The New Dark Angels Codex: An Editorial

[PensacolaWarhammer]

I posted a fairly length post today on my blog where I write up an editorial on the new Dark Angels codex. You can check out the full post at Pensacola Warhammer.

 

The basic summary is that the new codex is okay, but there are just so many small issues and flaws that prevent this codex from being something really great and special. Here's a quick run down on the first part of my editorial that will probably end up being at least one more post.

 

• Warlord Traits and Dark Angels Special rules - Honestly not much to really complain about here. I would like my special characters to have something other than the Hunt, and I think there could have be a few of the warlord traits dropped for more "fluffy" and useful ones.
• HQ selection - The HQ selection is alright. Again, I would have liked to see at least one of the HQ choices a bit better in close combat, but if GW is moving away from close combat, which I doubt, then it is a pointless issue. I don't understand why Azrael, the Grand Master and leader of the whole Dark Angels chapter, is not an Eternal Warrior, but Sammael, a company master, is. I also don't understand why the three grand masters' swords that were created at the same time from the same piece of rock all have different stats.
• The Command Squads - I love the idea of the command squads, and adding in the special banners makes me really like them even more. However, how big of a target and the points cost of the banner coupled with the advent of Precision Shot make it hard to take a banner. Toss in the almost comical screw up that is the company champion with his Blade of Caliban, the only sword that is Unwieldy and only adds +1 strength, and there is little reason to take a command squad.

As I state in my post, this is not me bashing or calling the codex horrible. It's merely me pointing out flaws that I see and wondering why in the world they are there and what could be done to fix them. Again, there are moments where this codex could have really been something great, but there are some many small flaws that stack up that end up hurting the codex This is especially true with how easy it is to fix many of these errors, flaws, or oversights.

[WatchCaptainAzrael]

I don't understand why Azrael, the Grand Master and leader of the whole Dark Angels chapter, is not an Eternal Warrior, but Sammael, a company master, is.

 

Geedubs was trying to cash in on Ravenwing, so they boosted the Ravenwing like mad.

[PensacolaWarhammer]

@WatchCaptainAzrael

That was my very first reaction the day I got the codex.

[Cactus]

@WatchCaptainAzrael

That was my very first reaction the day I got the codex.

That must have been an over-reaction then, as the codex is "balanced to the point of being bland".

[PensacolaWarhammer]

@Cactus

 

Yes, that was my FIRST reaction on the day I got the codex. I have since changed my opinion, having spent a lot of time and played several games with the codex, to the opinion that it is balanced to the point of being bland. Though, that doesn't the flaws I'm pointing out in my post are disappearing.

[Interrogator Stobz]

The Nephilm's rules are an isolated example of how the rules are uninspirational, you get a great model with a great zoom zoom flyer feel, you get a great fluff write up but get no aerial pew pew for your points. Makes it lack-lustre instead of cool. This has been a problem with DA dexes forever:

-DA unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets costed correctly, gets an undesirable downgrade in the name of balance but keeps higher cost. Players lose excitement and claim "Blandness".

-BA unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets costed correctly, gets a so called balancing rule that actually helps with synergy and remains at a fair cost. Players continue to play happily with only the usual grizzles.

-SW unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets undercosted, gets no downside apart from no flyers. Players continue to laugh and enjoy their games of face punching long after the dex has lost it's freshness.

-SM Players get "Bland" because they deserve it

We will still do alright; it's not the end of the world, but there is a definate theme occurring throughout the last couple of decades.

I can't back any of that up; it's just my opinion

s

[WatchCaptainAzrael]

If we're not struggling to win, we're not experiencing the real Unforgiven experience. Geedubs is being fluff-accurate by forcing us to struggle against grots. Meanwhile, Spehss Yiffs are SO DAMN AWESOME so they can just stroll around kicking ass and taking names, because even when they lose and they are wrong, they still win and they're still always right according to fluff.

