How would you deal with . . .

[eyeslikethunder]

I find my runepriests good additions to my gh in cc they add a 2+ save which works well with the wolf standard as I can reroll any fails. Meaning they can massively reduce the wounds the unit takes.

They can LOS any ap2 attacks

The wolf guard can take any challenges

Prescience increases the units effectivesness in cc. So not wasting his psychic powers Mine has killed a few chaos lords and princes the art is to make sure you out of range when he attacks if has weapon that can hurt you then move in your I with your reroll misses wound on a 2 Instant death

Force weapons are very effective vs new lists as they lack enternal warrior

[Ozeryk_Sleipnijr]

but the demon has Initiative & WS ... 8 or 9 . the RP has problems when the demon brings a Blade of Murder.

[Russ Brother 92]

but the demon has Initiative & WS ... 8 or 9 . the RP has problems when the demon brings a Blade of Murder.

 

Or the Axe of Blind Fury - -1I for the Prince (so what he's still striking first), S+2 and AP2... your RP is beyond dead as he'll be causing ID due to being both Monstrous Creature AND S8+

 

I wouldn't suggest sending your RP up against a Prince... pretty much ever unless you know he's hitting at I1 as then you have a chance.

[Thunderhawk3015]

Soak the Demon Prince with a pack leader, have him eat it, bubble wrap your rune priest with your squad so they eat wounds in round 2 so your Rune Priest gets to hammertime the Demon.  Can only have one challange per close combat if memory serves so you lost points, but you get his Prince. 

[thor1234]

If you want to take a Deamon Prince in combat with a Rune Priest then go for a unit of Grey hunters as suggested, take the compulsory banner, plasma, melta or what ever your preffered weapon load out, have the rune priest take saga of the Beastslayer, and put the squad somewhere NEAR said prince who is to die..... but put them in some cover even if its just a crater, shoot the unholy snot from the beastie with your little Bolters and Plasma and what not..... then let charge YOU! assaulting into cover drops his initiative to 1, then accept that little challange with your priset and get 3 (4 if you counter) attacks (hitting on 3's if you buy a neckalce) with re-rolls to hit, the banner essentially negates the rols of a 1 to wound almost gauranteeing maximum damage, he fails but a single save and BAM! your rune weapon activates and blasts him back to the warp! the Helldrake is a little trickier, if you dont field at least a defence line with either a quad gun or lascannon you're fighting an uphill battle as it is.. either spam heavy weapon long fangs or again take a priest with divination and re-roll hits, ive had some luck fielding 4 ML long fangs on a defence line with a rune priest (with chooser) cast prescience and the rockets can engage the Defiler with re-rolls while the Priest splits fire and uses the Icarus lascannon (with re-rolls again) not many fliers can survive a BS5 twin-linked Lascannon!

 

hope my essay helps brother!

[Grimtooth]

DP with wings is easy peasy if you your rune priest is up to task.

 

Tempest Wrath up at all times. DP with wings needs to change flight mode from Swooping to Glide at the begining of his turn if he plans on assaulting that turn. In doing so he becomes Jump and thus affected by Tempest Wrath and must take a Dangerous Terrain Test which per the rules lowers his initiative to 1. Challenge away with your rune priest that if he has the righ saga , will be rerolling hits and wounding on a 2+ with a force weapon. Poof goes the DP with wings.

[Dam13n]

How, exactly, is the DP going to be capable of putting all his attacks into the Rune Priest? Unless he gets a precision strike, you get to allocate any wounds to any of your models in base to base. Unless of course you're referring to the two of them being in a challenge.

 

The way I see it, when you charge in/get charged you want the rune priest at the back of the unit, that way he's unlikely to be engaged (base to base) at the start of combat, therefore he cannot accept a challenge. So long as you have no characters in base to base at the start of the combat, there will be no challenge. The DP will attack at I8 (so before you pile in) so he can't even direct his precision strikes at your rune priest. You then pile in at I4 (or I1 if you gave him an axe) then (hope to) pound his face in with the runic weapon.

 

It does require careful positioning of models, and careful judging of distances, but it is possible.

 

The other option is to tempt himinto charging your models when they're in cover, so he'll be reduced to I1 and therefore easier prey.

