Hmm, if half the tau broadside rumors are true...

[Cmdr Shepard]

 

 

However, I can`t help thinking that Daemons will do quite ok against the Gundamns and their canibalistic Jarjarbinks allies.

Daemons? Their troop choices can be easily decimated by Tau ranged fire, a part from shrouded plague bearers (even though Tau will negate their cover with marklights), their FMC can be easily groundedm with skyfire broadsides  and killed with massed fire power by other unis; nearly every daemon is mostly a cc unit and when they decide to charge Tau gun line they'll suffer volleys of overwatch fire; not to mention I just read rumors about the ability of fire warriors to make a consolidate movement after overwatch so can place themselves outside charge range leaving those daemons in the open field; their vehicles are easy prey for Tau weapons.

 

Talking about FMCs: I don't think it's a good idea bringing a CSM Daemon Prince to a fight versus Tau. Once they ground it they can kill it with a single hammer head railgun shot. It only has a 5++ invul.

Aside from the overwatch volleys, Daemons have some decent options to take on Tau I think. Take alot of cheap and fast choices, Flesh hounds, daemonettes, seekers, etc and overwhelm them.

 

With all the rumors on Tau counter-charge defenses, charging Tau gun lines with models whit just a 5++ save would be very difficult. I even read about some sort of drone who reduce the charging distance by d3".

Beside Tau won't stay there waiting for the daemons to slaugther them in cc but they will unleash a torrent of fire I'm not sure daemons can withstand with great ease.

Anyway we shall see it on Saturday ;)

[minigun762]

I agree with the value of fast daemon assaulters. Daemon troops will be more of a second wave once they have tied them up in close combat.

 

Having innate inv saves helps ignore the importance of cover as well as Tau many low AP weapons.

[Brother Ambroz]

Still only rumors. And the Tau can't be invincible. With certain Daemon elements a Tau army would have one turn at best before being assaulted by daemons. And as minigun says, invuln saves will help negate much of the Tau low AP weapons.

[Smurfalypse]

However, I can`t help thinking that Daemons will do quite ok against the Gundamns and their canibalistic Jarjarbinks allies.

Daemons? Their troop choices can be easily decimated by Tau ranged fire, a part from shrouded plague bearers (even though Tau will negate their cover with marklights), their FMC can be easily groundedm with skyfire broadsides and killed with massed fire power by other unis; nearly every daemon is mostly a cc unit and when they decide to charge Tau gun line they'll suffer volleys of overwatch fire; not to mention I just read rumors about the ability of fire warriors to make a consolidate movement after overwatch so can place themselves outside charge range leaving those daemons in the open field; their vehicles are easy prey for Tau weapons.

Talking about FMCs: I don't think it's a good idea bringing a CSM Daemon Prince to a fight versus Tau. Once they ground it they can kill it with a single hammer head railgun shot. It only has a 5++ invul.

Aside from the overwatch volleys, Daemons have some decent options to take on Tau I think. Take alot of cheap and fast choices, Flesh hounds, daemonettes, seekers, etc and overwhelm them.

With all the rumors on Tau counter-charge defenses, charging Tau gun lines with models whit just a 5++ save would be very difficult. I even read about some sort of drone who reduce the charging distance by d3".

Beside Tau won't stay there waiting for the daemons to slaugther them in cc but they will unleash a torrent of fire I'm not sure daemons can withstand with great ease.

Anyway we shall see it on Saturday

Yes indeedy.

Daemons also have a slew of units that are very fast or outflank and everything can deepstrike. People are overreating to rumors and not thinking clearly (Like they did with DA).

@Jeske - Yes the DA Codex is good (so is CSM and Daemons), certainly not out of balance with 6th ed however as many on this very forum were raging about before it was released.

[Slayer le Boucher]

Seeing that Taus can be allied with CSM, i'm really thinking of converting Exo suits in some "Deamon" or Possesed Armors, with the Riptid beeing a Chaos Knight, finally having a use for one of those Dreamforge leviathan model.

[Smurfalypse]

Seeing that Taus can be allied with CSM, i'm really thinking of converting Exo suits in some "Deamon" or Possesed Armors, with the Riptid beeing a Chaos Knight, finally having a use for one of those Dreamforge leviathan model.

 

Brilliant!

[Warsmith Aznable]

Seeing that Taus can be allied with CSM, i'm really thinking of converting Exo suits in some "Deamon" or Possesed Armors, with the Riptid beeing a Chaos Knight, finally having a use for one of those Dreamforge leviathan model.

 

I've had Dark Mechanicus allies for my warband fluff forever now. The Tau are looking like maybe they're going to put Legio Nefandum on the table finally...

[Cmdr Shepard]

Daemons also have a slew of units that are very fast or outflank and everything can deepstrike. People are overreating to rumors and not thinking clearly (Like they did with DA).

But Tau can deploy the firepower able to wipe those unit out without many problems. Deep striking and outflanking daemons cannot charge the turn they arrive from reserve.