[Azoriel]

 

I don't understand why Azrael, the Grand Master and leader of the whole Dark Angels chapter, is not an Eternal Warrior, but Sammael, a company master, is.

 

Geedubs was trying to cash in on Ravenwing, so they boosted the Ravenwing like mad.

He's been EW since 4th Edition though (when the character first appeared), whereas Azrael has never had that rule before.  Not say it can't change (Marneus has crept up in power with each edition) and I'm not saying both Ravenwing and Sammael didn't get other goodies, but Sammael having EW is not an example of Ravenwing getting boosted.

[PensacolaWarhammer]

@Stobz and WatchCaptainAzereal

 

I love both of your responses. They're pointed but humorus.

 

@Stobz

I will get to the fliers in my next post, but to preview it. I personally think all 40k armies should have recieved two fliers. One would be a air support/fighter and the other would be a gunship/transport. In space marine terms, every space marine chapter would get the storm talon or something similar and the storm raven or something similar. How you individually pick out each flavor of space marines was great, and I can't agree more with your assessment. Sadly, you are right in that it seems to be an ongoing theme that I wish would stop.

[Brom MKIV]

Can't say I really share these sentiments. Honestly C:DA and C:CSM are two of my favorite dexs in years. Ya RW got buffed but they are not mutually exclusive, any build can benefit from their inclusion and the changes were needed since bikes in general suck barring these two dexs.

Both these dexs also have some if the most customizable home brew ICs in the game with some really worthwhile weaponry IME.

 

The nilla champ is a little lack luster compared to the other two cmd squads champs but 5 pts to become a character is still worthwhile if you plan to join an IC or two to the unit. The RW champ is totally worth the investment though same for DW cmd.

 

As for the rest, ya the flyers aren't great but the rest of the dex boasts some of the cheapest most flexible marine staples to date. 14 pt tacs that can take a hvy or special at 5 strong, scoring assault termies with mixed weaponry and plas cannons plus vengeful strike and deathwing assault rules, 65 pt Libbys, 65 pt whirlwinds, 140 pt tri las preds, venerable land raiders, 125 put venerable dreads, flakks on everything and even a whole slew of unique wargear plus powerhouse banners. And this is without even mentioning ravenwing. I really don't get how the dex is anything but a success. Anything more would start to be in the realm of broken.

[Wraithwing]

Can't say I really share these sentiments. Honestly C:DA and C:CSM are two of my favorite dexs in years. Ya RW got buffed but they are not mutually exclusive, any build can benefit from their inclusion and the changes were needed since bikes in general suck barring these two dexs.

Both these dexs also have some if the most customizable home brew ICs in the game with some really worthwhile weaponry IME.

 

The nilla champ is a little lack luster compared to the other two cmd squads champs but 5 pts to become a character is still worthwhile if you plan to join an IC or two to the unit. The RW champ is totally worth the investment though same for DW cmd.

 

As for the rest, ya the flyers aren't great but the rest of the dex boasts some of the cheapest most flexible marine staples to date. 14 pt tacs that can take a hvy or special at 5 strong, scoring assault termies with mixed weaponry and plas cannons plus vengeful strike and deathwing assault rules, 65 pt Libbys, 65 pt whirlwinds, 140 pt tri las preds, venerable land raiders, 125 put venerable dreads, flakks on everything and even a whole slew of unique wargear plus powerhouse banners. And this is without even mentioning ravenwing. I really don't get how the dex is anything but a success. Anything more would start to be in the realm of broken.

 

Well said brother. 

 

So much bellyaching about the new dex, it boggles my mind. 

 

PensacolaWarhammer, with respect, this isn't the first thread you've posted that takes a pop at the new dex, if I recall correctly?

 

Do I see a theme developing here?

 

I'm loving the options the new dex gives us. Its the best book we've had in years, and really captures the feel of the glory days of 2nd Edition, IMHO. 

