Tactical marines deployed en mass

[Garath]

It was a successful week for me as I took an old 3rd company doctrine with lots of tactical squads and came in 2nd in a tournament out of 32.

 

You can find a detailed report of the first 2 out of 3 rounds here

 

 

This tactica's goal is to improve our tactical marines effectiveness overall , as that alone can be their weakness on their own.

 

 

 

Stats

 

I'm not going to list stats per se, just point you to the fact that our troopers have 4s across the board, and very,very good LD.

 

The stat often overlooked is pts cost. No other codex sports such a cheap model with all the options as a tactical marine. T. marines will come on top in an engagement against 80% of other troopers in ratio 1:1. The question is only in which phase of the game. Against some troops , this might me in cc (like IG). 10 guardsmen will not hold up against 10 marines.

Other times (and most likely) -rapid fire. Later on that.

 

How come pts cost in itself is an advantage?

 

 

Outnumbering by force

 

 

For the same number of pts, other armies get multiple troopers . How does this work to our advanatge?

 

I'll give you an example. Let's take a tac squad ,give it a m.launcher and a flamer with the sarge having bolt pistol &cc weapon. This comes out 180 pts.

 

An Ork gets a mob of Shoota Boyz and a Nob for the same price. Let's say the Nob has a Power Klaw,Boss pole and 'Eavy armor. He is 45 pts with all that- and needs it. That leaves us with 135 pts of shoota boyz. That's roughly 22-23 boyz.

 

How are 10 marines better then 23 boyz by numbers alone?

 

They, on their own aren't. But you can take multiples of 10 tactical marine. Someone might say- "but they can take them too"- while thank you imaginary proactive voice nay sayer.

 

The Ork player's troubles begin around number 3. As soon as we have 3 tactical sqauds - they orks are in trouble. They have 69 boyz by that time. But all those models take up so much space it's impossible to avoid either moving slowly and spread out to avoid casualties from all those templates ,or being bunched up and suffering from those same templates.

 

It might not work on paper, but it sure does on the table.

 

 

Rapid firing (moving and shooting)

 

"Or how I stopped worrying and loved the gun"

 

Bolters are a weapon to be feared. At first glance one might think it's only S 4 and Ap5- but the above example shows that the ork player might disagree. Before the squad shoots ,it gets to move.

That movement should be used to bring as many troopers into range. Furthermore, as many squads should join in as well. We pay premium pts for our guys- and rapid firing pays it all back.

 

CRFF

 

Close range fire fight. This is what we're after. 10 marines armed with a flamer and missile launcher firing frag wil:

Have 16 bolter and one bolt pistol shot- hitting around 10-11

The flamer should hit 5-6 (it's your job to make he reach them)

M.launcher should clip anothr 5

 

Added together- 23 wound rolls .

 

If you concentrated your fire onto the guys not in cover- that alone should bring you 11-12 dead boyz. This is a single squad of marines, and they are in the opponent's face by now. Two sqauds of marines can whipe out a whole unit that way.

This is "Outnumbering by force"- in fact it's troop quality . We are deploying the same number of models .Ours are better but require the same space.

We should aim for these kind of situations and create CRFF our tactical marines WILL win.

 

AIM, THEN FIRE!

 

Measure. Do it. Your marine can walk 6" and rapid fire 12" or shoot 24". That's 30" total. No trooper is safe from a marine 30" . The only question is how many shots can you bring to bear? It takes 6 wound rolls to kill a terminator. It takes 2 to kill an Ork in cover. Suddenly the terminator doesn't look so awesome. It is still,but in cc.

If 10 rapid firing marines cannot kill something- 20 sure have a better chance.

 

 

 

FORMATION LINES

 

You noticed for sure how I stated that marines rapid fire Orks (and everyone else for that matter ) but the m.launcher still fires to full effect.

 

We enter "DA CONGO LINE-AH" (Jamaican accent MHAN )

 

Congo line is great. I love C- line. C-line makes your opponent fear and hate tacticals. It' so easy- position your heavy weapon with a decent field of fire. Don't deploy it where it can see everything on the table. If your guy can see everything on the table- then vice versa is true also, and that might not be such a good thing at the end of the day.

