An onslaught of questions- Mostly about a finnicky airbrush

[Firepower]

Okie doke. Now, I'm finally taking the plunge and investing in an airbrush. It brings questions, which I hope you fine folks can answer.

Firstly, the color scheme-

I'm not sure on what brown would be best. It's like Graveyeard Earth, but just a smidge darker. Anyone know the closest Vallejo Model Air color, and a darker color for shading? I have a conversion chart but it's a bit...off. And it uses old GW colors which is also a pain.

As I'll be freehanding the blue and silver details, I imagine it'll be best to keep the airbrush plan simple, as in just the base color and one shading color. I'd hate to screw up a complicated 4 layer airbrushing with a clumsy brushstroke

Next question- How do you folks do your washes? I've come to conclude that one issue I've had is my brushes not being a proper sort, which I can fix easily enough. But when cleaning up the pooling, do you suggest full bodied brushes? Wet or dry? And how do you fight gravity when you're trying to get it into the edges at the top of the model, i.e. getting it to darken the rim of the upper part of a Marine shoulderpad.

Next question- Airbrushes can be used to prime, which I'm very much looking forward to. But what would be the best primer (black, gray or white). Should I just use the respective colors or are there specific paints meant for priming that I can use?

Next question- When using masking tape, is any old masking tape gonna work, or are there specific brands/purpose built sorts I should look for?

That's all I got for now

[Captain_Quirk]

A few things I do when washing -

I always wait for my model to dry before washing. I use the Citadel Wash Brush. There's a lot of internet hate on the Citadel range but for my level I think they're damn fantastic. Depending on how much I am doing, I generally fully load the brush and then clean up after. Clean up is done by rinsing the brush in my water pot and then sucking the excess off in my mouth (yes I am one of those people. :p ). Sucking it pulls a huge amount of moisture off the bristles and leaves them reasonably dry, then it's as simple as popping the point of the brush into any pools you want to clean up. The advantage here is once you've sucked up some of the excess, you can use it to touch up any areas that are lacking.

Depending on the area I am washing I will let my model sit normally, lay it on it's side or even clamp it upside down. It all depends on where you want the wash to run.

Hope that helps a bit! :)

[Lorenzen]

okay, so i was bored and did a psuedo test model in your colours because its easier to do that and explain things than just use words..

 

http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2013/061/0/e/313733_10151419996851406_1545795271_n_by_typhion-d5wr5mk.jpg

 

this guy was done with the colours in the background, whole model was sprayed with german cammo black brown, then given a coat of usa olive drab from about a 45 degree angle onto the model (leaving the darker brown in on the lower side of things, steel legion drab was then airbrushed from an almost vertical position onto the model.

 

whole thing was washed with a mix of agrax earthshade mixed with a little black and gloss varnish (gloss helps it go into the recesses) any areas that the wash was pooling into i soaked up using my standard brush (size 0 w&n) which was then dried on tissue and repeated for other areas.. once the wash dried steel legion drab was used to highlight the edges (the wash dulls down the base colour) then a final highlight of baneblade brown was used and anywhere that i wanted to shade by hand was done with german c black brown (round the wrists etc)

 

everything was thinned down with "astonish car care anti fog glass cleaner" from halfords.. because i couldnt find my giant bottle of non branded industrial glass cleaner and im a cheapskate.

 

the glossiness will be killed off when the model is varnished so isnt something to worry about

 

best primer is vallejo surface primer (grey) its a very pale grey but its awesome stuff. if you want black you can use black.. but im a massive advocate of grey primers (halfords rattle can one is amazing too and darker) essentially its all about using proper primer as primer rather than just paint.

 

masking tape wise i use a big ass roll i got from b & q, the only thing i will say is that i tend to stick it to my trouser leg/shirt before applying it to models.. less tacky that way and wont take the paint with it.. tamiya stuff is probably decent but as said earlier im a cheapskate.

[Firepower]

Wow, that's pretty damn comprehensive :D

 

I'm liking how it came out!

 

Questions- Vallejo surface primer can be airbrushed on?  I'm assuming if so, it needs to be thinned for spraying just like regular paint?

 

Mix with agrax earthshade- is that black paint or wash?  Also, any brand preference on gloss varnish?  And I'm guessing to only use a small bit of black and varnish?

 

Thinner- if I do feel like paying an extra $5, how is liquitex airbrush medium?

 

It looks like the metal bits were painted before washing?  Was the blue painted on last?

 

And just to make sure I have the brands right-

 

german camo black brown- vallejo model color

usa olive drab- vallejo model color

steel legion drab- GW

agrax earthshade- GW

baneblade brown- GW

vallejo surface primer...duh.

 

Am I missing any?

[Lorenzen]

vallejo surface primer doesnt need thinning its liquid win.