 

Cheers, 

 

WW

[The Yak]

The Nephilm's rules are an isolated example of how the rules are uninspirational, you get a great model with a great zoom zoom flyer feel, you get a great fluff write up but get no aerial pew pew for your points. Makes it lack-lustre instead of cool. This has been a problem with DA dexes forever:

-DA unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets costed correctly, gets an undesirable downgrade in the name of balance but keeps higher cost. Players lose excitement and claim "Blandness".

-BA unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets costed correctly, gets a so called balancing rule that actually helps with synergy and remains at a fair cost. Players continue to play happily with only the usual grizzles.

-SW unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets undercosted, gets no downside apart from no flyers. Players continue to laugh and enjoy their games of face punching long after the dex has lost it's freshness.

-SM Players get "Bland" because they deserve it

We will still do alright; it's not the end of the world, but there is a definate theme occurring throughout the last couple of decades.

I can't back any of that up; it's just my opinion

s

Haha Bland and we deserve it!

Your right we should start wearing dresses like you guys to spice up our dull war life. You guys have been on a 10'000 year stag do, we cant compete with that!

Think about it though If you did have a really really good codex (and I have not read it so can't comment), you would get loads of boobs jumping on the Band wagon and spamming killer lists "Cough cough" Grey Knights. Thing I always admired with Dark Angels players like your good selves is that your hardcore. You stuck with your chapter no matter how old/poor the codex was.

Hey in fact at least you have your own codex

[Interrogator Stobz]

Guys: All valid opinions, but the OP and I are just pointing our own disappointment with certain parts of the dex.

I love this book compared to our previous couple, it's just that some things are not quite right (not nessessarily broken good or total crap),  I do like balance in place of OTT it's just not quite right in some critical areas, PA Champs and the new speeder and flyer models spring to mind imho.

The small flaws take away the potential this book had to be really wicked. They don't ruin it, they just make several units less than appealing to certain play styles.  I hear you say that all dexes have that problem, again I agree but live in the ever optimistic state of wishing it weren't so.

 

s

 

EDIT: @ YAK; LOLZ, you raise a very valid point about bandwagonning. We here have gained quite a few new converts and seen the return of many an old Vet but you are right; it seems to be a genuine interest rather than an overboard jumping into the new bestest uberness. That may actually in part prove the OPs' point :P

[PensacolaWarhammer]

@Wraithwing

No this is not the first thread I've posted about the new Dark Angels codex. The first one and only one was my first impression of the codex when it was released. Now that a significant amount of time has passed, and I've played several games with it I've posted a more refined editorial on it. I do not disagree that the codex is okay. My post is now merely pointing out strange flaws that I've found, trying to figure out why they exsit, and pointing out easy fixes that GW could have taken. Why is Azarel not an Eternal Warrior? Why in the world is a Blade of Caliban Unwieldy?

 

@Brom MkIV

I am not denying any of the points you are making. Although, I would have to say that Ravenwing didn't get as big of a boost as Deathwing did. Still, you are correct that we have access to cheap things, and we can build some colorful IC. As I stated above, the points I'm trying to make are small changes that I would like to see happen. I don't understand how some of the things I have suggested in my blog post or here would begin to tread in the realm of broken. How could making the standard barer a character or allowing a member of the command squad to pick up the banner if the standard barer is killed be considered broken? How would making the Blade of Caliban just a regular Relic Blade or basic power sword be considered broken?

[PensacolaWarhammer]

Guys: All valid opinions, but the OP and I are just pointing our own disappointment with certain parts of the dex.

I love this book compared to our previous couple, it's just that some things are not quite right (not nessessarily broken good or total crap),  I do like balance in place of OTT it's just not quite right in some critical areas, PA Champs and the new speeder and flyer models spring to mind imho.

The small flaws take away the potential this book had to be really wicked. They don't ruin it, they just make several units less than appealing to certain play styles.  I hear you say that all dexes have that problem, again I agree but live in the ever optimistic state of wishing it weren't so.

