GodEmperorOfMankind Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Looking on the Forgeworld website, I noticed the Spartan rules allows you to include it in a CSM army as a heavy support choice. link here What are people's thoughts on this? I'm currently scratch building a spartan (will cost roughly £20-£30) for my Heresy force, and the thought of having one for my 40k army is very enticing! Which would be the better armament for 40k, Heavy bolters, Reapers or heavy flamers? Is daemonic possession worth it? Also, why would you ever take laser destroyer over quad lascannons? (I know this doesn't appy to the chaos version, but still) Note: I realise the whole FW not allowed in tournaments/store thing. But I mainly play again friends who have no problem with fielding cool stuff - Sorry Jeske, guess this rules you out of the discussion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jansuza Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 As with all FW things, and as you mentioned, you can't use it in most cases, but as a standalone choice, it's friggin' amazing. For 40 points more than a chaos landraider, you can get a tank with one more hullpoint, immunity to melta rules, two extra twin-las shots, a reaper autocannon upgrade, and improved transport capacity. If that wasn't already enough reason to take it, you get power of the machine spirit as well, which the chaos landy seriously needs. Kinda shows why FW choices aren't normally allowed in a nutshell. Every chaos player would be playing with three if it were in the actual codex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
*Furyou Miko Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Except for the fact that Forge World is now fully integrated with the 6th edition rulebook and compendiums, and has been fully legal for standard 40k game play for two years now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodEmperorOfMankind Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 @jansuza It doesn't get PotMS though, states that in the rules sadly :( @Miko Yes I agree with you fully on that, however as people rightly point out, if tournaments/stores don't allow them, most people won't consider them legal, regardless of what's correct. Also these rules are stamped experimental, so opponents permission only. Regardless, My friends won't have an issue playing against any FW stuff I get. I'm after views on it's viability in a regular game of 40k. Reapers as an upgrade then? is Daemonic possession worth it? As for Transport, who's best to get in there? I was thinking of my Termie lord and a bunch of CC termie bodyguard, any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 This is a tasty burger...err, assault tank! of course, obvious faction-ism is obvious: no PotMS but same points cost for chaos? is it because we are black (legion)? no armored ceramite hurts, too (transports are bound to reach melta-range). daemonic possession, while fun (nomnom), isn't really good, as few things penetrate AV14. compaired to the HH rules, the laser destroyer has lost AP1. maybe that's a typo, but it sure invalidates this option completely. I'd say take 2 extra heavy flamers. Reaper and MM plus 4 lascans are overkill against most vehicles and chaos can't split fire anyway, so have a little anti-horde to clear your assault ramp. but what would you put inside? 20 berzerkers? 10 melee terminators? 3 mutilators (LOL)? at least it's an assault vehicle! >300 points. Worth it? and then I come to think of how a loyalist (or HH) one with armored ceramite and 3 techmarines inside might do on the battlefield... Oh and don't worry about FW. The stamp is clearly visible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodEmperorOfMankind Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 I read the FAQ for the new imperial armour, and it states that laser destroyer should be AP2 across the board, so I don't think it's a typo. Odd that HH is AP1 and not FAQ'd, but hey, I didn't want them anyway :D Yeah I think 300 points is worth it to transport my Termie lord and 10 strong bodyguard, Just a shame you can't buy it as a dedicated transport ;) As I'll be using Tartaros/deathshroud/justaerin armour to represent my IW lord and Termies, they'll all fit nicely together and will go towards my pre-heresy as well! Guess I best get on with it then! H Flamer mounts instead of the H bolter looks like a good option then, I'll do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 justaerin are way overcosted sadly. deathshroud rock, though. be sure to add techmarines! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodEmperorOfMankind Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 Oh I'm only using the parts to make normal and cataphractii models. I'll hopefully have some pics up soon enough. So do you recommend a warpsmith to sit with the termie lord and bodyguard in the Spartan then? lord plus 10 termies = 24 spaces, so I could squeeze him in at the back ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 sure, why not. if you already put all your eggs in that basket, make it comfy (and hope it delivers before you meet a meltagun =/). I'm thinking more along the lines of: *************** 2 HQ *************** Legion Praetor - Cataphractii armour + - Combi-flamer - Paragon blade - Grenade harness - Chem-Munitions Deathshroud Terminator Squad 10 Deathshroud Terminators - Melta bombs *************** 1 Elite *************** Techmarine Covenant + - Power axe - Combi-melta - Rad grenades - Servo-arm + - Power axe - Combi-melta - Servo-arm + - Power axe - Combi-melta - Servo-arm *************** 1 Heavy Support *************** Legion Spartan Assault Tank - Quad lascannons - Twin-linked heavy flamer - Dozer blade - Auxiliary drive - Extra armour - Armoured ceramite - Flare shield - Frag assault launchers - Chem-Munitions - Heavy flamer -->Death Guard : 1192pts add in pride of the legion, 2 more tech covenants and spartans, 2x 10 terminators with axes/chemflamers, another praetor, mortarion. note: this is not sparta - this is madness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sception Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 It's nice, but losing good rules and options in exchange for nothing puts a bitter taste in my mouth, to the point that I have no desire to spend money on it. If GW and FW want to arbitrarily kick chaos players in our shins, then they can suck it and I'll take my money elsewhere. Even if that's not an issue for you, it costs about the same points as a Storm Eagle. Just throwing that out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 and its not like the chaos eagle is good or anything. no potms , no ceramite , not access to the good weapons . high cost. dies from anti av13+ like any other av13-14 tank. not worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodEmperorOfMankind Posted February 27, 2013 Author Share Posted February 27, 2013 Not a fan of either transport then Jeske? What's your suggestion? One of the reason's I'm discussing it is because a) I want one for my Pre-heresy army b) I can make one for very little monies So I figured if I'm having one, and I now find I can take one for my chaos army, why shouldn't I? What's a better option? Jeske has a rather blunt way of speaking, and I know he's not for everyone, but his opinion's on tourney/optimal lists are always worth listening too and I welcome it, even if I then choose to disregard it :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 you walk . if you want to go fast around the table you use bikes or flyers . another option is to use the SW codex and get good rules , like proper POTMS stuff , drop pods etc. am not talking tournament here as FW is not ok for a lot of them .I know its regional , but for example main land europe it is total no go. For the same points I could ally in some IG weapon platoforms and get cheap and nice support units. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rune Priest Ridcully Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 The fact we lose out on some of the best bits of it, and don't get anything to compensate... there is a reason GW/FW's treatment of chaos has been driving me into the arms of their competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plaguecaster Posted February 27, 2013 Share Posted February 27, 2013 Wait its still experimental I wonder when FW are going to update it hopefully they fix the chaos part at least they could give it a price decrease. It looks like a nice tank but I would never use one as it is just costs too much I prefer the storm eagle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 It's nice, but losing good rules and options in exchange for nothing puts a bitter taste in my mouth, to the point that I have no desire to spend money on it. Agreed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derpasaurus Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 It's amazing how often "just play space wolves, they're better anyway" comes up on the chaos undivided forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 why ? same dude made both dex , they have same build types . why shouldnt one be always better ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lieutenant Steel Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 I would have thought that the point of having an Undivided Forum was to make the best out of the Undivided/ general Chaos units?If people are posting here it's because they want to use what is available (with the codex they have chosen - C:CSM) and want advice on using it. The last thing people want is to come here and hear 'We should all just be using Space Wolves' because they chose not to play Space Wolves when they started a CSM army.Back OT: The extra tank looks interesting, but I don't know how practical it would be for the price- it seems very expensive and given that the original Chaos LR was a points sink it strikes me that this will go the same way: over costed, underused and frequently ignored (by Chaos players). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 If people are posting here it's because they want to use what is available (with the codex they have chosen - C:CSM) and want advice on using it. The last thing people want is to come here and hear 'We should all just be using Space Wolves' because they chose not to play Space Wolves when they started a CSM army. and they have an option , at least technicly . they can pick something which is bad [chaos eagle , chaos spartan] or get the same game play and use SW . I mean I did write this down or didnt I ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 Except for the fact that Forge World is now fully integrated with the 6th edition rulebook and compendiums, and has been fully legal for standard 40k game play for two years now. I wouldnt let ppl use FW stuff, and I dont know anyone who does. Its hard enough keeping up w everyones codex and errata, etc, then I'm supposed to keep up w everything FW spits out too (some of which is pretty crazy) , no thanks. Doesnt matter if its legal if ppl, stores and tourneys wont let you use it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted February 28, 2013 Share Posted February 28, 2013 legal is what people agree upon, FW or any edition or codex of 40k. I don't get this "I won't play you if you use x"-additude. Then don't and go play with yourself... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 nope that is not legal , that is what is accepted . in europe "FW legal without asking[]" is what we call a dead law, People in UK or in US can say what they want on the forums , thing is europe is mainly 1500pts , the stuff that actualy gets played from FW is unbalanced [iG sentry guns , rams in 5th , more flyers for armies that already have flyers] and gives nothing to a lot of armies at this points . So people dont accept it and dont play it .+ the fact that the FW teams itself say that FW is w40k apporved but your opponent has to be happy[aka ok] with you to play it ,kind of a gets lost in translation I think , because it is hard to say how is this different from being forced to ask , if someone can use FW stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warsmith Aznable Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Except for the fact that Forge World is now fully integrated with the 6th edition rulebook and compendiums, and has been fully legal for standard 40k game play for two years now. I wouldnt let ppl use FW stuff, and I dont know anyone who does. Its hard enough keeping up w everyones codex and errata, etc, then I'm supposed to keep up w everything FW spits out too (some of which is pretty crazy) , no thanks. Doesnt matter if its legal if ppl, stores and tourneys wont let you use it. I don't understand why a store would care. I can see someone who didn't expect to face FW rules being cranky, and I could even understand a tournament trying to keep competition accessible by restricting players to the codex, but why on earth would a store ban certain models from casual play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nehekhare Posted March 1, 2013 Share Posted March 1, 2013 Jeske, everybody has to ask beforehand, regardless of what they're playing. That is just good manners. And that people only play what is unbalanced (aka good) is buisness as usual ;) Your part of europe may differ from mine (we mostly play 2k here, for instance), but legal (in the sense of RAW) means "40k-approved", even if people don't accept that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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