How big are Lunar class vessels?

[Raven Angel]

Brothers I have a problem. I can't find a first tear source for the size of starships in BFG. I have 2 second tear sources for the length of the Lunar Class. The Rogue Trader books give a length of 5 km but the story Mortal fuel by Richard Williams gives a length of 8 km and it is the older source but like I said neither are considered first tear so which measure should I use? It is important because it effect all the calculations down the road.

[Kol Saresk]

Would the BFG Downloadable content form GW work? I know it has most of the ship classifications and their sizes, but I'm not sure if it is what you're looking for or not...

 

LINKY

[Raven Angel]

I've got all that stuff and their is no mention unless i missed it. any other ideas?

[Rider-75]

I always think of "class" as just that, the same way as real world warship classes work, rather than being specific. So if it is a capital class ship, within the criteria of "Lunar Class", such as warp drive power, main engine power, main armament, secondary/defensive armament, shield levels, etc then it's a Lunar Class ship.

 

That way, each ship will vary from ship to ship, but still fall within a specific type.

 

So yes, a Lunar class could be over 5km long, or it could be up to 8km long.

[Techmarine Data007]

Rider has a point in that there are forgeworld type variations. Though not quite enough to account for that difference, but it's there. Consider the term Lunar Class a general specification. Akin to how there are a dozen different patterns of the basic Leman Russ chassis.

[Raven Angel]

Considering the size of these things I could except 2 or 3 hundred meters of length variation. You can account forth at with prow or thruster differences but 3 km is not a variation it is a contradicting discrepancy. There's no logical way even considering the hinkyness of the Mechanicum to account for that. one source must be in error. I'm just not sure which one. I'm hoping some on has more conclusive info to make a determination.

[Azatoth]

Well I always use:

 

Jeff Russels Starship dimensions page

 

You will find the Cobra under 2x and an Emperor Class Battleship under 10x (The Cobra is there again too). There are a number of other ships from different works there. Battlestar Galactica will actually easily fit into the prow structure of a 40K Battlehip. :D

 

The Luna Class has 2 Batteries compared to a Battleships 3, so I would assume that they are around 5 kilometers or about 3.2 miles long.

[Olis]

Considering the size of these things I could except 2 or 3 hundred meters of length variation. You can account forth at with prow or thruster differences but 3 km is not a variation it is a contradicting discrepancy. There's no logical way even considering the hinkyness of the Mechanicum to account for that. one source must be in error. I'm just not sure which one. I'm hoping some on has more conclusive info to make a determination.

 

Consider this - it is stated on page 189 in the Rogue Trader core rulebook that each and every ship is different:

 

...ships are never mass-produced, and even two ships of the same class are rarely alike. A Lunar-class cruiser produced in the shipyards of Mars will be vastly different from another Lunar hailing from [the] docks of Port Wrath.

 

And on page 196 that the Lunar class could be produced by presumably many Imperial worlds:

 

Its (relatively) uncomplicated design dates back to the dawn of the Imperium, and it can be constructed at worlds normally unable to build a ship of the line.

 

With that in mind and the likely difference in 1) build quality and 2) materials used (due to specs and availability), I for one would not be surprised at a variation of up to three thousand metres in length. I would think a major factor would be the engines of the vessels - these are very large components that, chances are, require a lot of expertise and technical knowledge. The larger the engines, the less refined the knowledge and materials involved are - thus the longer a vessel. Perhaps another component that could vary wildly is the prow. Maybe it's design relies upon the preferences of the project master, maybe not. However, it stands to reason that a ceramic-based prow could be smaller by volume than, say, a steel one, given the same protective qualities of both. Yet another thing that would vary because of materials and actual specs would be the superstructure of the vessel herself. Maybe there are more compartments in one particular vessel compared to another Lunar-Class, maybe the compartments themselves are larger for whatever reason.

 

So, logically speaking, I would think such variation is possible and both sources correct, just that one is a possible minimum and one is a possible maximum.

[Azatoth]

Though I understand and can agree with the "each ship is unique" credo, I still believe that a variance in 3km is too big, mabe a couple hundred meters, but a 8km long Lunar is longer then a Battleship, even if it might lack its mass. There is a point where a cruiser stops being a cruiser.

[Olis]

What's to say battleships don't vary in size and length either, brother?

[Raven Angel]

I agree that each ship is very unique but 3km is several orders of magnitude outside of what even the Mechanicum would except I think. Remember with the ritualized nature of this and the slavish adherence to STC specifications I'm not sure they would sanction such a change, at least not under the same class. Personally I'm inclined to go with the larger length just because it feels more epic to me. It means a lot of recalculating of the RT stats but that's fine. Any other ideas or info guys?

[Azatoth]

If you check BFG.pdfs and assume that the weaponbatteries of the ships are the same size (Because it was the same module of course), the Lunar Class is not significantly longer/bigger then the standart BFG cruiser from the boxes. My personal impression is that it seems to be "sleeker". You can dl or take a look at the BFG.pdfs at the GW site under specialist games.

[Raven Angel]

I have all of them and their is no length info

[Azatoth]

I have all of them and their is no length info

 

Well it has already been stated that the Lunar Class is a Cruiser Class. It has the 2 Batteries per side most Imperial Cruisers have.

