Wound/Casualties with Multiple Squads Hit By a Template.

[Dark Legionnare]

Hey all.

 

We had a heated debate pop up last night over some shooting towards the latter half of the game. Wound allocation, and templates.

 

My buddy's DE raider had just been cracked open by shots the same turn and I had a Tactical squad in place ready to take advantage of that. They disembarked fine and plopped down around it. I've included a (shoddy) paint drawing of the scenario to help illustrate the issue with visuals. My paint skills are not magic and it doesn't look it, but the one model closest to the template in the tower's first floor is also under the template.

 

So what I did was pump everything into his carbine shooty-deathstar squad, focusing on it. Bolters, bolt pistol, and flamer; the template just also happened to cover the one Trueborn in front of it In the end I got 6 flamer wounds on the carbine squad, 1 flamer wound on the Trueborn squad, and 10 bolt wounds on the carbine squad.

http://i407.photobucket.com/albums/pp159/DarkLegionnare/40k/FlamerQuestion_zps98e0ba74.png

 

My logic was:

 

The Trueborn squad gets the one wound from the template, while the carbine squad gets the other 16 (6 from template, 10 from bolters.) He immediately removed the 3 Trueborn models as flamer deaths. This is where the butting heads started. To me it makes no sense that he did that, since only one Trueborn was hit by ANY enemy fire, ala, 1 wound on that squad.

 

His logic was that you "remove casualties" "Closest to the firing squad", which is too say letting the frail Trueborn soak up 2 extra wounds off of his death-star because the unit "was wounded" by the firing of that round.

 

The book doesn't cover the templates, or blast for that matter, other than saying "units under completely or partially are hit." I was going off of the old logic where you just do wounds per squad based on the amount they took. I'm not sure if this changed, enlighten me.

 

We rolled off in the end to see who's ruling won, he did. He then proceeded to kill 7 marines in one round of shooting with something like 38 poisoned shots or some ridiculousness like that, from the deathstar.

 

If someone can CITE rules and or weigh in on this, please do. To me, it makes logical sense that my way works. IE, only one wound was caused to the Trueborn, then should only get one death, not soak up 2 more, then go to the deathstar.

[Res Ipsa Loquitur]

In effect, the flamer has two target units and hits/wounds caused on each should be treated separately. The Trueborn only suffered one hit, therefore can only suffer one wound, therefore can only have one model removed.

 

p.6 "A unit takes a hit for each model that is fully, or even partially, underneath the template."

 

Ergo, two target units.

 

p.14 "To determine whether a hit causes a telling amount of damage, compare the weapon's Strength characteristic with the target's Toughness characteristic using the To Wound chart."

 

p.14 "total up the number of wounds you have caused. Keep the dice that have scored Wounds and create a'pool', where each dice represents a wound."

 

p.15 "Next, allocate an unsaved wound to the enemy model closest to the firing unit. Reduce that model's Wounds by 1. If the model is reduced to 0 Wounds, remove it as a casualty. Continue allocating unsaved wounds to the closest model until there are no more wounds left, or the whole unit has been removed as casualties."

 

These rules deal with a single target unit. There is no provision for wounds caused to one target unit to be transferred to another target unit. Once the wound pool for the Trueborn squad is reduced to 0, there can be no more casualties from that unit.

[nurglez]

I totally agree with the above post, and well done for citing all the relevant rule points :lol:

[awfulawful]

Nails it

 

That's it right there, references and all. Well done.

[Dark Legionnare]

In effect, the flamer has two target units and hits/wounds caused on each should be treated separately. The Trueborn only suffered one hit, therefore can only suffer one wound, therefore can only have one model removed.

 

p.6 "A unit takes a hit for each model that is fully, or even partially, underneath the template."

 

Ergo, two target units.

 

p.14 "To determine whether a hit causes a telling amount of damage, compare the weapon's Strength characteristic with the target's Toughness characteristic using the To Wound chart."

 

p.14 "total up the number of wounds you have caused. Keep the dice that have scored Wounds and create a'pool', where each dice represents a wound."

 

p.15 "Next, allocate an unsaved wound to the enemy model closest to the firing unit. Reduce that model's Wounds by 1. If the model is reduced to 0 Wounds, remove it as a casualty. Continue allocating unsaved wounds to the closest model until there are no more wounds left, or the whole unit has been removed as casualties."

 

These rules deal with a single target unit. There is no provision for wounds caused to one target unit to be transferred to another target unit. Once the wound pool for the Trueborn squad is reduced to 0, there can be no more casualties from that unit.

Thank you kindly sir. These were the rules and logic in my head that I was trying to express last night but he didn't understand the way I worded it and wanted exact rulings. I'll link him this right away.

[Axagoras]

No you dont understand, the trueborn knew how valuable the deathstar unit is so they sacrificed themselves to protect them from the fire. (Im joking) But thanks Res Ipsa Loquitur for listing that, would of taken me a while to dig up the pages.