Starting Over: Hobby Article

[CitadelArmyGuy]

I do believe this is my very first hobby thread. Obviously my love for the game comes from the gameplay, even with its imperfect balance (in fact, perhaps the imperfection is why I love it). However, the game is greatly enhanced when everything on the table is cool looking.

Gentlemen, I believe the time has come. I've debated whether to "Start Over" with my painted Blood Angels for about two years. Here's why I've decided to take the plunge:

• I am not a hobbyist. My painting is terrible. Let me rephrase: I can achieve passable results, but it takes me ages to get even one model done.
• I started playing 8 years ago. My recipe for 'red' has changed 6 times in that timeframe, whether due to getting better as a painter or because paint availability has changed several times (use GW paints...ugh why change all the time!?). The altering recipe means my Blood Angels look even worse than they should since each model's red is slightly or vastly different than the ones around it.
• 6th Edition means frequently I am allying DA or SW or SM... but without owning those models, the Red for BA makes much less sense. With a unique color scheme, I can explain away the attached rules to those allied units using a 'Divergent Successor Chapter' narrative.
• GW is producing new Codicies like it is going out of style. Having a 'universal' paint scheme rather than 'Obviously Blood Angel Red' will help prevent the inbound eye-rolls if I ever decide to play around with Vanilla Marines or Black Templars or misc others when their new codex drops.

With that, I've decided that I will be going Army-wide Silver color scheme. Because:

1. Silver is stupidly easy to do quickly (Remember, I'm slow... hurrhurr ). Silver goes on evenly every time even at-speed and you only need one coat on top of a black undercoat
2. I have always always always loved the idea of metallic paint schemes. Largely had to do with selection of Iron Warriors for my CSM.
3. Speaking of Iron Warriors: If all my MEQ have identical paint schema, then I can use all the models for both armies. (Budget consideration)
4. Silver looks super crisp and very uniform. I like uniform.
5. No, I don't care if people think they will look like Grey Knights. I played Daemonhunters back before they got the new 'dex, and I miss my silver.

So with all the introduction out of the way, I now enter the "Request for Help" phase of the thread.

1. Anyone got suggestions for a good Chapter name?
2. Death Company will be getting a non-Silver scheme: What should I go for?
3. What is the most efficient and quick way to strip paint from 6 Rhino-sized chassis, 2 Land Raiders, ~60 Assault Marines, 5 Dreadnoughts, ~20 Terminators, etcetcetcetcetc?
4. Once stripped, what is the best black spraypaint that Silver goes onto nicely? I need something commercial that you could get from Walmart.
5. Any further lessons learned, tips, tricks or advice that anyone can give me?

Thanks Guys!

[Finn]

So with all the introduction out of the way, I now enter the "Request for Help" phase of the thread.

1. Anyone got suggestions for a good Chapter name?
2. Death Company will be getting a non-Silver scheme: What should I go for?
3. What is the most efficient and quick way to strip paint from 6 Rhino-sized chassis, 2 Land Raiders, ~60 Assault Marines, 5 Dreadnoughts, ~20 Terminators, etcetcetcetcetc?
4. Once stripped, what is the best black spraypaint that Silver goes onto nicely? I need something commercial that you could get from Walmart.
5. Any further lessons learned, tips, tricks or advice that anyone can give me?

Thanks Guys!

 

1. The Quicksilvers? :)

2. A darker shade of silver? Maybe bronze?

3. Brake fluid and a toothbrush.

4. Have no idea.

5. Spray black, drybrush leadbelcher, drybrush chainmail, drybrush mithril silver, wash black, drybrush mithril silver.

[Ghostwolfalpha]

Simple green works well for stripping, as it wont hurt the plastic if you let it soak and then a soft bristle toothbrush works well for getting it out of details and such.

 

Death company should be black, it just works and black is fairly uniform across chapters as an acceptible color.

 

For a black spray paint, go for rustoleum flat black painter's touch.

 

As for names, is it a BA successor?

Steel Angels

Lunar Angels

Silver Sanguine

 

For a generic chapter:

Ironblood Battle Brothers

Chrome Legion

[Ghostwolfalpha]

Although, one chapter has death company in white, may look better alongside your silver guys.

[knife&fork]

Why not go with the BA successor that's actually metallic?

 

Knights of Blood are easy to paint and their divergence means that any allies could be made in a similar paint scheme. A distinctly colored pauldron would be enough to clearly show what's what if you want to have a uniform paint scheme while using allies. 

