agree with your point that its unbalanced in favour of certain factions, certainly.

[Leksington]

Didn't think FW garnered such negative feedback from some players. Some of you are coming across as quite hostile towards the stuff! As this is the first year this stuff has been allowed, I see it becoming a norm in the future. Regardless, my local meta allows FW in tournaments.

I don't think people are really quite as hostile as they might sound. I don't want competitive tournaments to embrace FW, but at the same time, I am more than happy to line my soldiers up against your FW models. I'd bet this is common amongst those who argue against the "legality" of FW models. (they are all puppy dogs under that gruff exterior)

[mmaarrkk]

The most moaning I have seen because of FW being allowed in a tourny was after a team tourny in September, it was FW allowed and a lot of people took hyperios air defence launchers, and of course a few people spammed them (as well as saber defence things), there was a lot of moaning after from some of the 'top' players, why, because of interceptor and the fact they spammed flyers, and from the demon players of all people, majority who were spamming screamers and flamers. My reply to that was simple, spam begets spam, from FW or from GW. There is little in the books that is a game changer, one of the most powerful units imo is the achilles as it ignores meltas and is -1 to the damage table results, but you pay 75pts extra for that, the caetus sounds a nice unit but in game play turns was underwhelming, I am currently using some of the hyperios now, in 3 games that I have used them they have done very little, in the first game just couldnt get pens on the flyers (cron air), second game they did half their job and created a deep strike denial zone (nids) and third game failed to take down a vendetta while the quad gun hurt it the next round then it was finished off by dakka dakka dread in the same round.

 

Servin Loth does sound pretty darn impressive though.

[Brother_Angelus]

your forgetting one more thing . FW is imperial only with some eldar units , if you play something like nids , sob or orcs there is absolutly nothing to take which may compare to taking of lucius pods in 5th , castus rams , armored company in 3ed etc.

Sure, Imperials get the most options, but there are still things available for Orks and SoB (Nids don't get any love from GW or FW).

 

This isn't 3rd or 5th though, its 6th.

[JamesI]

Didn't think FW garnered such negative feedback from some players. Some of you are coming across as quite hostile towards the stuff! As this is the first year this stuff has been allowed, I see it becoming a norm in the future. Regardless, my local meta allows FW in tournaments.

I don't think people are really quite as hostile as they might sound. I don't want competitive tournaments to embrace FW, but at the same time, I am more than happy to line my soldiers up against your FW models. I'd bet this is common amongst those who argue against the "legality" of FW models. (they are all puppy dogs under that gruff exterior)

Basically this.

 

I don't want to see FW at a tournament, and I don't want someone telling me I have to let them use it. But someone tells me politely what they want to use I'm fine with that.

[MrSocks]

The most moaning I have seen because of FW being allowed in a tourny was after a team tourny in September, it was FW allowed and a lot of people took hyperios air defence launchers, and of course a few people spammed them (as well as saber defence things), there was a lot of moaning after from some of the 'top' players, why, because of interceptor and the fact they spammed flyers, and from the demon players of all people, majority who were spamming screamers and flamers. My reply to that was simple, spam begets spam, from FW or from GW. There is little in the books that is a game changer, one of the most powerful units imo is the achilles as it ignores meltas and is -1 to the damage table results, but you pay 75pts extra for that, the caetus sounds a nice unit but in game play turns was underwhelming, I am currently using some of the hyperios now, in 3 games that I have used them they have done very little, in the first game just couldnt get pens on the flyers (cron air), second game they did half their job and created a deep strike denial zone (nids) and third game failed to take down a vendetta while the quad gun hurt it the next round then it was finished off by dakka dakka dread in the same round.

 

Servin Loth does sound pretty darn impressive though.

 

This ^^

 

Most of Forgeworld is not overpowered, and actually mostly annoys players because they are used to winning via spamming a specific type of unit (such as necrons spamming flyers) and some FW models can counter this, though for the most part they make no difference. However I prefer tournaments not to include forgeworld models as it is much fairer on armies that lack significant forgeworld ranges, or perhaps have a Tournament FW book that includes 1 or 2 units from each army that are usable in tournaments. So for instance XV 9 battlesuits or the Prometheus Land Raider, nothing game changing but just to add a bit of of variety to tournament lists.

 

I don't mind fighting against forgeworld units as long as my opponent tells me what they do and it isn't stupidly overpowered or inappropriate for the game size.

[j-smuv]

I frequently run a list with FW Dreadnought arms, and I have a Deimos Pattern Predator. I infrequently run a Land Raider Proteus. The Augury Web is very useful, but you give up the assault function of the LR. I'm still finding it's place in my list. I have a Chaplain Dreadnaught too, but I've never ran him.

 

I tend to agree with previous posters that the range from Forge World is generally over costed, and underwhelming.

 

My game club allows Forge World in it's tournaments, and it's not a problem:

 

-A member of our game club runs his FW Tau at our tournaments: XV-9s, drone fliers, the whole bit. It's far from unbeatable. In fact, I'm more scared of his IG.

 

-Another member runs MegaDreads for his Orks, but his 3 GW fliers are what do the damage.

 

-Another member runs an Eldar flier from FW, because he wouldn't get one otherwise. It far from breaks the list.

 

 

The Forge World problem is only relevant because of the transition of the game in general. 6th is meant to be a more casual experience. And GW is pushing that HARD. The inclusion of FW underscores that. But GW can't tell tournament organizers whether or not to ban FW. And GTs should ban FW if it goes against the established feel of the tournament. For example: when I choose to go to NoVA or Astronomi-con I am essentially choosing the type of gamer I will face. But whether the inclusion of FW is the exception or the rule you ultimately control what games you play. I just hope all the guys opposed to FW are opposed because of actual game experiences, and not theoretical game experiences.