 

its black paint.. gloss varnish wise i use pledge multi surface wax (formerly known as klear) its really thin, very shiny and cheap (i store a small amount in an empty vallejo dropper bottle.. rest is in its big floor wax bottle on my windowsill waiting for the dropper to run out)

 

never used the liquitex stuff, the only "proper" thinners ive used are testors, which is just glass cleaner but more expensive and tamiya (which i use for tamiya paints unsurprisingly) most of them are just automotive glass cleaner in a fancy bottle tbh.

 

the metals were done after the wash (because i forgot to do them) theyre just boltgun metal for the rims and the chest is boltgun washed with agrax... i do recommend model air steel as an alternative to mithril and the such.. its a really really nice paint and works well for highlighting as its rather thin.

 

the blue was done last, then lined with german cam brown because i messed it up a bit.

 

thats everything i think.. glad to be of help. :)

[Firepower]

Hrm, a bit worried about that freehand bit.  I've got blue arrows and silver(the wind-like symbols) details to brush on by hand, and the smoother the transition of browns after airbrush, the more a mistake will cost me.

 

Maybe doing them before the wash will help cover up any brown touch-ups, and then they can just be highlighted a bit afterwards.

 

Thanks for the note on metal paints.  GW's have never been very impressive in my eyes, in terms of highlighting.

[Lorenzen]

if you put a little bit of thinner on the end of your brush you can "erase" mistakes by gently rubbing the brush over them.. just did it on the blue arrow on the leg to make sure i wasnt talking out my arse

[Firepower]

Which could then go right on to erase the paint underneath, couldn't it? Also, what sort of thinner?

[Lorenzen]

if you are paranoid about it erasing the paint underneath you could varnish it pre blue bits.. and in my case the glass cleaner i use to thin my paints.. ill give the test model a good thorough rub in a bit and see if it works its way through the wash/pledge mix combo.

 

*update* okay with gentle pressure the paint wasnt going anywhere.. it took me using a somewhat knackered old brush and actually rubbing the model to get through.. if you get round to trying this method out, id suggest having a go on a test model or something just to see what i mean.. shouldnt be too much of a problem for you as long as you keep the pressure light.

[Firepower]

Related question, this is the kit I am looking at.  Thoughts?

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PRO-0-2-0-3-0-5-Fine-Detail-Dual-Action-Gravity-Airbrush-Kit-Tank-Air-Compressor-/190797657925?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c6c6d3745

[Lorenzen]

looks okay to me, better than the one i started with for sure!

[Adeptus-Alaska]

liquitex airbrush medium is awesome. i use it to thin my brush on paints as well.

[Firepower]

So I got my airbrush, I'm using the paints recommended (which are looking pretty good so far), but I am having an issue with the airbrush itself.

No matter what I try, it seems I always have to take the brush apart for a full cleaning when switching colors. Just running cleaner (tried Windex and Medea so far) and water through the brush is never enough to get all the residue, and it will just keep on spraying out color. I look at videos on how to clean when changing colors, and these guys just run some water through, take a paper towel to the hopper, and it's done.

When I do clean it between the colors, it's the needle that tends to be the dirtiest from end to end, but everything else is fairly dirty too.

So, what am I doing to cause the issue?

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

This is literally all I do to clean my airbrush every time I use it:

 

 

I rinse through with Windex first, then a little alcohol, take the needle out and (carefully) wipe it clean with alcohol on a rag, put it back in and blast a spot more alcohol through. Done. :D

[Firepower]

Again, way more cooperative than mine :P  I satin varnished a single model last night as an experiment.  For less than 30 seconds of spraying, it took my over 45 minutes to clean out the damn thing and fix a clog.  One. Single. Model.

 

I hit it with Medea, spray.  Pull out the needle, wipe it, and spray some more.  Wipe down with a swab.  Reinsert needle.  If it sprays at all after that, it will still be spraying the last thing I loaded it with :verymad:

 

The only way I can get clean spray thus far is by taking apart the whole front end and doing a thorough scrub (which is horribly time consuming when you're just doing one test model bit by bit).

 

I thin my paints to a milky texture too, and the times I've tried doing even slightly more it came came out way too runny.  The only other thing I can think of is that I'm using a tiny .2mm needle.  I'll be trying the .5 it came with later tonight to see if that's any more cooperative.

[Lorenzen]

Are you thinning the varnish at all? I thin mine with a touch of water (bar the pledge) just to make it flow better.

 

I use a renegade krome with a .3 needle mostly and dont tend to get many issues.

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

Hmm.. From my (limited) experience with my airbrush, I found my .2mm very difficult to use. Clogged up very easily, even with well thinned paints. I use my .3mm for everything I do, mostly priming/basecoating, and it gives me no trouble at all. My .5mm needle worked well too, but I found I used a lot of paint with it. My airbrush is nothing special either, just a 'made-in-china-eBay-special'. Are you mixing your paints with the thinner before you put it in the cup (assuming its a gravity fed airbrush) or do you mix in the cup. I've had a little trouble with clogging once or twice when I first started when mixing in the cup, not getting all the paint thinned out leading to thicker lumps drying rapidly on the tip of the needle.

