War Angel Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 with a recent frustration on my part for realizing that i put no consideration into how i would be using these squads together before i modeled them. so what im trying to do is pair up CCW's to give them the best bang for youre buck when you have either A. a squad that is being accompanyed by a character or B. when two squads (or combat squads) are opperating in the same area and end up in combat together. what i mean by best "Bang for the buck" is, when these two characters (both able to take challenges) are in combat together, they compliment each other in that should one of them not be able to take on a challenge, the other can easily take that challenge and allow his partner to take out the small fry's. im not sure if many others would even consider this worth their time, but i feel that there is something useful to learn from this. does anyone else think this is worth it and is willing to contribute? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Father Ferrum Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Power fist or thunder hammer on one, and relic blade or lightning claw on the other. Or, to make it cheaper, swap the fist for a power axe. Then you've got both AP3 and AP2 covered, and all weapon choices have an advantage in wounding MEQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disruptor_fe404 Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 I like the powerfist and lightning claw combination on a character with good WS and I. But it sounds like you're meaning a Sergeant or a 1W-type character, in which case I like spear-axe or sword-axe, depending on the unit's mobility. Admittedly, both of these are with a single multi-purpose character in mind, but I can see two of them complementing each other. EDIT: Also, Captain Idaho has a similar (in concept, not execution) thread going here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Are we referring to a pair of Veteran Sergeants with a single power weapon each who complement each other? What squads are they in? I presume those intended for close action like a Sternguard and Tactical squad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giga Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Same question, what squads are we talking about here? Tacticals? If so, don't give them any power weapons, it's a waste of points because your sergeants will either get singled out in challenges and murdered by real combat units, or they'll be using their power weapons to kill guardsmen, cultists, etc. which is overkill. Best course of action is not to let your tacticals get into combat with non-GEQ/tau at all. On characters such as captains and chapter masters, your best bet is either lightning claw+power fist, or relic blade+storm shield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Angel Posted March 8, 2013 Author Share Posted March 8, 2013 I was thinking two veteran sgts working together, or a vet sgt with a character attached like Cassius. I'm really not focusing on which squads it is, just that its two different vets "character"s Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 Totally agree Tactical squads suck in assault. You can either beat your opponents with the benefits of a power weapon, or you'll lose to superior opposition. Occasionally they'll come up against opposing Tactical squads or equivalent but they should be shooting you anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Angel Posted March 8, 2013 Author Share Posted March 8, 2013 I think there is a time and a place for tactical squads to assault, sternguard too. My last game saw my tactical sgt with combi plas and a power fist getting ran down by his captain with PP and a power axe. The two ended up in combat and my lowly sgt killed his captain (and died at the same time, but his gene seed was recovered for the chapter.) There are times were combat is inevitable, and though I lost that squad in the end, by killing his captain I held that squad up until I had the rest of my units free from other duties to gun them down revenge style. With out that power fist I would have lost my squad the next turn and that could have affected the rest of the game. I'm not going to put CCW on every sgt I have, and that's not even the point in this. I'm kind of working towards what Idaho has, except one weapon per person, not two on one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 I often have put a power fist on a Sergeant in a Drop pod Tactical squad so I appreciate the options it gives you. Not that I ever get much luck with it though. I think I've netted like 2 kills since 4th edition with it! Hence why I usually run it without! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkGuard Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 The time and place for Tacticals and Sternguard to assault are against units they can easily kill in combat. In those circumstances they can easily kill the enemy without paying more points for a power weapon. Against those units that you don't want assaulting you, it won't help much. So same as 5th, invest in combis or nothing at all. However, the odd power sword may have some merit if you're worried about power fists etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Angel Posted March 8, 2013 Author Share Posted March 8, 2013 Is the odd power fist still good? The part I'm having difficulty with is I'm a gamer and a modeler, so sgts with CCW look really awesome, but stink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 You can mitigate challenges by keeping the Sergeant in the back, out of engagement distance. However the biggest weakness of a power fist is the lack of attacks at WS4. It's very easy to miss those attacks. Basically since we lost the extra attack unless we have 2 Specialist weapons I've struggled to find my Sergeants warranting the points investment for a power fist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkGuard Posted March 8, 2013 Share Posted March 8, 2013 In my mind, Sergeants haven't wanted power fists since 5th. If you want an AP2 weapon on them, pick the power axe, for more attacks, and cheaper cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
