Some suggestions to complete this army?

[Gman]

Hi BnC, you are the experts are marine armies, and this community is always full of great info and suggestions. So I ask for help. I started a SW army for m wife back in 5th Ed. rules, and then shortly after we kind of dropped out of the 40k scene. I'm now getting back into the game with new Ed (and enjoying it) and so have dusted off her SW.

 

Keep in mind, this army is based on what she wanted for it, after reading through the characters and stuff. Not meant to be a tourny competative list, just a good list for friendly games. So here is what we have model wise so far, and I'm looking to add onto this, not replace anything. The numbers are the way they are because initially it was going to be a rhino spam list. But not so sure on the transports now and am open to footslogging, or pod hybrid list.

 

Logan

 

x9 blood claws, x1PF, Lukas

x9 grey hunters, x1 melta, x1PF, (power armor WG with frost blade here)

x9 grey hunters, x1 melta, x1PF, (power armor WG with frost blade here)

 

Wolfguard Unit

x2 TDA, PW/SB

x1 TDA, PF/AC

x1 TDA, x2 WC

x1 TDA, SS/TH

x2 PA, Frost Blade

drop pod

 

x5 unassembled scouts

 

So that's what we have model wise. So far I have come up with putting Logan in the pod with three of the TDA WG, probably the two power sword guys, and the AC guy. So obviously the list is missing some heavy weapons support, and mobility. Not sure if rhinos, pods, or just max out the PA units and run for it, is best way to play the game.

 

Thanks for suggestions.

[Squark]

Couple of reccomendations. These are just suggestions that will probably make your playing experience less frustrating. Also, I'd reccomend you'd look at tutorials for modifying models that are alrady assembled, as several of those load outs don't really work anymore.

 

1) Frost blades aren't worth the points you pay for them. Just use a power weapon instead.

2) Powerfists really shouldn't be on models with only a single attack. You should probably try turning those into power axes for your troops.

3) Meltaguns go in drop pods, rhinos, or the box. They really don't work on foot squads. So you're going to need to get some more transports, or swap them out for Plasmaguns. Also, if you're not in a vehicle, 10 man squads are a must.

4) Changes in how specialist weapons work have made 2x Wolf Claw loadouts obselete. Wolf Claw+Powerfist still gets the extra attack, but you're affective against terminators again.

5) Logan doesn't really play well with Wolf Guard. Well, he's not bad in a unit of wolf guard. But that's not where he wants to be. Where does he want to be? Well... Just about anywhere else. Long Fangs love Tank Hunters, Relentless, and Preferred Enemy (Monstrous Creatures). Relentless Grey Hunters are fantastic. Blood claws? Preferred Enemy counteracts the low WS, and Fearless gets rid of Lukas's downside (well, part of it). Also, he can give Blood Claws 5 attacks on the charge. Drown your opponent in dice. Wolf guard get fewer shots, fewer attacks, and are fine on their own. Also, I really don't reccomend running Logan below 1850. He's simply too expensive.

[Gman]

Thanks for the suggestions. I have questions on some of them though.

1) Doesn't the FAQ keep frost blades at the +1 S, AP3 thus leaving them at normal Init, as opposed to the frost axe that was changed to unwieldly? The FAQ didn't update the points, so a power weapon and frost axe are the same point unless I'm mistake there. Again, unless I missed something, PW an FB are same points but FB gives +1 S.  

 

2) I can see that, and in 5th it was more useful as everyone seemed to have blenty of transports and dreads out there. I got in the habbit of dropping a PF in my infantry units because it sucked getting bogged down with a dread in CC. I'm fine trying to pull off the arm, or more than likely, to get the extra models bits etc, just buy a box of SW and make one. For the Blood Claws do you recommend another special weapon in there, ie PW, FB, or FA?

 

3) In double checking, the models slated for the melta, don't have the guns in hands yet ,in fact, because the GH hunters were not completely painted yet, none of the models holding bolters with 2 hands are holding the guns yet. And I do agree and see your point on floot slogging marines better off with plasma. Unless put in something where they get there fast. The new rapidfire rules are great for the plasmas  :)

 

4) Doesn't having 2 of the same specialist weapon give you the +1 attack? Same as having 2 WC did in last edition, I really don't see how that model changed a bit. Am I missing something. Doing WC and PF would just leave him at base 2 attacks.