 

s

AAAAAHHHHH! Get out of my head. How dare you use your strange mind reading powers on me :)

 

Seriously, Stobz I think you hit it out of the park. I couldn't have said it better. For everyone these are my small problems with the codex

• Blade of Caliban - +1 to strength and Unwieldy. How does that make sense?
• More named characters mainly as unit upgrades - this is simply a wish list item.
• Company Vet Squad with Jump Packs - Mainly I just want vets with jump packs, and I think it would be cool.
• Ravenwing command squad being only 3 guys - why couldn't it be 5 like the other command squads
• Regular Chaplains as elite choice a la Blood Angels and their Sanguinary Priest - Again, mainly a wish list item.
• Weapon options for Deathwing Knights - I just would like the options of swords or something.
• Maybe a better price for Deathwing Knights - It's only ten more points to take a squad of Deathwing terminators of the same and give them TH/SS
• Maybe some other weapon options for Black Knights - Again, I'd just like my black knights to be more, well, knightly with swords.
• Vet Sergeants having access to Special Issue Wargear - Give me a reason to upgrade my sergeant, and I would like an auspex in my tactical squad.
• Some weapon options for the Dark Talon - Why can't I just take a regular bomb?
• I would give up the Dark Talon for a flier with troop transport.
• OH MY GOD the new land speeders - First and foremost new models instead of the hideous things that were given, and something that would prevent the Land Speeder Vengeance from blowing itself up. Maybe an extra hull point? A point higher in AP? Internal cooling for the Plasma Cannons, because the thing is big enough and they could stick it in the passanger seat that the gunner had to give up for an unknown reason.

None of these points make me want to throw the codex away or not play Dark Angels. As Stobz and I are pointing out, they just prevent the codex from being something really amazing. I also don't see how any of the points I've just listed would break the codex or tread into the realm of brokeness or create cheese, but then again, I just don't think like that.

[Tiger9gamer]

Hey, coming from the vanilla codex before, I prefer this more.

[Brom MKIV]

Ah I see now and well put, I agree with most if not all of yours points. My comment on broken was from the impression that you were simply wanting a more powerful codex, which type I tend to gravitate away from.

 

There are a few points though that are pretty obviously balancing factors IMO such as:

-RW cmd at 3, IMO keeps them from completely out shining the PA cmd.

-the Auspex is damn powerful I can see it being limited, however i could also see it being an option only for tac vet sergs or something

-DWKs, I feel these are also very good better than th/ss IMO.

 

The rest i pretty much agree with, and jump pack vets would be sweet. I would also add one, NO BIKE for the company master?! This is also probably a limiting factor to help the interrogator chaplain out but it still sucks.

[PensacolaWarhammer]

@Brom MkIV

 

I understand you wanting to move away from "overpowered" codex, and I would not want to see the Dark Angels go down that path.

• I don't know about the Ravenwing cmd out shinning the Powered Armor cmd since I see them fulfilling two different roles, but maybe meet half way with a 4 man Ravenwing cmd squad.
• I would naturally asume some restirctions would be placed. The codex did that with resticting bikes form company masters, which I agree should be on my list. I just pointing out that it would be nice to have something to make taking a veteran sergeant a bit worth it.
• I think Deathwing Knights are probably player preference which is why I would like to see a few weapon options for the Deathwing Knghts. At least with some weapons options, different weapons options would allow for different play styles. I figured they wouldn't have thunder hamers, and Smite Mode would only be on the maces.

Again, these are just just my thoughts on what fixes I would apply to small issues that I've seen in the codex.

[Brother Landrain]

First off, I do love the new codex. It is almost perfect imo, but there are issues with it that I agree need explained if not corrected...

 

HQ Issues

• Why does everyone have the HUNT warlord trait? If you are going to make 6 DA Warlord traits, at least make them all DA Fluffy first... (Furious Charge? not really very DA)... And then the Special Characters shouldn't all have the HUNT. While it is the most DA traditionally, variety would be nice.
• Servitors really should be Techmarine Wargear.
• Only one DA Psychic power, and only Ezekiel knows it?
• Asmodai, an afterthought? he wake up and leave his ranged weapons at home? Blades of reason, specialist weapon? Can he have 2 then?
• If a Master can be in TDA why not on a Bike?
• RW Command squad size, should be up to 6 bikes.
• Blade of caliban... much has already been said.