War Angel Posted March 9, 2013 Author Share Posted March 9, 2013 Alright, I've been giving all of my sgts combi's (after you discused it with me months and months ago) so I'm making a duel flamer squad w/ a ML, maybe a plasma cannon, not sure yet. So I can't give him a power axe because I still don't get the extra attack... Now what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted March 9, 2013 Share Posted March 9, 2013 Now nothing - you've upgraded your Tactical squads enough! People often feel obliged to upgrade their squads because they can, but I often find myself not bothering. I'm planning on building a bunchoof Sergeants with combi weapons since they're the best value investment but right now I stick to stock weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortysl Posted March 9, 2013 Share Posted March 9, 2013 Same sentiment as Captain Idaho; my Tactical Sergeants have gone from Veterans with Power Weapons in 5th, to regular Sergeants with Combi-Plasmas in 6th, saving me 15 points per squad. The fact that their squads are standing next to a Standard of Devastation had nothing to do with that decision....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rover Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 I found this combo quite effective. Deathwing Terminator Squad TH+SS Terminator Sergant TH+SS Terminator SB+PF Terminator SB+PF Terminator AC+PF Terminator SoS+SB Belial Force Staff TDA Librarian TH+SS Sergant accept difficult or uncomfortable challanges. As all other Termies with PFs strike at I1 Belial and Librarian are there to cut a bit of horde before they strike. Belial has quite nice MEQ killing potential as well. I don't use Power Weapons in Tactical Squads as they shouldn't really engage in CC. If they assault it means they are fighting some fragile units which don't require any power weapons to kill. One exception are my bike squads where I assault from time to time and it's cool to cut some MEQ stuff with PS. When I have a lot of points to spare (which is not often) I field PF Ravenwing Sergant along with some Meltagun dudes but his main role is to bash vehicles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YAK Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 I'm amazed at how down on tac squads you all are... i find mine perform to expectations... i just have low expectations... that said i'll charge with them or... now with over watch rapid fire and take the charge so i can get a few extra shots in. as mentioned above if you need to tie up a squad and the only thing in the area is a tac squad you'll be happy you have a power weapon. now to the op's question... i'd say one sargent with power fist combi flamer in the squad you want to take the charge(say your tac squad) and a sword or lance on the sarg or the squad that is gonna save them(say an assault squad sarg.) one squad is set to take the chage the other to save them then move on while first squad consolodates the position or provides cover.... sorry if this is horribly spelt or kinda ramble-y.. iin rush break almost over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giga Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 Well dunno about others, but I'm not down on tacticals. I feel they perform really well in 6th edition as a durable, versatile shooty troop choice. However, they suck balls in assault and you know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giga Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 I found this combo quite effective. Deathwing Terminator Squad TH+SS Terminator Sergant TH+SS Terminator SB+PF Terminator SB+PF Terminator AC+PF Terminator SoS+SB Belial Force Staff TDA Librarian There's what, ~700 points in that unit? Looks like a really fragile deathstar to me, what with AP2 everywhere nowadays. How do you deliver them? Deep strike? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YAK Posted March 12, 2013 Share Posted March 12, 2013 YEAH .....they suck at winning assaults anyway lol. i find i can usually count on an operational sized(read 6-9) tac squad to take most opponents two rounds of assault to kill... so if i don't want an enemy unit (particularily sleneshi bikers... i hate them!!!!) moving in my opponents turn i assault them. then if i'm not all dead in enemys assault i combat tactics outta there and continue with gratuitous application of bolt rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rover Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I found this combo quite effective. Deathwing Terminator Squad TH+SS Terminator Sergant TH+SS Terminator SB+PF Terminator SB+PF Terminator AC+PF Terminator SoS+SB Belial Force Staff TDA Librarian There's what, ~700 points in that unit? Looks like a really fragile deathstar to me, what with AP2 everywhere nowadays. How do you deliver them? Deep strike? It's 575 points with 10 wounds, 10x2+saves, 2x3++ and 3x4++. They are not that fragile to be honest. They land via Deathwing Assault along with two other squads of Terminators. All their weapons are basically twin-linked over the course of the game because of Vengeful Strike rules and the fact that Librarian can buff them. They usually land 1" from the most dangerous enemy unit. Librarian rolls 2nd spell from Pyromancy vs hordes and from Telephaty vs MEQ. The whole army is supported with some long rande shooting and Melta bikes. Because 3/4 of my army is within 6" of enemy deployment zone this unit is not always the 1st to shoot at. In my local meta only IG spams a lot of plasmas but they burn themselves more often the me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Giga Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Ah, if plasma/ap2 in general isn't very popular in your meta, then I can see this being pretty good. I myself like to run plenty of plasma/melta + vindicators, and lots other people in my meta have similar stuff in their lists, so you can imagine why 575 points of bunched-up models aren't exactly the most survivable squad in the table in my local tournaments. :S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haranin Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 With vindis on the table you get infravision and telepathy. Anything you cannot turn on the enemy, you blow up while they can't see you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rover Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Ah, if plasma/ap2 in general isn't very popular in your meta, then I can see this being pretty good. I myself like to run plenty of plasma/melta + vindicators, and lots other people in my meta have similar stuff in their lists, so you can imagine why 575 points of bunched-up models aren't exactly the most survivable squad in the table in my local tournaments. :S I usually play with 12 different people and across all the lists there is one Vindi and one Mawlock. There is a bunch of Plasmaguns in IG and well... I usually field 4xPC Devastators I plan to field a similar squad in upcoming local tournament as I'm curious how it will handle all those plasma spamming dudes bu I guess that playing Deathwing in an AP2 heavy environment is rather pointless unless it's mechanized and packed in two or three Land Raiders. On the other hand scouting melta bikers and Termies DSing in right spots can be devastating for all kind of AP2 stuff. Mawlocks are the biggest issue with Deathwing Assault to be honest. Anyway, this Power Weapon combo works for me quite well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.