Paint the left one red on all models and then make the right one Red for codex BA units, grey for SW or green for DA.  Easy to remember and stands out on a mostly silver marine.

[ianj253]

4. I know you're looking for some cheap spray paint, but I think you may be better of spending more and getting some army painter spray.  1 of their silver sprays will save you a ton of time and save you money on paint.  Hit them with a dark wash to create your shadows and then dry brush some highlights back on. 

[knife&fork]

Yeah, it's difficult to find cheap metallics that are somewhat coarse. Model acrylics (and wash in particular) will not hold well on the cheaper stuff. 

[Tabgoi]

<p>I had to strip the paint off my army as most of it was painted to get them to the battlefield quickly so I could play, needless to say it was bad and ten years later I had learned enough about painting to really dislike the way they looked.  So  to illustrate the enormity of the task, I stripped 60 Tac Marines, 30 Assault, 20 Devistator, 50 Death Company, 10 honor guard, 15 Character Models, 30 Terminators, 28 Scouts, 3 bikes, and 5 tanks.  Luckily four dreads and other tanks did not need it.  So yeah, when I bring the fifth company, I bring all of it.  Took me all of about four hours total after I found Dawn Power Disolver (another poster on the boards reccomended it).  Soak the mini's over night in the power disolver.  You can leave them in there for as long as you want really, it will cause zero damage to the plastic (well I can vouch for two months at least, missed a mini when I put it away).  It will however soften any green stuff that is on them causing it to fall off.  Used that to my advantage on some of the first few minis I practiced my scultping on.  Anyways, after they have been soaked overnight you can just rinse the paint off.  Seriously, it just falls off.  There may be a little bit left on really detailed surfaces, but a quick pass with a tooth brush and it is off, no scrubbing.  Pewter minis will look like new, plastic will as well as long as you used GW paints.  I had a couple minis that I had gotten off a friend and he used a different type of paint (no clue which) and it stained the plastic, but it still came off and the GW primer covered it completely.  I have run four batches thru with no decrease in effectiveness and I just keep it in a gladware container.  The stuff costs like three bucks a bottle at Walmart, but that is the only place I have seen it.</p>

<p> </p>

<p>Edit: If you need to seperate the pieces to reposition them, or magnatize the lot like I did, just stick them in the freezer over night and they come apart.  BTW I tried the green stuff and it was too much effort for me, and prolonged soaking can soften the plastic.</p>

[Brother Chryseth]

Although, one chapter has death company in white, may look better alongside your silver guys.

 

The chapter I represent (Angels Encarmine) have white Sanguinary Guard/DC.

 

I don't know, to me they just look ... classy.

 

:-)

 

 

As an aside, if you use Brake Fluid on your models, be sure to use rubber gloves.

 

Simple green does take longer, but it's not toxic and gentler on your hands.

[Papa Lazarou]

If you're doing metallics then vallejo air matallics are amazingly smooth and give good coverage, you could aldo use their black metallic on your DC to keep with the metallic theme. You can paint them on with a brush too.

[Midnightmare]

For coloured metallic,s (I know you are not looking for this, but I will though it out there anyway) what about using a load of washes to 'tint' the silver. I had good results with the old GW Sepia over a light silver to give gold, and have seen some good green, blue and purple tints. It is quite easy to do and relatively quick (save the drying time)

[CitadelArmyGuy]

Some really awesome ideas so far! I'm gonna have to think some of them over.

 

Idk if I can swallow the Knights of Blood backstory--- Renegade yet not Chaos? That's the first time I've even heard of that happening, I thought all betrayal was Chaos-based.

 

Then again, it would give me a reason to wave away the fact they ignore the Codex Astartes (ruleswise via allied contingents using divergent rules). I may get won over to the idea.

[Drunken Angel]

Scorpion Bronze or another paint next to it on the paint shelf for the DC go get a pot and try it the paint looks like rubbish and dont let it sit around too long but I love the bloody bronze that it produces and it takes shades and washes very well.

[Zynk Kaladin]

I know exactly how you feel. When I put my painted Night Angels on the table, especially my more recent ones, I grow insanely giddy to the point of sinful pride. Nothing like a sea of mock-divine, skeleton-clad midnight-clad overly-angelic sons of Sanguinius precipitating every inch of their vengefully righteous souls unto all who dare oppose the march of mankind's destiny. Oooh man, the imagery of my opponent's models, the very essence of evil and malice, getting torn apart under the roaring blades of a special kind of just murder and noble savagery. All these emotions, a divergent sense of brutality and regality felt through a simple slapping of brush upon plastic.

