Uses for Deathwing

[Tiger9gamer]

Boy am I busy in this section of what? too much free time me thinks

Anyways, I've been writing lists non-stop, and found out that I don't know how to use the Death wing that well. I know most people are figureing it out too, but every time I try and build a list With deathwing in it, I always budget them out for Tanks and more tactical squads. They seem so expensive compared to the greenwing!

How do you use them, Even With beliel?

[Brother dean]

Now before the codex, but after 6th. I had come back to running 6 shooty* squads, Belial and a dread. Either Groundpounding or DWAing a squad or two, just because tanks dont seem to be as viable in 6th.

 

*Edit: You mingt need to know the type...

[AngelVeto]

I have t used the new codex yet, still building all my new stuff, but I made a list where I didn't have tanks, all I had was TDA squads and I found myself with 180 points left over so for now threw in a nephelm for support but with the new DWA and belial having a teleport homer there are tons of options. Best option is to play a few games and tweak your list accordingly.

[Sarducci]

Played some tournament team practice games yesterday, and had interesting results. First, it was almost exclusively Deathwing, except for a Nephelim Fighter (mainly for seeing how it works on the table) and Sammael on his speeder. All three games were massive DA victories. This was against our tournament roster of Orks. Belial and Deathwing Knight deepstrike as a unit, and Sammael starts on the board. On turn 2, the rest of the army arrives via deep strike within 6", or at a safe distance for scatter. The major results were

 

1) Very precise landing, and the flank of your choice can be easily overrun.

2) Deathwing Knights are amazing. T5 in base to base, and the precise strike took out a nob and warboss before they could strike.

3) Shooty terminators with reroll and split fire are amazing.

 

For the record, we took 5th overall at Adepticon last year, and won Best Tacticians. Our Ork list is very strong, and we aren't new/bad players. We were amazed, and considering a change to DA.

[Tiger9gamer]

So belial can be a real curb stomper when it comes to that. Okay, good to know!

[Ronin_eX]

Deathwing make awesome flankers (especially when you attach Belial). They are guaranteed on turn 1 or 2, so no worrying about timing and on the turn they come in their weapons are counted as twin-linked. Drop a squad or two in and roll up an enemy flank with precise fire. Split fire makes them effective against a variety of targets and allows you to efficiently maximize their firepower each turn. Unless fielding Belial to try and make a very precise attack with a large unit, 5-man units with one heavy are best because split fire only works on one heavy at a time.

 

Deathwing Knights are a great bodyguard unit and Deathstar for our characters. Eternal Warrior is a rarity in our list, but due to Fortress of Shields we can get the next best thing: T5. Plonk a character down in the center of them, form up a tight grouping around them and you have a character that is only taken down by S10 shots! In combat they require a bit of timing to use properly, but even in my first game I could see the potential they had. You Cannot Hide is a marvelous rule, especially on the turn you Smite. In a mad gambit I refused the challenge (Knight Master can't Smite anyways) and utilized that rule to aim S10AP2 attacks right at enemy characters. A great way of assassinating enemy warlords.

 

The Deathwing Command Squad didn't get as much love because Belial doesn't make it a troops choice, but it has a few advantages. It takes up no FOC slots, it is unlocked by any character in terminator armour, its Champ carries one of the best weapons in the game against other terminators and it can take banners. While the DW Company Banner is really only something a pure DW force can take advantage of the Dark Angels have a load of banners at their disposal. The DW Command Squad makes a great banner bearing unit simply because it can be made tough as nails. Drop in an Apothecary and some TH/SS guys and you have something that can stand up to a bit of punishment. Alternatively, in non-DW armies that happen to have a TDA-equipped character, they can be used to take the load off of our stuffed Elite slots to field more non-scoring Deathwing. Equip them as a normal squad and they are still worth every point. They still have DWA, Vengeful Strike and Split Fire so they lost out on nothing and take up absolutely no slot. And since DW squads are ideally 5-man to maximize Split Fire, their fixed size is a non-issue when not fielding them with Belial.