When people say fire lanes- this is what they mean. Find a goo spot for your heavy weapon. It might have LOS to a side of the table,an important terrain feature , or a clearing with no cover. Deploy him, then the rest of the quad as normal.

 

When the time comes, your squad will stretch forming a Congo line to your heavy weapon . The idea is to bring bolters to CRFF and have your heavy weapon shot.

 

During deployment, pair your squads up . Consider where the 2 heavy weapons will be. Everything else can move and fire to full effect. 20 marines working together not only looks cool and fluffy- it works. 30 marines is overwhelming . We do this with the Congo line.

 

 

 

T-LINE

 

A modified version of the above, uses the basic troopers to take casualties for the SW and HW guys.

 

T- trooper

SW-special weapon

HW- heavy weapon

 

 

 

T T T T T T

 

SW

 

T

 

T

 

HW

 

 

This way, when casualties start coming in you will first loose troopers instead of more important squad members.

 

 

WEAPONS

 

Till now, I've only used flamers and m.launchers in my example. This is not strange, as our cheapest options (together with heavy bolter ) both flamer and m.launcher are very good weapons against 80% of opponents your tacticals will meet.

 

I'm not going to get into detail of every weapon, as this is common knowledge with hundreds of articles written on the matter. What is worth pointing out is that if deploying multiple marine squads working in pairs or trios- having different weapon options is a very good idea.

 

Have one squad with flamer,m-launcher and a PF/PW sarge- the other for anti tank or anti infantry.

 

 

Examples:

 

10 marines flamer,m-launcher and a PF/PW sarge

10 marines , plasma rifle,lass cannon

 

The first squad always moves to intercept infantry and take the charge (with overwatching flamer) .THe second sqaud rapid fires to lend a hand and deals with AV.

 

 

10 marines ,flamer,m-launcher and a PF/PW sarge

10 marines ,plasma gun,plasma cannon

 

Same as above, except they all kill infantry

 

 

Now imagine having 40 above squads working together and killing 2 units a turn? That's a mighty bunch!

 

 

SUPPORT

 

Rhinos

 

Not to be used like in 5th ed. Don't combat sqaud and drive around- you'll get yourself killed. If 10 marines need to get somwhere- load all 10 up and go! Move flat out and hug cover.

 

Empty rhinos

 

This is where it gets funky. If you tank shock a unit, it will move to the side - left all bunched up...against all those templates!!!

Rhino can move in the shooting phase now....after you shot with a tactical squad nearby. Just place the rhino between them and the enemy. Rhinos are still good, they are just not brain dead good like before

 

Whirlwind

 

Ahh...a big template to kill bunched up troops! Have you got a rhino?

 

Vindicator

 

It also has a big template. Trades range and indirect fire of Whirlwind for armour , and punch. Use to destroy enemy lines. Basically anything the enemy has and is not a flier or a MC has a chance - there's a chance it'll go down in one hit.

Tacticals in that case are used for cleanup. People will fear that thank, and rightfully so. Don't deploy it up front. Find a central spot outside LOS. Act from turn 2 ...once you have knocked out some enemy AT power.

 

 

Terminators

 

Terminators in a predominantly PA list are best used as objective grabbers. If you have Belial (and there's no reason not to)- they become scoring and get an apothecary.

Take a unit with hammers and a CML, put Belial in and deploy via deep strike. Don't use Deathwing assault- you don't want them arriving while it's still crowded. You want then when the enemy has already commited, deep striking far behind his lines near an isolated troop holding an objective that he taught was safe.

 

 

Land speeders

 

These are to be used as fast attack AT . Take one or two and give them CML . Drive on flanks and target sides of AV

[Nightmare84]

Don't mean to get negative.

But tacticals aren't a top tier troop choice.