Back to reality... I'm not THAT crazy IRL , I agree that having an army with a uniform theme really enhances the game in a very unique kind of way. I suggest you write in stone your army's theme and try to articulate it in the way you paint your models. For example, my angels take "angelic" and "demonic" motifs and exemplify each. As such, I individualize some of my models to look as holy/noble/angelic and others as savage/vengeful/skeletal as possible. The theme really brings unity to my army's very divergent ideas.

Now as far as your army is concerned, here are some of my thoughts:

Angels of Iron

Silver(or Steel) Seraphim

Chains of Sanguine Steel

Souls of Bleeding Iron

Metal Malediction

Idk, I picture xenos and heretics alike swathed in barbed chains, your chapter mounting them to your once pristine vehicles now baptized in the ruby-black life fluids of your foes. Actually, this would be perfect for your death co: instead of you army's normal silver, make them a deep, dark rusty iron wrapped in bleeding steel chains. The dark metal with a splattering of gore red upon barbed chains screams DEATH COMPANY.

Also, I agree with Ghostwolfalpha on the Simple Green and I can vouch for its effectiveness at stripping models. I bought a set of wire brushes at Lowes for cleaning models after a 24 hr bath in SG. Just try not to rush your self and strip a lot at once. I took on too much once, got tired and careless which caused me to ruin the Claudio Terminator model I bought second hand. Take your time, don't brush too hard, and stay vigilant.

You got a long journey ahead of you. Get workin

[I am Legion]

You know, somewhere in the back of our mighty Rulebook, there's an awesome picture of silver and blue marines. I have to admit they look familiar (celestial lions mebee?), but they look great and simple to paint. I'm out all day with no access to the book but if i get a chance ill give u the page number

[Paulochromis]

I quite like Mercury (Quicksilver) as a contributor to the name. Conjures up images of speed (mercurial).

Mercury Rising is a probably a bit too much =c)

[knife&fork]

Some really awesome ideas so far! I'm gonna have to think some of them over.

 

Idk if I can swallow the Knights of Blood backstory--- Renegade yet not Chaos? That's the first time I've even heard of that happening, I thought all betrayal was Chaos-based.

 

Then again, it would give me a reason to wave away the fact they ignore the Codex Astartes (ruleswise via allied contingents using divergent rules). I may get won over to the idea.

 

Maybe some fluffbunny will correct me but I think it's actually more common for a marine chapter to go/be declared renegade rather than straight up grow top knots and weld spikes to everything. 

 

Marine chapters are powerful and autonomous, both their strength and weakness. All it takes is getting on the wrong side of a powerful lord or inquisitor and you could be declared renegade despite millennia of faithful service. Or the chapter might get so completely dicked over by the administratum that they decide to ditch the empire but stay loyal to the emperor and his subjects. Examples of all these exist within the fluff. 

[Tabgoi]

I

 

Also, I agree with Ghostwolfalpha on the Simple Green and I can vouch for its effectiveness at stripping models.  I bought a set of wire brushes at Lowes for cleaning models after a 24 hr bath in SG.  Just try not to rush your self and strip a lot at once.  I took on too much once, got tired and careless which caused me to ruin the Claudio Terminator model I bought second hand.  Take your time, don't brush too hard, and stay vigilant.

 

This is actually the reason I no longer use simple green.  Far too much effort, and any product that requires wire brushes to remove the paint is too much of a risk to the minis in my opinion.  And any product that needs me to wear gloves (like break cleaner or oven cleaner) is straight out, not to mention they take almost as long as the simple green to get the minis clean and you have to worry about ventillation and spills.  Dawn Power Disolver over night, a bit of running water for a good rinse, and an old soft worn tooth brush for areas with really heavy paint on them.  You barely need to pay attention.  I watch movies while stripping minis.  You can tackle as much or as little as you want, just leave them in the disolver in between because there is no risk to the minis.  I even went one step further in terms of making my life easier and when I replaced my crest electric toothbrush I used my old one for the minis. 