[Tiger9gamer]

I played around with some terminators in place of Deathwing knight, and I noticed something. It seems harder to get an Artificer armor captain get in Base to base than a terminator captain. It seems pretty tough, but I guess, for them, positioning is everything. I have to find the best ways to put my regular captain close to them.

 

 

point is: is it better to have a regular captain or terminator captain for them?

[Cypher 102]

Don't spread your Deathwing across the board. If you pit 1000 points of Deathwing against 1000 points of their army you will more than likely lose because they have the numbers. The trick is to attack a flank and have your 1000 points of Deathwing pick on 500 or less points of their army.

 

Deathwing die more often from quantity of attacks or shots than quality.

 

With the advent of overwatch it is more important than ever that terminators be causing damage in both the shooting and assault phases. My hammernators have been getting screwed by overwatch lately because theft can't thin the herd a little in the shooting phase.

[CovertToaster]

With the advent of overwatch it is more important than ever that terminators be causing damage in both the shooting and assault phases. My hammernators have been getting screwed by overwatch lately because theft can't thin the herd a little in the shooting phase.

 

This is exactly why I favour assault cannons in 6th ed as they have a high RoF and rolling 1's kills any unit in the game.

It's more important now though to have a set gameplan when you build a deathwing army. Storm shields are more useful to footslogging DW armies as most of thier guns probably won't be in range on turn one. However if you are going to deepstrike or use transports then being able to kill your opponents outright will certainly limit retaliation.

 

It looks like we just have to get sneakier with our strategies as the days of a generic, felxible terminator squad may be gone. Not that it's a bad thing we just need to scour the codex to wring every once of cheese out of it.

[notmattlythgoe]

With the advent of overwatch it is more important than ever that terminators be causing damage in both the shooting and assault phases. My hammernators have been getting screwed by overwatch lately because theft can't thin the herd a little in the shooting phase.

 

This is exactly why I favour assault cannons in 6th ed as they have a high RoF and rolling 1's kills any unit in the game.

It's more important now though to have a set gameplan when you build a deathwing army. Storm shields are more useful to footslogging DW armies as most of thier guns probably won't be in range on turn one. However if you are going to deepstrike or use transports then being able to kill your opponents outright will certainly limit retaliation.

 

It looks like we just have to get sneakier with our strategies as the days of a generic, felxible terminator squad may be gone. Not that it's a bad thing we just need to scour the codex to wring every once of cheese out of it.

 

Why on earth would you think the flexible squad is a gonner? Now with vengeful strike and 10 man squad possibilities the mixed squad is even more powerful.

[puck]

So I'm a bit confused. Belial has a teleport homer. Which suggests the DWA should be centered on him however, all units performing the DWA go in together. So what do you guys use his homer for? subsequent drop pods?

[Ronin_eX]

So I'm a bit confused. Belial has a teleport homer. Which suggests the DWA should be centered on him however, all units performing the DWA go in together. So what do you guys use his homer for? subsequent drop pods?

 

Each unit can choose to go in on the first or second turn. They do not all need to choose the same turn (by my reading). Thus Belial is great when brought in with the vanguard units and provides a centre-point for later deployments. As I found out in my first game, bringing it all in on Turn 1 is not always the best plan.

[Slavik]

I thought I could split my DWA as well. My opponent (who was playing DA) pointed out that all DWA comes in one turn or the other. All DWA units arrive at the "start of the chosen turn".

[Nightmare84]

I think you can split dwa but I have done I all in one turn so far.

I don't want to cause issues with people I play with until there is a FAQ

 

But even dropping all in one turn I have won 3/3 games. Just having the garuntee I don't land piece meal gives too many options for opponent

 

 

[Harleqvin]

@Nightmare84 & Slavik - You can't split the DWA. It says tell your opponent which units are making a Deathwing Assault, and make a secret note of whether it takes place during your first or second turn. All units making the Deathwing Assault automatically arrive via Deep Strike at the start of the chosen turn - there is no need to roll for reserves.

I saw this but it didn't really hit me. DWCS Apothecary is a Character. So even though he can't have any options he has a 5+ chance to LO,S to tos something over to a TH/SS Member. Interesting. A little less sucky that he can't take options but still kinda sucky. lqtm

Sorry if this isn't where this should be.

