Ratboy1664 Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Origional HH fluff had Corax sitting in the Ravenspire for a year and then nipping off to the EoT a la Russ and the Khârn never to be seen again. I think this is pretty bland and boring so I propose a new ending for Corax: He commits suicide. Why? Because he is a tragic figure. Decieved and nearly destroyed by his brothers at Isstvan, he then starts altering his Legion's gene-seed with catastrophic results. With only a few marines he is powerless to help his father who winds up virtually dead. He feels guilt and self loathing for being decieved twice and after a year's meditation commits suicide as his atonement to his father. What do you think? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMarko Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Nice, and he would be the second primarch with somewhat realistic death...+1 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330344 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billuriye Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Khârn? You mean Khan who disappeared in the webway? Anyway, comitting suicide is too emo even for Corax. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330349 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Eremon Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Magnus' death at the hands of Leman Russ as a gesture of true penitence would be the only acceptable form of suicide. If they have any Primarch just simply kill themselves, I will rage. Corax is supposed to have a conflicted soul, but suicide would be going way too far. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330546 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 frankly I think it's pathetic, and would lose all respect for Corax if that happened. WLK Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330617 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WatchCaptainAzrael Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 His suicide would only be in-character if it involved charging headlong into the biggest, nastiest bunch of xenos and heretics at hand and going down in a storm of penitent ultra-violence. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330627 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaosLord Leon Enaek Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 Whilst Corax is haunted by the knowledge that he has failed, ruined his Legion and watched helplessly from the sidelines as his father and the Imperium have been casually ripped asunder, my impression of him from Deliverance Lost is that he is aware of how truly unique and potent the Primarch are: he knows better than most the artistry and time that went into them and I don't believe that in the face if such losses to the Imperium he would squander his life like that, knowing what it was worth and that there are only 14 Primarch left at that point. Instead I see his 'Nevermore' quest as similar to a Dwarf Slayer - he craves atonement through death and yet he can't end his life without good cause, so he strides voiceless and alone into the the Eye of Terror with the plan to kill every Traitor there until he is redeemed or he is absolved - victory or death at the hands of a daemonspawn. Emo, but still befitting the gene-labs of the Emperor. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330633 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snickers Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I like the idea of Corax commiting suicide. I hate the overuse of "lost in the warp". Corax has one of the most tragic stories of the heresy and I feel it would fit with his darker character better if he took his own life. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330642 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Augustus Posted March 18, 2013 Share Posted March 18, 2013 I like the idea. Definitely within is character. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330652 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratboy1664 Posted March 18, 2013 Author Share Posted March 18, 2013 quick follow up question: IF he did commit suicide what would happen to his soul? The HH books are confusing (to me) as to what energy/soul/whatever goes where. Could he decide to use his Primarch's soul to try and save the big E from his neverending death on the golden throne, or would it draw too much attention from the chaos gods and be used by them? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330655 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMarko Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 ^food for the void predators: (wink,nod) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330663 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WatchCaptainAzrael Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Erm, guys.. Corax comes from a guerrilla fighter background. Mere humans of such backgrounds just don't give up when things go horribly wrong if their beliefs are ingrained deeply enough, and his were practically written into his genes. A Primarch essentially giving up by taking his own life, especially after being so accustomed to enacting ugly necessities would be simply inaccurate with what a guerrilla fighter is. Worse of all, it would be a dereliction of his duties to the Imperium in its weakened state to refuse lending it his abilities. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3330870 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratboy1664 Posted March 19, 2013 Author Share Posted March 19, 2013 Or you could say that guerilla fighters, operating on their own with little operational support or supervision are under the most mental stress and so are in fact the most likely to crack mentally. Even belief in the cause does not prevent soldiers from ending their own lives in suicide. In fact during WW2 the Japanese relied on an individuals fanatasism to the cause to persuade them to undertake kamikaze missions, and before that the Samurai had a martial code of ritual suicide following failure. In fact Corax is the most likely Primarch to commit suicide. Plus I fail to see how sitting in your room for a year and then disappearing into the EoT is not a dereliction of his duties to the Imperium. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331028 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Captain Lucian Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 If he committed suacide, after being through all that... I would pretend that the fluff for that never existed, just like Draigo. If he has to die, make it against another of his traitor Brothers, Kurze would be a good pick for that. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331077 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Varas Mortez Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Magnus didn't die at the hand's of Russ, his body is broken, but he still fought to protect his sons, for no matter how much he didnt want to fight his father's forces, he was not able to just give up, so suicide for any of the primarch's (with the exception of Kurze who hates himself) is just not a reality. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331084 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirAstartes Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 If IIRC the lore was changed from Corax messing with the geneseed and making monsters to the Alpha Legion swapping it out for a corrupted one, at the end of DL Corax simply stated that they will have to take the long way to build his legion. Only a small number of recruits were affected by the corrupted gene seed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331098 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Durfast Spiritwolf Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Doesn't fit my reading of Corax's character either, but each to his own :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331163 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 frankly I think it's pathetic, and would lose all respect for Corax if that happened. WLK Corax pretty much commited sucicide by going in the Eye of Terror after throwing a "Never more". His goal was to end it once and for all, clearly. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331169 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zynk Kaladin Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Yo Corax, I'm really happy for you, Imma let you finish but Conrad had one of the best suicides of all time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331177 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Corax pretty much commited sucicide by going in the Eye of Terror after throwing a "Never more". His goal was to end it once and for all, clearly. Now, how we're going to get from the Reasonable Corax we saw at the end of Deliverance Lost to death seeking whackadoodle post Heresy is up in the air. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331186 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 BL can do everything. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331189 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratboy1664 Posted March 19, 2013 Author Share Posted March 19, 2013 Magnus didn't die at the hand's of Russ, his body is broken, but he still fought to protect his sons, for no matter how much he didnt want to fight his father's forces, he was not able to just give up, so suicide for any of the primarch's (with the exception of Kurze who hates himself) is just not a reality. How can you say this? Each brother is an individual otherwise by this stupid logic the heresy would never have happened as Dorn won't turn so it is just not a reality. Corax pretty much commited sucicide by going in the Eye of Terror after throwing a "Never more". His goal was to end it once and for all, clearly. Now, how we're going to get from the Reasonable Corax we saw at the end of Deliverance Lost to death seeking whackadoodle post Heresy is up in the air. Failure to save his father Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331190 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 BL can do everything. They can, true, but should they? SHOULD THEY? Jumping rails: I personally find it hard to believe Corax would take the blame for the Emperor's death the way Dorn did, given that the Praetorian fortified Terra and commanded at the Siege, so what he did/didn't do had a direct bearing on Emps winding up stuck on the Golden Throne, whereas the Raven was stuck on the other side of the galaxy for the whole thing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331198 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vesper Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 BL can do everything. They can, true, but should they? SHOULD THEY? Jumping rails: I personally find it hard to believe Corax would take the blame for the Emperor's death the way Dorn did, given that the Praetorian fortified Terra and commanded at the Siege, so what he did/didn't do had a direct bearing on Emps winding up stuck on the Golden Throne, whereas the Raven was stuck on the other side of the galaxy for the whole thing. The original fluff had Corax commiting suicide. If BL wants to retcon it, they will, even if it would suck balls. I call it the "Lucius treatment". Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331201 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WatchCaptainAzrael Posted March 19, 2013 Share Posted March 19, 2013 Or you could say that guerilla fighters, operating on their own with little operational support or supervision are under the most mental stress and so are in fact the most likely to crack mentally. Even belief in the cause does not prevent soldiers from ending their own lives in suicide. In fact during WW2 the Japanese relied on an individuals fanatasism to the cause to persuade them to undertake kamikaze missions, and before that the Samurai had a martial code of ritual suicide following failure. In fact Corax is the most likely Primarch to commit suicide. Plus I fail to see how sitting in your room for a year and then disappearing into the EoT is not a dereliction of his duties to the Imperium. The japanese were not Primarchs; their culture encouraged suicide as a form of atonement; a kamikaze mission performed to ensure the remainder of the army meets its objective differs in spades from taking too many sleeping pills; Corax is closer in mentality and MO to Ninja than Samurai, and the former did not commit seppuku nearly as often. Indeed, their greatest asset was ENDURING, which is the true meaning of the character 忍. Endurance against that which would destroy one in body and mind. There's a sea of difference between forced introspection leading to whatever mission Corax assigned himself and giving up altogether... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272932-the-end-of-corax/#findComment-3331236 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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