 

 

Knife and Fork, depending on what edition of Warhammer and what writers you are completely accurate.  According to some earlier editions and writers Space Marines in no way answer to any one but the Emperor so they could care less what and Inquisitor or anyone else says.  As long as they claim to fight for the Emperor, then they do.  Newer fluff is shifting things more in favor of the high Lords of Terra and the Inquisition holding the cards, but there are some exceptions.  Even in some newer fluff Inquisitors have been killed by Space Marines (the Angels Encarmine did it recently I believe, but I could have the chapter wrong) and just did not bother telling the Inquisition.  How would the Inquisition prove it without a witness or a video or a body.  Also the older the Chapter the more you can get away with because the hit the Imperium would take from another first founding Chapter going Rouge would be bad.  So The Blood Angels, Dark Angels, Ultra Smurfs, and so on have a lot more leway, followed closely by the Second Founding Chapters.  These are all still under the Emperor's direct orders to find and destroy the enemies of mankind and need nothing else to justify themselves.  Newer foundings that are the product of the High Lords comminsioning a new chapter would obviously be more beholden to the monolithic mess that governs the Imperium day to day as it was the High Lords and not the Emperor or even a Primarch that gave them their warrant to operate.

[CitadelArmyGuy]

 

 

Also, I agree with Ghostwolfalpha on the Simple Green and I can vouch for its effectiveness at stripping models.  I bought a set of wire brushes at Lowes for cleaning models after a 24 hr bath in SG.  Just try not to rush your self and strip a lot at once.  I took on too much once, got tired and careless which caused me to ruin the Claudio Terminator model I bought second hand.  Take your time, don't brush too hard, and stay vigilant.

This is actually the reason I no longer use simple green.  Far too much effort, and any product that requires wire brushes to remove the paint is too much of a risk to the minis in my opinion.  And any product that needs me to wear gloves (like break cleaner or oven cleaner) is straight out, not to mention they take almost as long as the simple green to get the minis clean and you have to worry about ventillation and spills.  Dawn Power Disolver over night, a bit of running water for a good rinse, and an old soft worn tooth brush for areas with really heavy paint on them.  You barely need to pay attention.  I watch movies while stripping minis.  You can tackle as much or as little as you want, just leave them in the disolver in between because there is no risk to the minis.  I even went one step further in terms of making my life easier and when I replaced my crest electric toothbrush I used my old one for the minis

 

 

I went the Purple Power route and using an old toothbrush, and it is certainly taking some time. I might have to see about this 'Dawn Power Dissolver' if I can locate it and give it a try. My Rhinos/Predators are all done stripping and rebased black-- the week's project is the ~60 Jump Pack Marines. With the wife and son out of town, I've got the free time to knock 'em out.

 

I'm using the old toothbrush exactly because of not knowing what wire brushes exist out there that might do the job better. The Purple Power is doing fantastic at loosening the paint, but it takes a long time for the toothbrush to remove the 'loosened gunk' that the paint turns into. Anyone know what wirebrushes are safe yet work better than a toothbrush?

[Zynk Kaladin]

 

 

This is actually the reason I no longer use simple green.  Far too much effort, and any product that requires wire brushes to remove the paint is too much of a risk to the minis in my opinion.  And any product that needs me to wear gloves (like break cleaner or oven cleaner) is straight out, not to mention they take almost as long as the simple green to get the minis clean and you have to worry about ventillation and spills.  Dawn Power Disolver over night, a bit of running water for a good rinse, and an old soft worn tooth brush for areas with really heavy paint on them.  You barely need to pay attention.  I watch movies while stripping minis.  You can tackle as much or as little as you want, just leave them in the disolver in between because there is no risk to the minis.  I even went one step further in terms of making my life easier and when I replaced my crest electric toothbrush I used my old one for the minis. 

 

Hmm, Dawn Power Disolver sounds much easier... I'll have to give it a try.  Thanks for the tip!

[Emperors Immortals]

If it helps, I just use Dettol (dont know if its in the USA) and s toothbrush, best results so far.

 

Also, chapters csm be declared renegade almost at a whim celestial lions critisised an I decision of exterminatus there forces were subsequently assassinated in Armegeddon 3 and CO killed en route to petition the HL. FAhave destroyed at least on I investigative mission and got away with it.

 

40k justice has a lot more to do with competing factions above your station then actual law.

[Brother Maikel]

I use mostly simple green.  It seems to be pretty good with stripping acrylics, but isn't the greatest with enamels.

After they're done soaking for a while, I'll use a soft toothbrush to remove most of the gunk, then a set of modeling

picks (I got them from Hobby Lobby, they look like dental tools) to scrape the gunk out of crevices.

 

As for priming, Army painter makes wonderful spray primer, but is rather expensive and usually only found at FLGS'es.

