++2014 Community IA Creation Project++ COMPLETE!

[Olis]

The finished article will be posted in the very near future.

 

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I shall leave the original post alone, for the sake of the records. So let's get that out of the way - it'll be left at the bottom of this post if anyone wishes to read it.

 

So, after conferring with my fellow Mods here (Messor and Aquilanus) and one of our Admins (Brother Tyler), I have come to the conclusion that the 2013 challenge, though while still technically on going, is not valid anymore due to the current year (2014). In lieu of a next challenge (yet), it seems prudent to complete the task we set ourselves last year. 

 

And here is the solution; a straight forward IA creation challenge. The stipulation? Using the information based on the cliff notes and later, you will be required to provide an article of the Sons of Sköll. Basically it'll be a challenge to see who can produce the best article (filling in the blanks and whatnot) out of what the 2013 challenge gave us. Y'know - polish, pictures, sidebars and everything, preferably.

 

Discussion will still be allowed in this thread but completed IA's of the Sons of Sköll should really be posted up separately, to avoid clutter and give each entry a chance to be reviewed fairly and clearly. We will allow a touch of leeway in regards to tweaks to the established details but, be warned, substantial changes will likely be frowned upon (but not disqualified - a good IA is still a good IA). 

 

Hopefully a tentative completion date of the end of April should be enough time to garner some interest and complete this project before moving onto other projects in the works.

 

The winner will be selected out of the entrants and entered into the annals of history (well, it'll be the Liber's pet chapter for this year, at least). 

 

 

 

 

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Hello, brothers and sisters of the Liber. So, I hear you ask, what is this community project you speak of? Well, Fraters, I would like to present a project in the form of an IA article. So far, so topic title. Okay, perhaps I should be more informative; basically I want to tackle two difficult subjects (some might even say taboos) of the Liber: A Space Wolf successor chapter and the Dark/Cursed Foundings. As we all know, both of these subjects can stunt a nascent IA and can even put off a prospective Liberite when done badly and the C&C proves... unkind. Such difficult hurdles to overcome are daunting but not impossible. So, just to be clear, we're making a Cursed/Dark founding Space Wolves successor. 

 

Here is where this community project steps in. We would like to see an example of how it can be done right, with input from the Fraters themselves. The process won't be strictly democratic (which can get somewhat messy as people see fit to agree or disagree), so we will be cherry picking ideas by merit, rationale and, later on, contiguity. Rest assured that will not mean we will not consider all suggestions and reasoning. Everyone will get a say. Be warned that ill-thought out or one sentence posts, in terms of ideas, may not be the best way of convincing us to use your input. Please try to provide suitable insight on any ideas you have or like. Suffice to say, critical thinking will be needed.

 

We will be following the standard format for IA creation but this'll be a community project. Besides the gene lineage and the founding (well, sorta - we might toss a coin for that one), everything is up to the Fraters. What is their name? Will they be Loyalists? Are they Codex adherant? All these questions and more will be raised by me or Messor and they will be answered by the Fraters. Those ideas that have merit will hopefully shine through and in time a shining gem of an IA will be the result. Fingers crossed.

 

 

 

First and foremost, we must begin at the beginning. We shall explore allegiance first (as this will affect the name) - will the chapter be loyal to the Throne or will they be renegades (or even Chaos marines)? Try to have in mind the direction you'd want to take this force. Think ahead. Do you think something about being a Space Wolf successor/Dark/Cursed Founding Chapter will make them more or less likely to be loyalist? Try to imagine a loose background for each scenario.

[Dosjetka]

I'd love to see a well-done renegade/Traitor Chapter. Not that there aren't any, but they are uncommon, from what I've seen (which could be all wrong, since I'm not around much these days). And since we're using SW geneseed, we could cover an aspect of the Viking theme that the Space Wolves don't have: the historical Vikings were (some would say insanely) brave when the odds were in their favour. However, when those odds turned, it was every man to himself and most if the time it would result in the retreat if the Viking army/raid group. So, in a way, they were cowards and I think that this would tie in well with a renegade/Traitor Chapter. Or we could go along with a Chapter whose geneseed was already unstable due to their heritage, which got worse because of whatever curse afflicts them (it ain't called the "Cursed" Founding for nothin', y'know), and so get chased away by the Inquisition but remain loyal to the ideals of the Imperium/are bitter about the whole thing and cast off the mantle of the loyalist Chapter and fully embrace the powers of the Dark Gods, turning into horribly mutated but powerful Astartes, probably few in number, selling themselves off to the highest bidder as mercenaries.