 

Of course if he's a sensible chaos general he should be giving that Flying DP a Burning Brand, at which point he pretty much becomes another Heldrake, and he can happily fly over you, swoop attack, then hit you with an AP3 torrent weapon from precisely the angle that'll lead to your best models in the unit (banner, motw, special weapons) having to take the wounds (by virtue of being closest).

 

Personally, my 2000pt list includes (as allies) - Crowe, 10 Purifiers with 4 Psycannons and a Storm Raven. This gives me some anti-daemon potential. Add in the 3 units of ML Long Fangs and an ADL w Icarus plus a TDA Rune Priest and I would hope to have a chance. But then again, the DP-Drake list for chaos is almost designed to kill Space Wolf armies, as we have no real counter to it unless we take allies.

[Grimtooth]

Kinda pitiful to see some people suggest things along the line of, "Just throw enough dispensable bodies his way until you can pile in the rune priest".

 

Set the conditions of the batttle on your terms! As I said, Tempest Wrath bubble wraps you with a 24" bubble that at some point when that FMC goes from Swooping to Gliding, he starts to hate life as a Jump MC, especially when your opponent assaults you, challenges your rune priest, and then finds out his I8 is now I1.

 

Reminds me of 5th edition when so many just considered Wolf Scouts use of OBEL as a valid excuse to suicide a unit.

[Dam13n]

Personally I see it like a wolf pack... Use the pack to pin your prey in place, then the leader comes in for the kill. After all, would any self-respecting wolf give away a tactical advantage if it were there for the taking?

 

6th edition really does reward good model placement and a tactical approach to the game, so that's what I'm advocating. If you want to play to a different style, then that's up to you.

 

I was just offering a tactical suggestion. No real need for the "pitiful" comment.

 

Edit: FYI - the DP may be a jump monstrous creature when gliding but he can move and charge as infantry if he so chooses, thus negating tempests wrath entirely.

[Ozeryk_Sleipnijr]

Thank you Brothers I have learnt some important stuff from all of you . I knew there was something wrong in the last game when he went first. I will now go back and reread the challenge rules, and the assault on difficult terrain. And then will play this guy again. Now I will include droppods with plasma termies. I apologize for getting some of the english terminology wrong.

 

Nothing like losing a game and then learning.

[Wulfebane]

Its not very tactical to sacrifice men needlessly.

[Dam13n]

Losing a couple of grey hunters to in turn have a good chance of killing a daemon prince (that's likely the enemy warlord) is hardly a needless sacrifice.

 

It falls more under 'acceptable losses' than needless sacrifice.

[d@n]

 murderous hurricane will also make the demon princeses I1 so taking  mh and tw as your powers is probably a pretty good idea and then tool the rune priest up for demon prince hunting.

[Dam13n]

d@n - the problem there is that murderous hurricane hits automatically, this means that it cannot target flyers (including flying monstrous creatures) as only attacks that can snap-shot can hit zooming/swooping flyers. The Daemon Prince will therefore only be targettable in the turns that it's gliding, which is the turn it charges you, thus giving you no chance to get murderous hurricane off first.

[Ozeryk_Sleipnijr]

Based upon your advice and my material possibilities I have edited the rough list I am taking to the tournament. I will be taking 2 Prophecy Runepriests and 5 X Plasma spammed WGTA in a Droppod. This should prevent a gunline opponent from sitting back and blowing my Rout apart & will male Helldrake flyers alittle more nervous, The Demon could come but they are banned from the Tournament. My mate who i am practicing with, is not taking part and he loves his Nurgle Demon. Now that I have reread the rules about c.c and challenges he will get a big fright & discover that RP are demon killers & that the Rout fights like a pack.

[Shuggnuggath]

Deamon Princes don't have the 'Champion of Chaos' rule, so the don't have to challenge.

 

If I was the Chaos player I would just helldrake and obliterate the rune priests squad into charcoal.

[Ozeryk_Sleipnijr]

 

Deamon Princes don't have the 'Champion of Chaos' rule, so the don't have to challenge.

 

If I was the Chaos player I would just helldrake and obliterate the rune priests squad into charcoal.

 

 

That`s very interesting, I will leave the chaos player to his illusions.

If I was the wolves I would droppod Terminator plasmaspam his Oblits and prescience the LF to kill the Helldrake with rerolls. ;-)

[DanPesci]

Heres some ideas....