One suggestion I heard (and am in the process of trying myself) was automotive primer: its designed for both metals and

plastics, and it has gone on really smoothly.  The models I've primed with it didn't lose any detail, but I haven't tried painting

over it yet.  One spray can ran me about $4-5 at Home Depot.

[knife&fork]

Automotive primers are ok, but the metal ones should be avoided for models. Very difficult to get the acrylics to stick on the stuff.

[CitadelArmyGuy]

Wanted to share my announcement, I am officially gone Renegade!
.

 

 

The Silver Seraphim are a subsequent founding (specifics TBD) from the Blood Angel geneseed. However, after run-in with the Inquisition (specific story TBD) they have been declared Renegade and relabeled the Angels of Exile to the greater Imperium.

 

News of their excommunication has spread slower than the forced-migration of their Fleet, as the Silver Seraphim were always a mobile Space-based Chapter without a homeworld. Constantly on the run from the Inquisitions reach, the Chapter now flees from warzone to warzone seeking out Imperial forces who either haven't heard of their changed status or are in too dire of trouble themselves to care about consorting with branded traitors, albeit in name only.

 

Extreme circumstances have forced the Angels of Exile to alter their interpretations of the Codex Astartes such as adding Bolters to their Drop Podded Assault Marines, fielding Speeders in squads of 5, or other doctrinal changes that were otherwise unthinkable prior to their outcast status. Many such changes have occurred due to the Angels of Exile's ad-hoc adoption of other Imperial Battle Brothers who have also wrongly fell afoul of the Inquisition's wrath. The Angels of Exile have become a mismatch of surviving members from other Chapters whose main-forces were not so fortunate in escaping a wrongful purge... or escaping members who refused to join their own Chapter when those truly did fall to Chaos.

 

With the incorporation of varied Chapters comes the incorporation of varied Tactics and Doctrine, and the diminshed ability to recruit fresh initiates has been supplemented by the slow influx of survivor Marines who have suddenly found themselves with nowhere else to go. On the run from Imperial law, the Angels of Exile continue to fight for The Emperor in the hopes that one day they all might be able to clear their name and honor despite the odds stacked against them.

 

I'm pretty happy about the rough-sketch of my background fluff. I do still need to hash out some specifics (such as why the heck they were excommunicated) but overall I like it.

 

As for the stripping of paint, the Purple Power worked fairly well but I tried out something called Krud Kutter and am extremely pleased with the superior results. With Krud Kutter, if you give models a good 48 hour soak then the paint just falls off with little effort. Of course you can soak them for less than 48hrs and still get the paint off. And of course, no plastic damage--- I've had models sitting in it for a week now for no ill effect.

[Zynk Kaladin]

Awesome!  I can help you hash out some details:

 

Fluffilocically speaking, wouldn't bolters on drop podded assault marines just be tactical marines with chainswords?  Or do you mean jump pack assault marines that arrive via drop pod?

 

Also, why would "extreme circumstances" (might be nice to detail your chapter's woes... I call it "character building") force the AoE to run speeders in squadrons of 5?  Just thinking aloud (and I am by no means apt in military logistics) but perhaps dwindling ammunition/access to resources shrinks your supply capabilities, forcing your vehicles to travel in groups to exchange munitions.

 

Just listing some characteristics from what I can tell so far.  It seems your chapter is:

+ Dying: No new recruits.  Exiles are few and far between.  This could lead to "backed into a corner" situations where you fight more ferociously than the Codex recommends.

+ Cut off access to the Mechanicam: Vehicle maintenance gets complicated and ammunition supplies.

+ Ideological shift: Abandoning old traditions/ideas for practicality.

+ Always on the run:  Forces an army focused on mobility and small engagements.

+ "Disorganized":  Astartes are generally very organized, even in dire situations.  However, there could be a possible unorganized force structure with the addition of other exiles.

+ Veterans: Less resources and no growth causes newbies to die quick or learn fast.

+ True to the cause: For the Emperor.  Will help you with allied chapters who don't give a dang what the Inquisition thinks.  See next.

+ Reliant on allies or ignorant imperials:  Some chapters may be willing to help if they still think the AoE are honorable enough.  Seeing as you are still loyal, the AoE will be more diplomatic with their friends.

 

Did I get everything?

 

As for the Krud Kutter, how well did it remove paint from the nooks and crannies?  Specifically the joints between armored plates and other various recesses on the model.