 

Oh, and apologies for the jumbled post, kinda doing this on the fly-by.

 

Cheers,

 

Ludovic

 

EDIT: Great idea Oli and Messor :tu:

[Aqui]

I had written a post about how choices and other circumstances affect how a Cursed Chapter might behave, but it ended up being a synopsis of one of my own Chapters from that Founding :lol:

 

A Chapter could be Cursed like the Lamenters, and still (the Badab War not counting, and even then they weren't truly traitors, merely...misguided) the kept to the Emperor.

 

If a Chapter is exposed to enough "stress" or circumstances then even the most noble would/could fall, much less one that was born under a tainted star like the 21st Founding.

 

Whilst their loyalty or not is important to bear in mind from the beginning, some significant thought should be put into what the Chapter encounters that would affect their mindset and ultimately their (lack of) loyalty.

[Messor]

Whilst their loyalty or not is important to bear in mind from the beginning, some significant thought should be put into what the Chapter encounters that would affect their mindset and ultimately their (lack of) loyalty.

Exactly right, Aquilanus. We'd like you all to be able to center your suggestions around that idea. Granted its probably easier to justify a loyalist Chapter, but if you think the better story would come from a renegade/traitor, share why. It'll be the ideas behind the 'votes', rather than the suggestions themselves, that move this little known descendant of Russ forward.

[Emperors Immortals]

First, wonderful idea and one ill be able to contribute to in a humble way now were in our new house.

So, persecution. How would the I feel about a 21st turning renegade? I personally can see a SW 21st'er being driven to the Viking ideas above due to Sw and I persecution mercenary but nit necessarily corrupt. Onsidering SW don't necessarily do what the I say it could get very hairy. Sorry for poor grammer etc. I'm posting from a phone deep in the Aussie bush.

[Dosjetka]

Messor: Forgive me, but I'm not sure that I understand what you are on about... :/ But then again, I have just woken up, which could explain a thing or two...

 

Ludovic

[Messor]

Sorry, Ludo, I knew the thing was awkwardly worded, but I was tired myself. Basically, while we are deciding on this successor's loyalty right now, we want to do so with ideas already in mind of why they are or aren't loyal. This may mean that you give some thought already to whether you think they should be 13th or 21st Founding, and that's fine as well. Make sense?

[Firepower]

Ohhh, I could have fun with this! ~menacingly rubs hands together~

 

Have we any links that would be helpful for research on the core subjects?

[Olis]

Have we any links that would be helpful for research on the core subjects?

Well, without trying to be obtuse, The Guide to DIYing and the Octaguide are required reading but if you need broad strokes of the information you're looking for, try the wikis out there. Just don't expect them to be entirely accurate or up to date.

Also - the Ctrl-F function is your friend. I seriously recommend using it when looking for info on large webpages.

[Messor]

I believe the Lexicanum is generally considered more accurate than the 40kwiki, but don't quote me on that.

[Dosjetka]

I believe the Lexicanum is generally considered more accurate than the 40kwiki, but don't quote me on that.

+1

 

And thanks for clearing that up Messor :)

[Firepower]

I was working under the impression that the Lexicanum was...let's just say untrustworthy.

The issue of research isn't so much how to create a DIY Olisredan, but on solid info related to the Wolves and Cursed Foundings. I have some books laying about that I can look to, but I figured it would be good to have some links for those that don't (and for those of us that always want MOOOOOORE!!!!).

[Dosjetka]

Well, al I can say is that you can find some veeeeeeery dodgy stuff on 40kwiki and some of it is just a copy/paste of Lexicanum. So yeah, I trust Lexicanum more than I do 40kwiki. Though I do go on the latter when information is sparse on the former.

 

Ludovic

[Dosjetka]

Dead or dormant?