 

Assuming that the cruisers and battleships in BFG are the same scale, you can simply use a ruler and some basic math to get a result. Personally I do not think that will be much variation in a class, at most +/- 30%, so you get around 5-6km length.

 

Of course, if you need the absolute, GW approved length to the meter, good luck with that.

[Olis]

Is this the link you wanted to get working? <_<

 

http://cs9738.userapi.com/u36658535/653308/z_07f68cf0.jpg

[Raven Angel]

Well I was hoping that some where a GW publication had weighed in on it. While exact specifications ala Trek would be nice I am a realist and would settle for one class and it's length cause I can math out

[Azatoth]

Is this the link you wanted to get working? :tu:

 

http://cs9738.userapi.com/u36658535/653308/z_07f68cf0.jpg

 

Yeah I made the mistake to use the link tool instead of writing it directly thank you.

 

Well I was hoping that some where a GW publication had weighed in on it. While exact specifications ala Trek would be nice I am a realist and would settle for one class and it's length cause I can math out

 

The Imperial Retribution Class Battleship BloodHawk, from Battlefleet Gothic, 7.5km long.

[Raven Angel]

Source?

[TrashMan]

Stick with 6km. A nice, round number.

 

And honestly, 5km is MASSIVE. I think people really fail to comprehend the scale.

 

Look here for an example:

http://wiki.freespacegalaxy.de/doku.php?id...essenvergleiche

 

Now those scales are for a 2.1km long warship.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I always think of "class" as just that, the same way as real world warship classes work, rather than being specific. So if it is a capital class ship, within the criteria of "Lunar Class", such as warp drive power, main engine power, main armament, secondary/defensive armament, shield levels, etc then it's a Lunar Class ship.

 

That way, each ship will vary from ship to ship, but still fall within a specific type.

 

So yes, a Lunar class could be over 5km long, or it could be up to 8km long.

coming from someone who is actually in the navy there are two kinds of designators of 'classes' capital ship, escort, (real life has sub as well)  then there is the a designator based on tonnage and weapons carrier, battleship, battlecruiser, grand cruiser, heavy cruiser, light cruiser, etc. then there is the actual class such as sword class frigates, cobra class destroyers, or in this case lunar class cruiser. 

 

any way lunar class cruiser will be a set size and over all tonnage, with a set and determined weapons load. for example in modern naval warfare we have the arliegh-burke class destroyers with the zumwalt class destroyer (i use the term destroyer loosely in modern connotations) both are 'destroyers' but one is nearly 200ft longer, has similar missile loads, but nearly 4 times the gun power. both are destroyers, but different class. each arliegh burke is 509'6" long, while the zumwalt is nearly 700ft long.

 

a lunar class cruiser WILL have exact specifications in lenght, height and beam. (idk does BFG measure draft from main deck down or is it just height from lowest point to highest?)

 

hope what i said made sense.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

 

Considering the size of these things I could except 2 or 3 hundred meters of length variation. You can account forth at with prow or thruster differences but 3 km is not a variation it is a contradicting discrepancy. There's no logical way even considering the hinkyness of the Mechanicum to account for that. one source must be in error. I'm just not sure which one. I'm hoping some on has more conclusive info to make a determination.

Consider this - it is stated on page 189 in the Rogue Trader core rulebook that each and every ship is different:

 

>>...ships are never mass-produced, and even two ships of the same class are rarely alike. A Lunar-class cruiser produced in the shipyards of Mars will be vastly different from another Lunar hailing from [the] docks of Port Wrath.

And on page 196 that the Lunar class could be produced by presumably many Imperial worlds:

 

Its (relatively) uncomplicated design dates back to the dawn of the Imperium, and it can be constructed at worlds normally unable to build a ship of the line.

With that in mind and the likely difference in 1) build quality and 2) materials used (due to specs and availability), I for one would not be surprised at a variation of up to three thousand metres in length. I would think a major factor would be the engines of the vessels - these are very large components that, chances are, require a lot of expertise and technical knowledge. The larger the engines, the less refined the knowledge and materials involved are - thus the longer a vessel. Perhaps another component that could vary wildly is the prow. Maybe it's design relies upon the preferences of the project master, maybe not. However, it stands to reason that a ceramic-based prow could be smaller by volume than, say, a steel one, given the same protective qualities of both. Yet another thing that would vary because of materials and actual specs would be the superstructure of the vessel herself. Maybe there are more compartments in one particular vessel compared to another Lunar-Class, maybe the compartments themselves are larger for whatever reason.

 

So, logically speaking, I would think such variation is possible and both sources correct, just that one is a possible minimum and one is a possible maximum.

 

even modern naval ships vary within a class. for example, my ship has only one CWIS while one 15yrs older may have 2CWIS. while i know all have a p-way port and starboard, a cross p-way forward midships, and aft, not all the spaces will be in exactly the same. heck contractors apologize when they hear my ship was built in pascagoula mississippi rather than bath maine. each ship will always be different, but the ships will be the same in lenght, height, and beam up to a foot or two (modern) or a couple hundred meters (BFG) but several km is just a ridiculous variation between ships of the same class.

 

the size of a ship is very important, because it will affect the handling of the ship and thus how you fight it. a 5km long ship will be naturally be able to make a sharper turn than an 8km ship even if the longer ship is 1or 200 meters smaller abeam.