Troops

• Vet Sgts with Special Wargear, give me a reason to take them as said before.

Elites

• Company Vets with Jump Packs
• Company vets with BP,BG,CCW... always. They forget rule #9 ? Always bring a knife...
• DWK... some weapon options please? I like the story of the maces, but unl;ess fighting CSM, or Smiting, the maces are pretty poor TDA weapons.

Fast Attack

• The supersized LS has 2 HP... why?
• All of the weapons are same STR/AP why?
• AV 11? all other equivalent flyers are AV 12 why?
• No Transport? BA and GK and SM all get Flying TDA transports... and DW get nothing..

Heavy

• No Mortis? why????
• LSV... Suicide Triple shot Plasma...
• LSV, again supersized with 2HP...
• No Attack Bike Squads still..
• Wish DW got some HS love.

Just would be nice to know the thought process and why certain questionable things exist or dont..

[Brom MKIV]

I guess there are some definite issues that could definitely been fixed rather easily that would have contributed to our dex without pushing it over the top. That said its still a great book. Also knight maces have actually been really good for me so far.

[march10k]

Honestly, I find the idea that space marines should have air superiority fighters...abhorrent. That's definitely the demesne of the navy! Some kind of ground attack flier...well, that's more of a gray area, but IMHO, GW positively gutted the fluff for the sake of selling $70 models when they started handing out fliers. If it flies more than 20 feet off the ground, nobody but the navy and the inquisition (so GK, can't deny them anything, can we?) should have it. That is, after all, part of the whole division of power thing that's intended to keep everyone in line and dependent on one another...Bad enough that the space marines, having strike cruisers and such, have little need for the navy to ferry them around. Give them air power, and there truly is no check on their ambitions.

 

/edit/

 

My own gripes is that most of the HQ characters are locked in to a 'meh' warlord trait, seemingly with no consideration given in terms of reduced cost....hell, the ability to pick a trait instead of being locked into one that I'm not thrilled with, justifies the price difference between belial and azrael! Throw in all the other awesomesauce, and where I fielded belial in mixed-wing lists to make termies scoring, I'll now have to paint up Azzy (he's been in my bitz box for a decade, lol), because he's WAY better for the points, even if you don't also field bikes.

 

I'm okay with the sword of silence...it's not the same as the sword of secrets, of course...but, come on, it wounds on 2+ against infantry and is AP3...AP2 versus CSM...nice!!!! Against T5, it's actually BETTER than the sword of secrets....and T5 infantry isn't precisely scarce!

[facmanpob]

 

"Balanced to the point of being bland"

 

I have an issue with this statement as I personally think that the two terms are mutually exclusive. Balance/imbalance and original/bland are separate issues and can't be equated. You could say "Balanced to the point of not having a mono-build, which makes my army selection tough", and you could say "I find it bland in the sense that I don't find any of the selections interesting or inspiring", but the balance isn't causing the blandness.

 

I think the codex is reasonably well balanced. The only unit that really sticks out are the Black Knights, as they are very tough, but they are also more expensive than most terminator choices across all of the SM codexes. Balance is something that most players have been screaming for for a long time. Broken units infuriate the majority of the playership, so we shouldn't complain when 2 codexes in a row (DA and C:CSM) seem reasonably balanced.

 

With regard to blandness, this really is in the eye of the beholder. Having recently read Ravenwing by Gav Thorpe, it seems clear that Jeremy Vetock and Thorpe collaborated closely to ensure that the fluff reflected army choices etc. I personally don't find the codex bland in the slightest. Choice for the sake of choice is not inherently interesting.