[Olis]

Was kinda waiting for more input from other members.

[Octavulg]

Who the hell has ever complained about people doing Cursed Founding chapters?

Seriously. I want names. Because I don't remember anyone ever doing it, and that's the second time I've heard about it.

Also, I have, on 40Kwiki, seen the head admin refuse to delete a page about a Chapter with no sources demonstrating they exist until someone provides him with "hard proof" or until Lexicanum does. So if he thinks Lexicanum is more reliable, I'd go with Lexicanum.

In any case...what's their Curse? Because that'd have a huge impact on whether or not they turned traitor, and why, etc. I'd lean traitor over loyalist, but either's really fine.

[Hrvat]

I'll see if I can set aside enough time to provide meaningful contribution to the discussion.

As of basic thoughts I believe they should be loyal and codex adherant along with their curse. In my opinion it will give them greater focus and at the same time set up for a more challenging writing tasks to show how they cope with maintaining their functionaltiy in face of adversity.

 

 

Cheers

 

Hrvat

[Cage304]

Are we starting with a completely fresh chapter or could we flesh out an existing chapter from cannon. If we go with the latter I would recommend the Red Wolves. I feel that they could be similar to the Blood Drinkers  in that as a later founding they would have some of the imagery of the parent chapter but have to adhere to codex markings.

[Firepower]

In any case...what's their Curse?

This is the bit I've been mulling over. I'll gladly pop in and throw it into the gauntlet of peer review once I finish baking the thought.

[Olis]

Are we starting with a completely fresh chapter or could we flesh out an existing chapter from cannon. If we go with the latter I would recommend the Red Wolves. I feel that they could be similar to the Blood Drinkers  in that as a later founding they would have some of the imagery of the parent chapter but have to adhere to codex markings.

 

This is a completely fresh IA, so we aren't tied in whatever manner we might be should we have picked up a little-talked-about chapter. 

 

And in regards to a curse, it'll be up to the community to make one. :)

[Ferrata]

Let's presume you take them the way of the Cursed Founding, because that is the most reasonable angle for messing around with gene-seed over the Dark Founding which is just a mystery. You need to answer the following questions:

1. What were they trying to fix/improve?
2. What actually happened (the curse)?
3. How does this make the Imperium respond to them?

So, with the Space Wolf gene-seed, what could they be attempting to fix/improve? Well, they might just want a Space Wolf chapter, who are well known to be a pretty good chapter at dealing with baddies, but are a little more house trained, not so barbaric. Maybe they were attempting to make a house trained Space Wolf chapter that could be used like the Space Wolves were used by the Big E. They would need to overcome the link to the Wulfen and the Helix Canis - which would be the subtle alterations to the gene-seed which the AM were doing.
 

Now, if you give your new house-trained SW some calming leaders - say Ultramarines, in the hope that between the nature of their dampened gene-seed and the nurture of being led by level-headed Ultramarines leaves you with a chapter that is as good as the Space Wolves but are more controllable. You could even, as me and an old board member/friend once discussed, have them with trigger words. Docile, normal marines one minute - full on barbaric killing machines the next moment because someone has uttered a trigger-word. 

As for a curse, well without trigger-words you have any number of options. I've always found Cursed Chapters should have an amount of irony in them - their curse and their advantages almost seem counter to each other. Maybe their is some doping going on with the marines to keep them calm, but eventually this becomes too much and the marines just stop fighting - the become pacifists. You end up with a chapter of really young marines because the old ones have to be put down because they just wont fight anymore. Seems like a terrible curse for a Space Wolf chapter. Brain storming other ideas - you've got the obvious the become feral but that seems a little cliche. Reduce sensory reception as they grow older - the fiddling with the gene-seed has led them to reduce the benefits of the SW seed. 

I'd love to see a well-done renegade/Traitor Chapter. Not that there aren't any, but they are uncommon, from what I've seen (which could be all wrong, since I'm not around much these days).

Ahem. :P

[Octavulg]

And in regards to a curse, it'll be up to the community to make one.

My question was a subtle hint that the Curse is at the core of any Cursed Founding chapter, and so it should be the first or second thing you work out.