[Firepower]

I mix in the cup, on account that I haven't found a way to transfer just-mixed paint into the cup without losing some along the way- using a q-tip, paint knife, or whatever always wastes paint.  But when I mix in the cup, I strive to mix it up before it falls into the firing chamber.

 

I'm thinking I should try my .3 tonight and see if it hates me less.  I don't need super precision for what I'm doing with it anyway.

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

Good luck with the .3mm. :)

 

Also are you thinning your paints enough? (Not thinned enough would dry faster in the airbrush and cause clogging) I know that 'milk-like' consistency gets thrown around a lot, but it should be something like that when using the .3mm, it would have to be closer to ink in cosistency for the .2mm, in my opinion. And what do you use to thin your paints/which paints do you use? I use windex with GW and VGC, and a mix of windex with a touch of alcohol for GW's new black primer. Oh and one last thing, do you do the 'blow back' thing (don't know the correct term) when cleaning your airbrush? When your shooting your thinner through it to clean it out, put your finger over the nozzle and it will bubble back into the cup a bit. I'm sure its important... :D

[Firepower]

I've used Windex, Vallejo Thinner, and water.  I do the blowback technique, but it's something of a pain and ineffective when cleaning in a hurry (to beat the paint before it dries) as the tip of my airbrush is a jagged shape, and I cannot form a good enough contact with my finger against it.  So I have to take it off to do that technique, which eats up time.  I hear shoving the nozzle into water has the same affect somehow, though to me that seems it would just blow bubbles :teehee:

 

When cleaning it, I use Medea cleaner currently.  I used Windex originally and it did just as poorly.

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

Hmmmmm.... Your problems are racking my brains... Wish I knew more about airbrushing! :D You're not filling your paint cup all the way to the top are you?

[Firepower]

Nope. I think I've only even filled it halfway once.

My brain is also racked, hence the questions

Another fun thing that I fixed but just highlights the way this thing hates me, the secondary lever just popped out of the thing a few days ago. No reason that I could see. Just 'PING!' and suddenly I'm holding a piece of the airbrush.

It's not a bad airbrush (as far as I can tell) but between the general finicky nature of airbrushes and my inexperience, it's a bit like beating my head against a wall so far.

Now that my test models are almost done though, I am quite confident the effort will be worth the pay off. These particular problems won't be such a huge deal once I am painting in bulk anyway.

EDIT++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Went and picked up the airbrush. It was clear last night. When I picked it up, it was jammed again. A bit of prodding got it buzzing again, slightly. Switched to .3 tip. Wouldn't fire at first. This is disconcerting, as only one piece was no replaced when i switch needles (the large bit between the hopper and the nozzle cap) and it was very and visibly clean. So, another case of 'How the hell is this clogged?'

When I feed the needle in backwards, it tends to hit some resistance behind the hopper. It doesn't feel like a clog, it feels like a piece of the insides are getting in the way, but it eventually slips around/passed and through the gun.

Because of the resistance, I decided to cram a pipecleaner through the gun, going under and passed the hopper, but it could only go so far (not all the way through). It came back a bit brown, presumably because of the brown paint I am using. HOpefully it's not becaue I just cleaned out some important grease or something.

A bit more cajoling, and water was shooting through well enough. If I go pick it up tomorrow and find it is clogged, I am going to be rather angry.

Related note, is there a way to clean and scrub the gun beneath and passed the hopper? I believe the part is called the needle guide.

[DarkMark]

Unless you know what you're doing using such as small, as a 0,2, will definately cause you problems. Swap up to the 0,3 for all your general work, and use the 0,5 for base coating and varnishing.

 

Sadly buying a cheapy airbrush means you run the risk of having to spend longer than necessary stripping and cleaning. Your compressor looks fine, but I'd always recommend buying an entry level named brand airbrush. Practise makes perfect regardless. Remember never to pull the needle out backwards as you'll drag paint where you don't want it inside!

 

Perhaps make a stencil for the symbols so you can airbrush the outline and then freehand the details.

[Lorenzen]

You can buy airbrush cleaning tools and the such online (little brushes & reemers), when you are deep cleaning it hold the peices up to the light & check them through, may help you find the source of the jam.. It sucks when stuff plays up and can be quite disheartening but hopefully we can get to the bottom of your problem.

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

Alright, after a few days of pondering your problems and re-reading some of the things that are bothering you, I've thought of a few things that you may be doing wrong somewhat;

 

You mention your needle being dirty 'end to end', I assume you mean the whole needle is covered with paint, only thing I can think of here is that you are pointing the airbrush up, which you shouldn't do, as your paint will be running all the way up the inside it. Keep it horizontal or pointing down slightly.

 

When spraying, are you shooting a single shot of air (just air, away from your model) then starting to spray both air and paint, then when finished with that part of painting, doing another single blast of air? (again, away from your model) this helps keep the tip the needle free of paint between sprays, so you don't get any left to dry on it.

 

And one last thing, how long is the duration of each of your sprays? They should only be 1-2 seconds at most, as far as I know, with the little blasts of air between each one (see above)

 

Hope this helps a bit. :)