We'll discover it soon. ;)

Seeing that Taus can be allied with CSM, i'm really thinking of converting Exo suits in some "Deamon" or Possesed Armors, with the Riptid beeing a Chaos Knight, finally having a use for one of those Dreamforge leviathan model.

I've had Dark Mechanicus allies for my warband fluff forever now. The Tau are looking like maybe they're going to put Legio Nefandum on the table finally...

I like the idea of Dark Mechanicum allies

[Nehekhare]

Dark Mechanicus allies

fair enough now that daemon rules do not apply any more as a candidate for those with all that random/psychic crap.

Still, Mechanicus of any provenience propably is most adaequately represented by GK coteaz/inquisitor + servitor henchmen builds - but chaos can't ally with those

then again...SW and crons can.

[Tenebris]

Hmm what about several Chaos Terminator MSU with flamers or plasma. They use the special weapon in the turn they arrive and than charge in the next if there is something to charge. Undivided and with a basic combiweapon upgrade they are in the range of 120 points for which you have a deep strike unit that can inflict quite some wounds to an army like the Tau, especially if the adversary goes suit heavy. The price can make them quite useful in a great many situations. Their terminator armor can even take the brunt of overwatch fire from several Fire Warriors squads allowing other, more specialized units, to close in. 

[Brother Nihm]

 

Seeing that Taus can be allied with CSM, i'm really thinking of converting Exo suits in some "Deamon" or Possesed Armors, with the Riptid beeing a Chaos Knight, finally having a use for one of those Dreamforge leviathan model.

 

Brilliant!

Seconded.

 

That would be wicked to see

[Cmdr Shepard]

Dark Mechanicus allies

fair enough now that daemon rules do not apply any more as a candidate for those with all that random/psychic crap.

Still, Mechanicus of any provenience propably is most adaequately represented by GK coteaz/inquisitor + servitor henchmen builds - but chaos can't ally with those

then again...SW and crons can.

I never found the Coteaz plus henchmen a good way to represent Mechanicum... it's just a group of guys with Las Rifles/bolters and I don't see how they can represent Mechanicum... but that's just my thought...

[TheDarkOne]

Hmm what about several Chaos Terminator MSU with flamers or plasma. They use the special weapon in the turn they arrive and than charge in the next if there is something to charge. Undivided and with a basic combiweapon upgrade they are in the range of 120 points for which you have a deep strike unit that can inflict quite some wounds to an army like the Tau, especially if the adversary goes suit heavy. The price can make them quite useful in a great many situations. Their terminator armor can even take the brunt of overwatch fire from several Fire Warriors squads allowing other, more specialized units, to close in. 

 

 

Just like the old 4th/5th ed termicide squads? not a bad plan... I ran them in 5 man squads, 1 chainfist, 1 hv flamer and 4 combi melta. people have alsoused all combi melta on a 3 man squad. though in 6th now combi plama may be better... 

 

issue is, they are suicide squads. you don't need low AP to kill 3-5 terminators. just lots of shots... 

[TheDarkOne]

Dark Mechanicus allies

fair enough now that daemon rules do not apply any more as a candidate for those with all that random/psychic crap.

Still, Mechanicus of any provenience propably is most adaequately represented by GK coteaz/inquisitor + servitor henchmen builds - but chaos can't ally with those

then again...SW and crons can.

I never found the Coteaz plus henchmen a good way to represent Mechanicum... it's just a group of guys with Las Rifles/bolters and I don't see how they can represent Mechanicum... but that's just my thought...

Just saw this in my FB feed, thought it was on topic: http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2013/01/showcase-dark-mechanicum-wargamescon.html

[Smurfalypse]

Daemons also have a slew of units that are very fast or outflank and everything can deepstrike. People are overreating to rumors and not thinking clearly (Like they did with DA).

But Tau can deploy the firepower able to wipe those unit out without many problems. Deep striking and outflanking daemons cannot charge the turn they arrive from reserve.

We'll discover it soon.

>

Seeing that Taus can be allied with CSM, i'm really thinking of converting Exo suits in some "Deamon" or Possesed Armors, with the Riptid beeing a Chaos Knight, finally having a use for one of those Dreamforge leviathan model.

I've had Dark Mechanicus allies for my warband fluff forever now. The Tau are looking like maybe they're going to put Legio Nefandum on the table finally...

I like the idea of Dark Mechanicum allies

We can go back and forth on what beats what, but in the end the codex sounds very balanced and should fall in line with the rest of the 6th ed codexes.

Yes they shoot a lot but there is tons that they cannot handle. Flame templates (especially Torrent ones), Terminators, deeps striking Flamers est est. . . Just saying, it isnt cut and dry "OMG the sky is falling".

[Rune Priest Ridcully]

Yes, but even there codex's cover art shows more effort put in then ours (No offense to the artist, but when the art has already been used.)

[Cmdr Shepard]

 

We can go back and forth on what beats what, but in the end the codex sounds very balanced and should fall in line with the rest of the 6th ed codexes.

Yes they shoot a lot but there is tons that they cannot handle. Flame templates (especially Torrent ones), Terminators, deeps striking Flamers est est. . . Just saying, it isnt cut and dry "OMG the sky is falling".