Ferrata's assessment of the thought process of Cursed Founding is right. The major unique factor of the Wolves' geneseed is the Canis Helix - it makes sense for it to be messing with that to some extent. The question is what they'd be after. Stablizing and limiting it could be one thing, but where's the fun in that?

Things they could try for, off the top of my head:

Regularizing the whole Wulfen process - they maintain their mental faculties while still having the massive werewolfiness. Or making them able to call upon it at will.

Grafting the benefits of some other animal into it - were-lizards are fun.

Using the Canis Helix to bring abhumans closer to human norms as Space Marines. Though Sanguinius' geneseed might work better for that. Curse ends up basically not working, and abhuman traits reassert themselves.

One could also do something with the whole "acute senses" thing - enhancing even the Space Wolves' superhuman abilities. Then have them fall to Slaanesh, of course.

Remember - the curse can be a pretty good thing that just comes with misfortune and terrible geneseed stability.

[WatchCaptainAzrael]

Being a Space Wolf successor is its own Curse.

[Firepower]

Messing with the Cais Helix does seem the obvious way to go, but I would personally like to see a curse which wasn't quite so train-of-thought.

The one I have going in my head is that they try to curb the Helix a bit, make the Wolves a bit more docile/maleable, including an attempted removal of the Wulfen problem. With those things limited, they hope to have a Chapter just as capable of doing the dirty work that the Wolves are counted on for, but without that whole irritatingly unpredictable nature.

As an unforseen consequence of muddling about with the gene-seed, signs eventually start popping up that the new Marines have a higher than average metabolism. Just a seemingly harmless thing that the body has done to compensate for the changes.

So the Marines are a bit hungrier than normal. Big deal. But then the effect snowballs. At a climactic moment on the battlefield, the dam breaks and they go total Flesh Eater cannibal on the enemy. And their allies. And their dead. And eventually themselves.

It may be a bit more appropriate to have that pivotal event occur during a war of attrition, sort of a desperate act that they come to like, rather than all Black Ragey and spontaneous.

Eat eat eat, blood blood kill blood. Khorne steps in and goes 'Cool, you guys got a good thing going. Let me just pop you around the galaxy for a few thousand years and you can eat all you want,' or something to that extent.

So the attempt to make them docile, more normal marines turns them into ravenous animals.

[Olis]

Okay, so we're pretty much agreed on the Founding being Cursed rather than Dark. Fair enough. It also seems like we're leaning towards renegades here with rejiggered Canis Helix genes. Really appreciate the ideas and input so far, gentlemen. Also glad to see Ferrata weighing in on this - having an old hand (Mod-wise) taking a look at things is quite reassuring.

 

The one I have going in my head is that they try to curb the Helix a bit, make the Wolves a bit more docile/maleable, including an attempted removal of the Wulfen problem.  With those things limited, they hope to have a Chapter just as capable of doing the dirty work that the Wolves are counted on for, but without that whole irritatingly unpredictable nature.

 

As an unforseen consequence of muddling about with the gene-seed, signs eventually start popping up that the new Marines have a higher than average metabolism.  Just a seemingly harmless thing that the body has done to compensate for the changes.

 

So the Marines are a bit hungrier than normal. Big deal.  But then the effect snowballs.  At a climactic moment on the battlefield, the dam breaks and they go total Flesh Eater cannibal on the enemy.  And their allies.  And their dead.  And eventually themselves. 

 

I really quite like this idea, good intentions paving the way to hell and all that. Mixing that in with Ferrata's thoughts on putting down the older astartes (or perhaps sending them on suicide missions?) might be good to add a little extra something to the pot. Maybe the older marines simply cannot control their cravings and simply begin to eat the dead (which might be something to explore in the chapter's culture). As things got worse, the cravings would garner attention from certain Imperial institutions and that's when the crap hits the fan, so to speak. 

 

Another thing to think about is the overall theme of the culture that this chapter has, perhaps leaning towards Ludovic's Viking theme. I have a mental image of after-battle feasts aboard the strike cruiser in orbit or at the fortress monastery. Come to think of it... if they had a high metabolism, they'd want to feast quite often...