 

Against obliterators

 

Long Fangs - Having that lascannon in each pack as you have should help deal with pesky obliterators, as it negates their 2+ save, and instakills them as its double their toughness.

 

Similarly - Grey hunter pack in a drop pod with two melta guns. Combination of the 2 melta shots (again instakill and no save for obliterators ) and 16 bolter rounds should clear out them pesky oblits.

 

Against chaos flyer with flame template thing

Ive not actually come up against this yet. However, a lone wolf on an aegis line with quad gun or quad las seems a good idea. The flyer can only wound him once per turn, and as he has 2 wounds and eternal warrior, he's more than likely gonna get to shoot back. Keep a rune priest nearby giving him divination to reroll misses.

 

TDA WGPL - if you manage to get them out front of thepack compared to where the flyer is sitting, they can take lots of 2+ saves (hopefully!). However with the manouverability of the flyers this may not be possible, however, your hopefully still gonna get to a point whereby those wounds hit your 2+ save and he can soak them up.

 

Target Priority

 

Focus on the obliterators before tackling the troop choices, as theyre gonna do the most hurt long term if left on the board.

 

Drop Pod Tactics

 

If using pods, try get at least 3 or 5 in there. Odd numbers are key, as this then lets you bring down 2 or 3 on the first turn, which can be hugely helpful for instantly dealing with small elite units such as obliterators. (also the more stuff in pods..the less those oblits have to shoot at on turn 1, if they get first turn)

[d@n]

d@n - the problem there is that murderous hurricane hits automatically, this means that it cannot target flyers (including flying monstrous creatures) as only attacks that can snap-shot can hit zooming/swooping flyers. The Daemon Prince will therefore only be targettable in the turns that it's gliding, which is the turn it charges you, thus giving you no chance to get murderous hurricane off first.

yes but when he's not flying, he's not a flyer so mh could be good as a back up.

[Shuggnuggath]

The best way to kill a Daemon Prince is with a large volume of regular bolter fire.

 

The obliterators will have the Mark of Nurgle so they will be toughness 5 needing str 10 to instakill them.

[d@n]

its getting the chance to shoot them thats the problem shuggnuggath

[playedsincedaemonhunters]

The answer to ALL enemy forces is Bolters.... the holy tool of the emprah, terminator threat? more Bolters. Hell chicken? rear armor bolters. armor 14 vehicles? ally with necrons then bolter it.

[Ozeryk_Sleipnijr]

Well Brothers the advice I gleaned from this discussion helped me achieve the following: The head of a demon prince held up high by the WGTA with WC & PF. Thanks to the 4+ save from the psychic power (Vorahnung in German)

The Helldrake flying and hiding after suffering 2 HP and being immobilized by LF rocket launchers wit the assistance of a Rune Priest.

I fought the army to a bloody draw only because of a couple of misconceptions: Plague marines (I thought they were normal CSM) cannot take objectives. Had I known this from the start he would have lost the game.

I have 2 Questions: If you have 2 RP both using Prophecy at lvl 1 how do you generate the powers. Is it: Dice for 2 powers each but only use one of them in a turn?

If you only have 1 Drop Pod can it land in your first turn?

 

[Marshall Bretton]

with 1 drop pod yes it automatically arrives first turn, with the power if i recall correctly yes you generate 2 and each can use 1 per turn (i assume they were both lvl 1)

not sure about the randomly generating though, isn't there something about they can't have duplicate powers?

 

thinking about the plague marines are there not 2 types? normal chaos marines with mark of nurgle and proper plague marines? im not overly sure on that one but i know i have fought against nurgle based armies that used "plague marines" as troops

 

 

oh and awesome work on claiming the head of the prince, that will make a nice trophy for the wall of the great hall :p

[Dam13n]

Each rune priest exchanges their standard 2 wolf powers for 2 rolls on the BRB power tables.

 

Each is separate so you could end up with both priests having forewarning and foreboding for example, if that's what you rolled. Of course the primaris power - prescience is worth having on both because the re-rolls to hit on everything for a full game turn is almost too good to pass up.

 

If he had a Nurgle chaos lord then plague marines are troops, so scoring, otherwise they're elites and non-scoring. As has already been noted - standard chaos marines with the mark of Nurgle are always troops. So it depends what they actually were and whether he had a Nurgle lord in addition to the daemon prince.