 

Just my tuppence, please feel free to disregard

 

 

 

......at your peril ;)

[Vash113]

The Nephilm's rules are an isolated example of how the rules are uninspirational, you get a great model with a great zoom zoom flyer feel, you get a great fluff write up but get no aerial pew pew for your points. Makes it lack-lustre instead of cool. This has been a problem with DA dexes forever:

-DA unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets costed correctly, gets an undesirable downgrade in the name of balance but keeps higher cost. Players lose excitement and claim "Blandness".

-BA unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets costed correctly, gets a so called balancing rule that actually helps with synergy and remains at a fair cost. Players continue to play happily with only the usual grizzles.

-SW unit gets cool fluffy rule, gets undercosted, gets no downside apart from no flyers. Players continue to laugh and enjoy their games of face punching long after the dex has lost it's freshness.

-SM Players get "Bland" because they deserve it

We will still do alright; it's not the end of the world, but there is a definate theme occurring throughout the last couple of decades.

I can't back any of that up; it's just my opinion

s

Frankly that sounds about right to me.

Honestly, I find the idea that space marines should have air superiority fighters...abhorrent. That's definitely the demesne of the navy! Some kind of ground attack flier...well, that's more of a gray area, but IMHO, GW positively gutted the fluff for the sake of selling $70 models when they started handing out fliers. If it flies more than 20 feet off the ground, nobody but the navy and the inquisition (so GK, can't deny them anything, can we?) should have it. That is, after all, part of the whole division of power thing that's intended to keep everyone in line and dependent on one another...Bad enough that the space marines, having strike cruisers and such, have little need for the navy to ferry them around. Give them air power, and there truly is no check on their ambitions.

I dunno, Space Marines have always had airpower in the form of Thunderhawks and other gunships and transports, dedicated attack craft isn't too much of a leap and the fluff has shown a progression of Space Marines consolidating more military assets than the Inquisition is entirely happy with.

As for the Codex, I mainly thought it was fairly well written and balanced with some notable exceptions that others have pointed out above. However the Blade of Caliban stands out in stark contrast to everything, it's just... strange. Power Axes are already pretty pointless and now a sword that has all the disadvantages and not even equal advantages? Very strange indeed. Meanwhile the Halberd of Caliban, which is supposed to be made from a broken and shortened Blade of Caliban, is much, much better.

A bit of a side note, am I the only one who saw the reference to the Stained Glass Cannon in the white dwarf and thought that was a developer joke and was surprised to see it written in the codex? Just seemed very strange and starkly out of place. Besides Rift Cannon is a much cooler name and the description of it's effects in Ravenwing lead me to believe it would be a bit more... nasty.

[march10k]

Meh...thunderhawks are armed transports.  They're NOT gunships.  And it would be okay for the marines to start acquiring/deploying proper figher/interceptors IFANDONLYIF they wrote fluff to explain away the flouting of various edicts and such...advancing the fluff (along with the timeline!) is one thing...ignoring it to boost sales is...cheap.  Show me where they write in anywhere how various chapters either convinced the High Lords of Terra to give them permission to maintain air power, or where they decided "screw terra, we're above the law?"  That fluff doesn't exist, therefore the aircraft are unfluffy!  They closest thing to that, thus far, is the bit where DA Techmarines fabricate a weapon carried by an illegal aircraft...and deny knowledge of the STC they use to create the weapon...not the aircraft.  For the navy not be be up in arms over the fact that the marines have an air force of their own now, when they're unhappy enough that they have the transport capacity to self-deploy their ground forces, is unfluffy.  For the inquisition not to be using this breach of "the way things work" (navy does the flying, MI does the dying) as an excuse to launch investigations that are actually looking into completely unrelated suspicions of heresy and such...unfluffy.  No, it's as if GW said:  "Well, we wrote that fluff a while ago, so it's not that big a deal to just pretend it's not there...look, GamerZ!  Shiny, expensive toys!"

[Cactus]

*Gives March10k a round of applause.*