 

5) I have read many posts about putting Logan with long fangs, especailly in a pod. I get that and like the idea. I never even considered putting him with the blood claws, wow that opens up some options. :D I guess I can see how he could be deployed with whatever unit might best use him, depending on the opponent, and the mission, table etc. I like that. And I agree he is too expensive to take in smaller armies, and I told my wife this, and suggested other HQ options that would be cool and fluffy. She said she liked him and wanted him anyway. Can't argue with that, at that point.

 

So maybe use the full 5 man WG TDA unit in the pod, and add a unit of long fangs, then up the GH units to a full 10 with double plasma? Hm I like the way that is looking.

[Astoran]

If your wife is set on Logan I would throw him in a Land Raider Crusader/Redeemer with 10 Grey Hunters and a WGPL and just ram it down (hehe Judas Priest song) the opponents throat. Logan is awsome with GH and a Wolf Banner.

[Squark]

1) Err... Frost weapons are 10 points more expensive than power weapons. Always have been.

2) The real issue is the one attack. The powerfist you always wanted on the Wolf Guard. Nowadays, people are going with Wolf Guard terminators with Power axes and combi-weapons or storm bolters for Pack leaders unless you go with rhinos. For the Blood Claws, I'd reccomend going with the Power Axe, and probably bring the squad to full strength and giving them 2 flamers. Or just leaving them alone for now

4) They changed it. Now, it's just 2 specialist weapons, irregardless of type.

5) Fair enough. Reason you don't hear about Logan in Blood Claws is because a Wolf Priest also gives them those special rules, and is half the price. But, if you want Logan, take Logan

 

On drop podding Wolf Guard- If you haven't painted the storm bolters yet, look into converting them into combi-weapons- Combi-weapon wolf guard are generally the best way to go for drop pod squads.

[Gman]

I checked last night, and you're right the power weapon is far cheaper than the frost blade and powerfist. By changing out those, I gained some points back on the list. I'm think I'm liking the idea of a wolf slogger list at this point. Maxing out the GH units, and loading them with x2 plasmaguns, and double PW, banner and mark looks pretty neat and clean. I threw meltabombs on the WG just incase they get in a tangle with a dread.

For the BC I will swap out the powerfist for a power weapon, maybe toss in a plasmapistol. Or is double flamers better? I dunno, I kind of like these guys cheap, no muss no fuss.

Then I think toss in a long fang unit with x2 LC and x2 PC. I realize might not be the favored load out choice for them, based on reading around. But with what's provided in a havoc box, that seems a good choice to me. 2 LC for anti tank/flyer, and then the PC for killing troops and even termis, pretty easy. Couple of those tossed out should do decent against a horde army, like Orks.

 

OK I see what you are saying now about the specialist weapons. No point is taking 2 WC, when taking one and a powerfist still gets you the +1 attack. And with powerfist you can hit tanks or squish marines or termis or something. Boy, the new rules really do change the dynamics of army building don't they?

[Squark]

Wolves only get 1 power weapon. Also, generally speaking, you only need 1 power axe or a mark, not both- Either gets the AP 2 you want, and taking both makes the unit a bit too pricy.

 

 

As for blood claws, the reason I recommend the flamers (Note; Blood claws only get the second special weapon at full strength, so you'd need a pack of 15) is that they ignore the Blood Claws lower BS. Also, cover busting is always scarce for wolves, and Blood Claws want to be in the enemy's face anyway.

 

Long Fangs wise... I really, really don't reccomend 2x Lascannon and 2x Plasma  cannon. 1 or the other combined with missile launchers works fine, but when you lose the squad leader, half the squad is kind of wasting fire whatever they shoot at (And with the price of those weapons being what it is, the Squad leader really should be the first to die). You could try 3x Heavy Bolter 3x Plasma Cannon and 3x Lascannon 2x Missile Launcher by buying 2 packs (Tip- The Devastators box comes with 6 legs and 5 torsos. The Space Wolves pack comes with 12 torsos and 10 legs. So, you can use the extra torsos to make an additional long fang). Alternatively, Hunter killer missile conversions aren't that hard.

[Gman]

Sorry, wasn't specific, GH gets 1 PW, then attach a WG with a PW also.  :)

 

I see, makes sense, don't mix and match weapons with significantly different ranges. so what are the better weapons load outs for long fangs? The ML and LC? I like the HB and PC mix up, but that still leaves the army with no heavy weapons able to take out vehicles.