 

I wasn't complaing about the new Tau Codex. In fact I'm very happy with it. It's CSM codex I have some issue with but that's an old story and everyone here know it ;)

 

As Chaos player what I would consider very dangerous is the fact Loyalist SM (those from Codex: SM) are battle brothers with Tau.

It seems Farsight's warlord trait allow him and every unit he joined to not scatter during deep strike. Being battle brothers with SM mean he can join a SM squad and give it the effects of his warlord trait. So a 10 men TDA squad cand deep strike with no scatter. Then we'll have to choose if focus our efforts on the TDAs or the Tau units shooting at us from afar... not an easy choice.

[the jeske]

Well for me it looks like this , if two things happen [A there will be good codex/builds/ally to do antiflyers without focusing on it and B good anti meq lists] our dex will suck like it did in 3ed ed under the JJ dex . If there are going to be plenty of armies that can deal with drakes[the tau are a thing to worry about and they can ally with lots of stuff] and there will be an ultra anti meq army[ze eldar, who again will be able to ally a lot] , then it will be again the time to wait for a new SW codex to do counts as armies . Right now as long as someone doesnt mind playing non opitmal and random lists chaos does ok . 

[Cmdr Shepard]

Well for me it looks like this , if two things happen [A there will be good codex/builds/ally to do antiflyers without focusing on it and B good anti meq lists] our dex will suck like it did in 3ed ed under the JJ dex . If there are going to be plenty of armies that can deal with drakes[the tau are a thing to worry about and they can ally with lots of stuff] and there will be an ultra anti meq army[ze eldar, who again will be able to ally a lot] , then it will be again the time to wait for a new SW codex to do counts as armies . Right now as long as someone doesnt mind playing non opitmal and random lists chaos does ok .

It's a good point after all. It is one of the reasons I rarely play CSM. Nearly everything Chaos get loyalists do it better and now it seems the CSM "power units" (see heldrake) will be less survivable.

However CSM can ally with new Tau, let's hope there will be some way to make CSM more effective

[Brother Ambroz]

Well with some of our better and fast CC units, such as a AOBF juggerlord + spawn, could help fill in some of the CC gaps Tau have.

[Cmdr Shepard]

Well with some of our better and fast CC units, such as a AOBF juggerlord + spawn, could help fill in some of the CC gaps Tau have.

Exactly. They can also fill some of the gaps we have with long range fire. It seems Tau will become quite common "mercenaries" on the table top ;)

A part from Tyranids, who can't ally themselves with anyone, only Chaos Daemons, Dark Elder and Sisters of Battle are desperate allies to Tau. Everyone else can ally with Tau without significant inconvenience, CSM included

[Azekai]

I might be a heretic, but I am no xeno lover. Take the little blue freaks if you must, but my warband won't pollute themselves by allying with Tau.

 

Frankly I am surprised by how grim some of you guys are- I suppose I didn't realize how heavily CSM rely upon the helldrake. 

[Cmdr Shepard]

I might be a heretic, but I am no xeno lover. Take the little blue freaks if you must, but my warband won't pollute themselves by allying with Tau.

 

Frankly I am surprised by how grim some of you guys are- I suppose I didn't realize how heavily CSM rely upon the helldrake. 

 

You don't have to love them in order to use them. You just USE them because they benefit your cause not because you love them. Consider them the slaves of your warband ;)

 

Anyway CSM is highly dependant on heldrake for competive purposes. It's one of the best, if not the best, units this codex gave us. What do CSM have that Loyalist cannot have at a better degree? Mostly heldrake and Lord on Jaggernaut with AoBF...

[Sception]

Loyalists don't have a better version of the winged mace prince.  Of course, the mace prince is even more vulnerable to broadsides than the helldrake.

 

Our bikes are dirt cheap for what they can do, more so than any loyalist versions I'm aware of.  Spawn can be interesting, allies dependent.  I'm not sure loyalists have a better version of oblits, although you can't really hang the whole faction on them like you could on the drakes.  For the most part though, especially if the Helldrake's reign of terror is brought to an end, chaos marines are the army you want to play when you want cooler marines who are worse and more expensive.

[Cmdr Shepard]

Loyalists don't have a better version of the winged mace prince.  Of course, the mace prince is even more vulnerable to broadsides than the helldrake.

 

Our bikes are dirt cheap for what they can do, more so than any loyalist versions I'm aware of.  Spawn can be interesting, allies dependent.  I'm not sure loyalists have a better version of oblits, although you can't really hang the whole faction on them like you could on the drakes.  For the most part though, especially if the Helldrake's reign of terror is brought to an end, chaos marines are the army you want to play when you want cooler marines who are worse and more expensive.

 

Loyalists get even better bikes in Codex:DA, Oblits are quite expensive and you will fire less shots of a given weapon than loayalists will for the same points (Obviously you have the chance to chance weapons wich increase their versatility).

The Mace DP is nice but with no EW and a 5++ invul is vulnerable to many weapons the loyalists can field to bring it down. Not to mention you are forced to get at least one of the codex's psychic powers if you buy psychic levels!