An onslaught of questions- Mostly about a finnicky airbrush

[Firepower]

I'll keep that all in mind next time I pick up the evil thing.  I've been spending the last several days working on trimming the bits for about 17 or 18 Marines to bulk paint with it.

 

One thing I have discovered which I find real disheartening- Vallejo primer peels off very, very easily.  I use up much less paint than I do with a GW spray can, and I can much more easily get into all the nooks and crannies, but you really have to work to get GW Black to peel off of plastics.  Even under a gloss coat and satin coat Liquitex varnish, a quick graze of my fingernail peels this stuff right off.  I tried spraying down a model in GW matte varnish last night, and I'm hoping it is less vulnerable when I go pick it up in a couple of hours.

 

Thanks for all the help so far.  I hope I won't need more :P

[Marshal Traben]

Did you use Vallejo Surface Primer when priming? Instead of the Model Color paints, you could use Vallejo Model Air paints. http://www.acrylicosvallejo.com/en_US/model-air/family/17

[Firepower]

Vallejo acrylic-polyurethane surface primer, gray. It's very easily scratched, and once there is a scratch a simple light rub will peel it off in ribbons :(

[Marshal Traben]

That's weird, it should be very hard to scratch it. The primer  does not need any thinning, you can just pour it into the airbrush from the bottle. 

[Firepower]

I've googled this issue and apparently a lot of folks have the same problem. I heard a couple of solutions but none of them good, and a few of which I already tried- long curing time, not thinning prior to spraying, washing the model pre-priming

Gloss Varnish helps a bit. The problem though is that if there is a scratch of any size, it's guaranteed to get much bigger as it will peel away in ribbons with hardly any effort. On metal models it is just hopeless.

I think I will need to go back to spray can primers, which will cost a lot more and severely slow down my work

[Marshal Traben]

If you don't mind me asking, what psi were you using when priming? The size of the needle also matters.

[Firepower]

I don't see anything of use there It's simply another 'Works fine for me' review.

He points out that his fingertip doesn't rub it off, but the issue I have is that a slight graze of the nail causes easy scratches, and subsequent rubbing peels it clean off from there.

I seem to be adept at coming up with problems that either haven't been heard of or can't be diagnosed

[Marshal Traben]

What psi were you using?

[Firepower]

I've done it at 20, 30, and 40. Same results across the board.

 

Related note- the GW matte varnish spray didn't help the metal model I used it on. I have a plastic test model that has already been gloss coated, and just applied the GW matte. If I give it a scratch test in a few hours and those two together can't supply a plastic model with solid protection, then I'm done with this primer.

[Marshal Traben]

Have you tried using a larger needle?

[Firepower]

Not as yet, though I have to ask what possible difference that will make.

[Marshal Traben]

I just read about it from dakkadakka, and possibly with the larger needle there should less clogging. And after searching the net,i found that putting 2 or 3 layers of the primer  should help.

[Firepower]

That doesn't make much sense at a glance. The problem with peeling is that the primer is not adhering well to the model. Spraying a second coat of primer on shouldn't help with that, as it will be adhering instead to the first layer of primer, not the model itself.

I moved up to a .3 needle and it clogged the instant I put it in the brush, but I haven't given it another try since then. I'm still in the process of shaving down a whole ton of bits before beginning the assembly line.

But I need to make sure the first step of teh whole thing isn't flawed before I start spraying

[Marshal Traben]

Did you do the steps correctly before priming?

[Firepower]

Wash model (and unwashed too), shake bottle like mad, don't thin (and tried thinning too), spray at 20cm (roughly 8 inches) away.  Yup across the board.

[Marshal Traben]

There seems to be a few possible solutions to this problem. 1. 0.35 mm needle 2. 25-30 psi or higher.

[Firepower]

Already done both, as said a few posts up. :(

[Marshal Traben]

And they didn't help at all?

[Firepower]

Not that I could see.  It all still peels off without a fight.

[Firepower]

New issue...yes, another one.