Many other are way above, you can't compare models on a 1-1 basis thaw why there is a point cost system to compare. So 195 of tactical has a very hard time against same points of guard, tau or even orks. And that is not even counting into unlockable troop selections. In which case I personally place plague marines

[Garath]

I wasn't claiming they where.

 

 

A huge blob of IG or Orks cab easly be deal with a single whirlwind or vindicator ...and some tacticals. :)

 

Tank shock with rhino- they all bunch up- drop template- tacticals clean up.

 

 

Unlockable troop choices wet their pants before a vindicator, and often have mediocre answers to it. The point of my post was to show how to use tacticals in big numbers.

 

Plague marines and such cost a lot of pts for what they do. They still have a lower damage output then equivalent number of tacticals.

Especially when bodies start falling down. A Vindicator killing 5 tacticals will hamper the unit's damage output, but it will not cripple them. Plague marines taking such a hit will go down just as easy. But since they cost more, and are in smaller numbers- a single shot renders the unit useless.

 

Same goes for teminators without TH/SS

[Nightmare84]

Now you are adding components. Sure a vindi does huge damage but you have that means the enemy has 115ish points of something else. What answer does a tactical unit have to a vindi? 1x missile shot and a melta shot? Rendering 8 marines useless for a round. A vindi is almost always priority one when on the board anyway and isn't part of the conversation.

 

A equal unit of plague marines may have lower damage output (barely) than tacticals but it has the damage mitigation.

The biggest issue with tacticals is unit confusion and being on the move and either crippling a hw choice or even making it useless for a turn.

[Disciple of Caliban Sgt]

Long time Lurker first time posting. I appreciate the PA articles. I know Ravenwing and Deathwing are the beat all end all as people put it but its nice to see someone with experience give those of us who don't play much something to consider and a different method. I love our DA fluff but the ability of BA to play multiple types of armies and not get stomped is also nice. Hoping the new codex does the same and appreciate any and all articles about stuff that isn't played a lot.

 

Sgt

[Garath]

Now you are adding components. Sure a vindi does huge damage but you have that means the enemy has 115ish points of something else. What answer does a tactical unit have to a vindi? 1x missile shot and a melta shot? Rendering 8 marines useless for a round. A vindi is almost always priority one when on the board anyway and isn't part of the conversation.

 

A equal unit of plague marines may have lower damage output (barely) than tacticals but it has the damage mitigation.

The biggest issue with tacticals is unit confusion and being on the move and either crippling a hw choice or even making it useless for a turn.

 

 

Have to apologize for arguing your point about me adding components. My original post didn't include Vindicator indeed. This is purely out of reasons that I was typing the text, copy/pasted it to my open topic. The part with Vindicator was left out by mistake.

 

I have added it after this post from you. So in that light your argument stands. Your argument that there are better troop choices out there is true - but I want to help people use them.

 

I will also edit my post where I'm trying to argue your point as it serves no purpose.

 

 

Sorry again

 

 

G_

[Big Brother]

Thanks for this! I'm still new to 40k, and really enjoy some of these basic tactical articles, even if they are for units I may not use a lot.

[Harleqvin]

I do hope they do some stuff with the PA DA. I mean it would be great if they were more on par with the rest of the PA Marines, points wise and all. I do like that we can, currently, take some special weapons without being a full 10-man squad and all. If you are going smaller squads that is.

 

Since getting rid of almost all of my DA in PA, I have mostly been using DW & RW. Glad people are still doing Greenwing :)

[The Wolfmeister]

Question: When you were talking about the Congo line method are you saying that you can move everyone else in the squad except the heavy and thus the heavy will fire at full BS? I ask because my friend and I just played a game and were under the impression that if any member of the squad moved then the heavy fires snap shots, even if he didn't personally move.

[Garath]

Yes. The models that moved count as moved. Not the units. So if trooper A moves and Trooper B doesn't- then Trooper B counts as stationary in the following shooting phase

[Haranin]

Even in a DW or RW army, tacticals have their place. Much more efficient to shove an unit of tacticals behind an aegis defense line with a quad gun or icarus lascannon then deathwing or ravenwing.