Sternguard Loadouts

[tvih]

That 5 points hardly increases the efficiency beyond 20%.  You are paying for one shot.  (2 for rapid firing combi plas).  If you miss you have not increased your efficiency.  Combi weapons are pretty cool.  I think the bolters do just fine though.

Especilally against terminators, vehicles and the like you will most certainly see an increase is beyond 20%. It really depends on the target. All in all I like the versatility the combi-weapons offer. Bust vehicles with meltas, splatter terminators with plasma, maybe even torch a horde squad with a flamer. All with the same squad if you so choose (though personally I usually prefer sticking with a max of two combi types per squad).

 

Will the combi-weapons sometimes end up a "waste of points" due to no targets that truly benefit from having them? Sure, but that's true for each and every special weapon you field.

[DarkGuard]

With 10 man Sternguard, the one problem I have is beyond not having extra versatility, you can't stick them with an IC in a Rhino.

[Bannus]

With 10 man Sternguard, the one problem I have is beyond not having extra versatility, you can't stick them with an IC in a Rhino.

That is easily rectified by omiting one Sternguard Marine from the unit - but the principle still remains the same. However, by adding that IC, you increase the "fire-magnet" potential of the unit. One of its advantages (no extra bling) is that it does not appear to be a significant threat - where a unit loaded up with combi-weapons and heavy flamers just scream "shoot at me first!!".

[DarkGuard]

But then by even losing that one Sternguard, you're losing that damage potential, damage potential which could be better spent by buying upgrades. But then you may overspend, and need to cut that 9th man, which is how I ended up with my Sternguard squad.

[Excubitor]

But dropping those two models from the unit to add upgrades doesn't hugely affect the potential of the squad against it's primary targets; non-vehicle, non-TEQ models. It increases the bulls-eye on the unit and lessens its ability to take those hits. An upgraded 8-man unit that loses 2 models looses 4 12" shots - 1/4 of it's firepower - plus whatever upgrades were on the models, possibly before they shoot. A bare-bones 10 man unit loosing the same number is only 1/5 of the firepower, not wasting any points from upgrades, and still has comparable firepower to the other unit in most cases. It also is less likely to take those wounds because they are a lower target priority in the first place.

[Zombie P]

I understand that, but I don't think its that simple. Sternguard are one of the most versatile units in the game. They can be kitted out to deal with anything, and they come with quite a skill set as it is. 

I really feel that there isn't a "go to" load out for them, they can be manipulated and equipped to support/lead and style of play and any army configuration. 

 

Simply for the record, I currently run in my tournament list one unit of 6, in a pod, with 2 heavy flamers and 2 combi meltas.

 

ZP

[DarkGuard]

But dropping those two models from the unit to add upgrades doesn't hugely affect the potential of the squad against it's primary targets; non-vehicle, non-TEQ models. It increases the bulls-eye on the unit and lessens its ability to take those hits. An upgraded 8-man unit that loses 2 models looses 4 12" shots - 1/4 of it's firepower - plus whatever upgrades were on the models, possibly before they shoot. A bare-bones 10 man unit loosing the same number is only 1/5 of the firepower, not wasting any points from upgrades, and still has comparable firepower to the other unit in most cases. It also is less likely to take those wounds because they are a lower target priority in the first place.

 

As I've mentioned a couple of times, I use my unit in a Rhino with a character, so I don't have the room for that 10 man squad. In testing Sternguard fairly extensively when picking up the Codex, the 8 man unit performs well. The lack of numbers is mitigated by powerful shooting attacks, while having combis is very useful, as it gives them flexibility. Sternguard do have a primary target, but you will not always be able to pit them against that, you can bet your opponent will do his best to deny you that pleasure. Having them equipped with combi-meltas and combi-plasmas allows them to effectively handle most units on the battlefield. In a Rhino and with an IC they are quite well protected as well, so you should be able to use them at their maximum at least once in the game. Survivability is a little bit of an issue, but I'd trade a couple of models for flexibility in deployment and ICs, and in damage output.

[Excubitor]

I think a lot of what we're arguing about here comes from list composition - you find the upgraded 8-man rhino squad works best in your lists in your meta, I like the 10-man basic squad in mine.

 

I actually use smaller, upgraded units of sternguard in transports a lot, quite frequently in conjunction with ICs. I like their flexibility like that. Having said that, I still prefer the basic unit.

 

If I'm going to DP a unit to suicide, I'll take MM & HF dreads or Ironclads. Anti-TEQ, got Plasma Cannons and a Plasma Gun Command Squad. Etc, Etc.

 

They can be used to plug a hole in any list. Every player will have different preferences based on how they make lists and the local meta. Sternguard are THE basic 'I want max utility' unit.

 

Well, them and Vindicators, anyway.

[War Angel]

I'm currently thinking of changing my 10 man squad from 2 heavy flamers and 6 combi meltas, down to four (possibly five) combi meltas. I plan on using them in a pod and I think my original intention was to split the squad so that both teams have 3 meltas and a flamer. This would have both units able to kill a tank, and still have a heavy flamer for the hordes. I could still do this with two meltas in each squad, but I'm not sure on the odds of just two. Or I could run the two teams with their own separate missions.

 

I know that the last option is a strong choice, and I'm sure many run it this way, but is the first option even considered a viable tactic? Or does it divide there roles too much and weaken the teams?

[DarkGuard]

Hmmm, 1 big unit of unupgraded Sternguard in a Rhino, and 2 smaller units in Razorbacks with upgrades, sounds like it could be quite interesting. Of course, in less than 2000pts it narrows your flexibility in Elites, which is easily one of the best slots for us.

[Excubitor]

I've actually run a list with that same setup. Those, a couple tactical squads, a pair of vindicators, and an honour guard squad (with Kantor) in an LRC. Admittedly, not sure how it would work in 6th ed, but did good in 5th.

 

And War Angel, both options are fine, I personally go for at least 3 but prefer 4 (because I have horrendous luck with combi-weapon rolls!) but I have run with less before (Vulkan lists). One idea though is to have 4-5 combi-meltas in one squad, and 2 heavy flamers in the other. Blow the tank with the melta's, flame the guys that get out. Best thing with combat squads is that you can build the unit to do both depending on the situation.

[Frogstar168]

I use 10 man squad with 4 x Combi-Meltas, 2 x Heavy Flamers, Power Fist (awesome model I must use) in my 7 Drop Pod army.  They come down with other threats, are very flexible and don't disappoint.  I will admit it is extremely expensive at 350 points, but my whole army is based on a crippling alpha strike.  I have fun with 'em.

[Excubitor]

I have fun with 'em.

 

The most important thing indeed

[War Angel]

Thanks, I think I'll just make the five combi's and that way I can either divide the squad (a little lopsided but eh) or I can "bust" and "burn" as you stated.