[Harleqvin]

So I'm a bit confused. Belial has a teleport homer. Which suggests the DWA should be centered on him however, all units performing the DWA go in together. So what do you guys use his homer for? subsequent drop pods?

Each unit can choose to go in on the first or second turn. They do not all need to choose the same turn (by my reading). Thus Belial is great when brought in with the vanguard units and provides a centre-point for later deployments. As I found out in my first game, bringing it all in on Turn 1 is not always the best plan.

The reason one would want DWA DW(whatever unit) units coming in with Belial is so they don't scatter initially due to his precision. Also because of his Teleporthomer further units who DS in within 6" of him don't scatter.

Him just coming on to the field doesn't mean all other DWA DW (TDA) are non Scattering. Only the ones he is joined to, then the ones who DS within 6" of Belial. All the rest scatter as normal unless they are within 6" of another Teleporthomer. Then any other of the DW(TDA) who did not DWA now DS in on subsequent turns. They will scatter unless DS within 6" of a teleport homer. Sorry for reiterating but I wanted to make sure I was clear was all. So I apologize ahead of time

[facmanpob]

Rules Clarification:

Deathwing Assault - ...make a secret note of whether it (i.e. the DWA) takes place during turn 1 or 2. All units making the DWA automatically Deep Strike at the start of the chosen turn.....

Note the word "turn", singular.....the DWA happens for all units in the same turn, you can't have some come down DWA in turn 1 and the rest in turn 2. Sorry!

[march10k]

Meh...venerable land raiders for the win! I'll be flat-outing Belial in a crusader on turn one, then DWAing three shooty squads off of his raider on turn two! 15 termies dropping without scatter on the flank of my choice on turn two is gonna be a bitch to handle, especially when supported by a crusader load of knights!

[Tiger9gamer]

Rules Clarification:

Deathwing Assault - ...make a secret note of whether it (i.e. the DWA) takes place during turn 1 or 2. All units making the DWA automatically Deep Strike at the start of the chosen turn.....

Note the word "turn", singular.....the DWA happens for all units in the same turn, you can't have some come down DWA in turn 1 and the rest in turn 2. Sorry!

ooofta, that ruins some plans. Hmmmmm I'm thinking the Land raider homer idea may be worth it, as you could come down turn 2 and land right where you need to for an advance.

Kinda explains why ravenwing have so many teleport homers.

[Cactus]

You could take a drop pod with locator beacon for a devastator squad (or tactical, or veteran, or assault) and choose to deploy the squad on foot. The drop pod then arrives from reserve on the first turn and you place it wherever you want the beacon. Assuming it survives the enemy turn your DWA can use the locator beacon when they deep strike on turn two.

 

It's an alternative to using Ravenwing teleport homers, can more reliably/safely get behind enemy lines before your second turn, and costs exactly the same as a basic attack bike.

[Tiger9gamer]

There's an idea! I was thinking about that, too!

[elphilo]

So I played my first game with the new codex yesterday and I took a full 10 man unit of Deathwing Knights and a full 10 man unit of shooty Deathwing Terminators with buff bot Librarian. And holy crap. The all stars of the game were the Terminator Squad. They just took my opponents blob squad (he played IG allied with Space Wolves) and made mince meat of them. My opponent kept running away from the Knights and I kept rolling terrible on their difficult terrain/run rolls (thanks Njal ), so I can't say how awesome they are. But I like the look and I'm sure they will be that anvil that will replace the Hammernators of last codex.

So I think in the future, Knights get a Land Raider of some type. And I don't know if I'll be mixing the weapons in the Deathwing Terminators. Every time I think about putting a thunder hammer, or hell lightning claws, in there I think about how I'm wasting Vengeful Strike . I guess I need to experiment to see what I like.

As a side note, man I do love having full 10 man Terminator Squads again

[Disruptor_fe404]

Was there a ruling on whether Gate of Infinity is proper Deep Strike?

 

Because I would like to attach a Librarian with Gate to my 10-man Deathwing unit with Belial in there. Non-scattering, twin-linked shots that redeploy every round.