 

I was just trying to brush again.  I poured in very well shaken Primer, instant clog.  I hurried to clean in out, and eventually it unclogged.  When I was testing it with water after a thorough cleaning, the spray was coming out at an incorrect angle.  The spray wouldn't come out in a perfect cone, and rotating the needle inside the gun would variably stop the spray entirely or go back to an incomplete cone.  

 

By incomplete, I mean one side comes out at a nearly straight angle from the nozzle, while the rest of the cone makes for the proper angle.  Think of a 7 rather than a > .

 

This was actually happening from the moment I put in the .3 needle, its needle guide and its nozzle (which were all clean and unused prior to that).  So, the hardware issues are either in the nozzle, the needle cap, or the needle is bent.  Given the description of the problem, I don't suppose you all can tell me which is the culprit with certainty?

 

Or, and this would really tick me off, there is something in the working parts of the airbrush behind that which are not functioning properly (however unlikely that may be).

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

Sounds like a bent or slightly damaged needle tip there dude. Take it out and hold it up the the light, should be rather apparent if it is bent if you roll the needle betwwen your fingers while looking at it. Also check that the nozzle hasn't been dented or bent and that it is clean inside too. (Again, hold that up to the light and you should be able to see the light through the centre, even though its very small)

[Anvilarium]

Sounds like a bent or slightly damaged needle tip there dude. Take it out and hold it up the the light, should be rather apparent if it is bent if you roll the needle betwwen your fingers while looking at it. Also check that the nozzle hasn't been dented or bent and that it is clean inside too. (Again, hold that up to the light and you should be able to see the light through the centre, even though its very small)

 

I agree with S.k.i.t.t.l.e, soulds like you have a bent needle. The needle tips are insanely easy to bend, I trat mine like they are made out of gold dust!

 

As for your issues with paint, what is the temperature/humidity level like in your painting area? If the area is too humid, or too hot/cold, it can have a very detrimental effect on any kind of spray paint.

[Firepower]

As I understand it, humidity and temperature issues are supposed to be relatively meaningless with airbrushing, as opposed to spray paint.

When I switched to the .5 needle after the seemingly bent .3, the thing couldn't even blow air out the tip. Totally unused needle, needle cap and nozzle, no clogs or anything, it just fit together so poorly that it couldn't work.

So, at this point rather 'perturbed,' I called the distributor and asked what was up. He said it was odd and that model never gets complaints, but has sent a replacement with no more questions asked.

After looking into it more, the Master series is, according to many I've talked to, just a Chinese knock off of Iwata models, which could explain the hardware issues. I don't doubt for a minute that some of the failings are a result of my inexperience, but some issues (like the .5 needle one I just mentioned) are fairly obvious failures of the brush itself.

If this one fails as well, I will just get my money back and buy a Neo instead. They're the same price here and the Neo is made by a much more recognized manufacturer .

Still no luck on the Vallejo Primer. I looked around and asked some folks for advice. One interesting new theory was that the bottle had at one time been frozen, and that made it too thick. So I go to his store to see what it should look like...and it was exactly the same . If this peeling issue is something I can't resolve, I'm just gonna have to go back to using spray cans for priming.

That will suck, but not as much as having my models peel like onions.

[S.k.i.t.t.l.e]

Be aware that the Neo is made for Iwata, not by Iwata....

 

https://sites.google.com/site/donsairbrushtips/neo-for-iwata

 

I considered one, but once my cheapo one breaks/crimbo comes along, I'll prob be going for a Badger, perhaps the Patriot. :) Don't know why, but the 'made for' instead of 'made by' put me off a little.

[Firepower]

Well that is something to be aware of for sure.  Reading that review, its that damn o-ring under the nozzle cap that I've been looking at funny on the one I'm using now.  But there seem to be more than that single problem to worry about, based on how it was acting with the final needle experiment.

 

I too would love a Badger, simply because no one ever has anything mean to say about them, and all the big name painters rave about them.  But, I has me a budget to follow :(