Mixed Wounds in CC

[Ushtarador]

I just remembered a question that we couldn't resolved when it popped up, so maybe one of you knows something we didn't:

 

With shooting it is clear that I as the shooter can decide which wounds are resolved first - bolter shots or lascannon hits. But what about CC?

If I have e.g. a dread and some normal marines in close combat, they both hit at I4. Can I again decide which wounds are resolved first? In our case this mattered because it forced him to take my normal CC attacks on his regular guys (which then died), and the dread wounds on his character (which failed LOS and got splatted).

[DarkGuard]

Read page 25 again.

 

After determining the number of Wounds inflicted against a unit at a particular Initiative step, Wounds are allocated, saves taken and casualties removed. Wounds are allocated and resolved starting with the closest model, just like in the shooting phase.

 

How do you allocate wounds in shooting? The attacker chooses. Seems simple here as well.

[company veteran]

no. the attacker does not choose in shooting, the decision is made by the rules.. in combat the defender can choose as long as has multiple models in b2b with the current attacking model. for example a single chaos marine dude is in b2b with a 2 guardsmen and a commisar the chaos guy rolls to hit and wound as normal. as the 'defender' has multiple models in b2b with the chaos marine and can allocate wounds to any of them one wound at a time (because as soon as he fails one he will have to allocate the remaining wounds to someone else in b2b) if everyone in b2b dies and there are wounds left over then they are put on the CLOSEST enemy model in that combat.. if there are multiple enemys an equal distance away then the defender chooses who to allocate to.

[The Librarian]

It is not even limited to those in base contact with the current attacking model.

"A Wound must be allocated to an enemy model in base contact with a model attacking at that Initiative step"

 

So in many cases the defender can allocate the wound to nearly every model, as most of them will be in base contact with an opponent attacking at the same initiative.

 

But besides of that the wound allocation follows the same procedure as in the shooting phase. So you as the attacker can still choose the order of the different wounds in the wound pool.

And if you want your opponant to save against the wound from the dread after the others, then that's the way it is.

[DarkGuard]

no. the attacker does not choose in shooting, the decision is made by the rules.. in combat the defender can choose as long as has multiple models in b2b with the current attacking model. for example a single chaos marine dude is in b2b with a 2 guardsmen and a commisar the chaos guy rolls to hit and wound as normal. as the 'defender' has multiple models in b2b with the chaos marine and can allocate wounds to any of them one wound at a time (because as soon as he fails one he will have to allocate the remaining wounds to someone else in b2b) if everyone in b2b dies and there are wounds left over then they are put on the CLOSEST enemy model in that combat.. if there are multiple enemys an equal distance away then the defender chooses who to allocate to.

 

The question wasn't about which models are taken out, but rather in which order you allocate and save different sets of AP wounds. For example, a unit takes two power sword wounds and five close combat weapon wounds in the same initiative step. So you have 2 AP3 wounds and 5 AP- wounds. The question was who chooses which to allocate first, the attacker or the defender? The rules say it's like shooting, in which case it's the attacker. Allocation and positioning of models is also like shooting, as the closest models to the action get hit first. That last bit was never in doubt or questioned, it was the part about who chooses the order of allocating different AP wounds.

[company veteran]

ah. well the BRB only states that the player controlling the models being attacked get to choose the model he allocates to.. not what order he allocates them. so i can see where this can cause contention.

 

*edit* in the shooting phase the defender allocates from the 'wound pool' implying he can decide which ap wounds go where.

[dswanick]

*edit* in the shooting phase the defender allocates from the 'wound pool' implying he can decide which ap wounds go where.

No, in the Shooting phase the Attacker allocates wounds from the Wound Pool (BRB, Pg.15).

[company veteran]

i apologise.. you are completely right.

[Ushtarador]

Wounds are allocated and resolved starting with the closest model, just like in the shooting phase.

So the consensus is that this sentence means that the attacker chooses which wound class is allocated first. Good to hear you agree, I ruled it that way as well

[dswanick]

Wounds are allocated and resolved starting with the closest model, just like in the shooting phase.

So the consensus is that this sentence means that the attacker chooses which wound class is allocated first. Good to hear you agree, I ruled it that way as well

Yes, because your quoted rule refers back to this rule in the Shooting phase:

"Allocate Wounds & Remove Casualties

To determine how many casualties are caused, you will need to allocate the Wounds caused and resolve any saving throws the target is allowed.

...

Next, allocate an unsaved Wound to the enemy model closest to the firing unit.

...

Mixed Saves

If the target unit contains several different saving throws, you'll need to follow this process instead of the one presented above.

...

First, allocate a Wound from the Wound Pool to the enemy model closest to the firing unit.

...

Emptied Wound Pool

When the Wound Pool is empty, the shooting attack has been completely resolved. You can begin your next shooting attack, or precede to the Assault phase.", BRB, Pg.15

It's clear that the whole of the Wound Allocation section is written directed at the Attacker, who is the one doing the Allocating.

[Dam13n]

edit - Already answered.