Plasma cannon terminator

[ilnar]

 

 

 

Missile launchers in devastator squads are relics of a bygone era (5th)

 

Flak missiles anyone?

But yeah, anyone would rather have a Mortis for AA duties.

Flakk missiles are better in a tac squad. A dev squad needs to use heavier weapons to take out nasty targets. The tac squads are the utility knife of a marine list. The devs are to rain overwhelming firepower and well...devastate targets.

 

At least thats my take on it and I havent been dissapointed yet :D

 

EDIT: Never used FW outside of apoc, never will.

Tell that to the grey hunters...

[Brother Immolator]

Missile launchers in devastator squads are relics of a bygone era (5th)

Flak missiles anyone?

But yeah, anyone would rather have a Mortis for AA duties.

Flakk missiles are better in a tac squad. A dev squad needs to use heavier weapons to take out nasty targets. The tac squads are the utility knife of a marine list. The devs are to rain overwhelming firepower and well...devastate targets.

At least thats my take on it and I havent been dissapointed yet

EDIT: Never used FW outside of apoc, never will.

Tell that to the grey hunters...

Play Space Wolves then if one more missile launcher is your dream

Tell em to shoot my Land Raiders and predators thats oughta do it....

And in the odd case a flyer with their flakk missiles, thats gonna be funny.

You are comparing two units that happen to be equiped similarily but have completely different unit compositions and rules.

Oranges to lemons.

[ilnar]

I think you are missing the point of the missile launcher,

You may as well tell guardsmen to fire las guns at your land raider, it's not what they are for.

A 6man grey hunter squad with ML cost very little, puts out considerable firepower, 6/7 missiles a turn and still gets 2a off the charge.

Even a regular dev squad with ML is fairly cheap, can engage light tanks, monsters and anything up to MEQ, instant death most medium infantry, and is still fairly effective at killing hordes. this is hardly a relic unit.

Dev squads do not "need" heavy weapons.

And frankly, if you're using dev squads to kill land raiders you are doing something very wrong,

[Brother Immolator]

I think you are missing the point of the missile launcher,

You may as well tell guardsmen to fire las guns at your land raider, it's not what they are for.

A 6man grey hunter squad with ML cost very little, puts out considerable firepower, 6/7 missiles a turn and still gets 2a off the charge.

Even a regular dev squad with ML is fairly cheap, can engage light tanks, monsters and anything up to MEQ, instant death most medium infantry, and is still fairly effective at killing hordes. this is hardly a relic unit.

Dev squads do not "need" heavy weapons.

And frankly, if you're using dev squads to kill land raiders you are doing something very wrong,

 

Ok time out.

 

First mistake I took Grey hunters for Long Fangs. Hence my bickering about with devs.

 

Even so though, you are telling me that a Grey Hunter squad (troop choice) must have the missile launchers and not a devastor equivalent squad.

 

Which is my point all along as I said a post or two ago.

 

Secondly the Codex space wolves on pg 26 under the grey hunters pack, has no mention of missile launchers in their wargear and options section at all.

Unless I miss something, which I think I dont.

 

So unless we are dicussing of a different unit I cant see how they are going to pull off 6-7 missile strikes a turn....

If we are indeed talking about Longfangs, its 5 missiles per turn period.

 

So now if you are equipping grey hunters or even Long fangs with 6 missile launchers it is YOU who is doing something horribly wrong.

And btw the LasCannon is not for killing infantry you know. And also Its a great idea to use your devastators with bolters and not equiping them with heavy gear...

 

Get your arguements streight next time though before you accuse someone for doing things wrong, because In all honestly I dont think you even used the unit you arguing about.

 

I think this arguement has gonne beyond the scope of sillyness and I will be taking my leave. I am sorry for derailing this thread more than I had to and for causing any unwanted attention. Please continue without me from here on.

[shabbadoo]

Can they fire the stormbolter too? I thought infantry could fire only one of their longrange guns? Or I am missing something?

Never had a stormbolter CML to begin with

They have been able to do this for, what, forever? Read your wargear section. Otherwise, yes, it is a good idea to put the CML on an Assault Terminator, seeing as it will often be using the krak missiles against something that the stormbolter won't do much to, or can even affect at all. However, if you are taking down hordes from range, a couple extra stormbolter shots per CML-armed model is not too shabby (and they will still have a power fist to smack people around).

[march10k]

I'm horribly amused by the idea that a dev squad needs to take heavy weapons in lieu of missile launchers.  Now...I've never taken anything but lascannons since 3rd edition, following the maxim "go big or go home" (and points cost be damned, they've always impressed me!), but to suggest that missile launchers are light or medium weapons is...comical.

[march10k]

shabbadoo, on 01 Apr 2013 - 08:34, said:

The point is, with so many 3+ and 2+ saves across all of the armies, one cannot just write off the plasma cannon as a useless weapon.

 

Ah, hyperbole...my favorite. Please show where I said that plasma cannons are "useless!"

 

/edit/

 

All of the weapon options have value. Are you familiar with the concept of opportunity cost? Every choice you make closes off others. If you take a plasma cannon, you get better at killing MEQs and TEQs, which you should be doing in the assault phase, not so much the shooting phase. If that were the end of the story, fantastic, spam them! But it's not. By taking a plasma cannon, you are choosing not to take a CML or assault cannon. Ergo, you are passing on the opportunity to get better at killing tanks and hordes. Tanks is one thing, you can punch them to death, but you will never prevail against a horde unless you are killing it in the shooting and melee phases. You can win against MEQs/TEQs with no heavy weapons at all, but if your heavy weapon is killing an average of two guardsmen per turn, that's woefully inadequate! You don't need help against the sorts of enemies that the PC is designed to kill. It's not useless, it's just not the best choice.

 

/edit again/

 

I can think of options that would be far more interesting. Imagine Belial leading ten tactical terminators with two multimeltas. Woah! Turn one DWA to nuke a proper tank while hosing down an enemy squad with eight twinlinked stormbolters? That would be awesome. Autocannons would be nice for popping cans. DWA them on/near an OBJ in your deployment zone just to get twinlinking and potentially avoid getting shot at the top of turn one. But plasma cannons? Shooting MEQs/TEQs is not a terminator role.

[Master Avoghai]

PAradoxaly, I think that split fire is the reason why CML is so interesting over PC.

 

Since you have a possibility to pop a tank and then charge an infantry squad with your LCed (or THed) CML, you'd be dumb not to profit from it. Since the target of choice of a PC are more limitated, the charge target of the termi is likely to be the favorite target of the PC too...

 

Actually if we didn't have split fire then CML wouldn't be THAT interesting (though still appealing)

[BigGumbo]

Can they fire the stormbolter too? I thought infantry could fire only one of their longrange guns? Or I am missing something?

Never had a stormbolter CML to begin with

Yep, special ability of the CML targeting system. I've just rearmed my CML guys to carry SBs rather than Hammers as I'm running no more than 50% SSs in my squads now and I don't want one of those to be the Cyclone guy.

[Brother Immolator]

I'm horribly amused by the idea that a dev squad needs to take heavy weapons in lieu of missile launchers.  Now...I've never taken anything but lascannons since 3rd edition, following the maxim "go big or go home" (and points cost be damned, they've always impressed me!), but to suggest that missile launchers are light or medium weapons is...comical.

I am amused at some suggestions I read here and there too brother and believe me the tally is too long to count. And conviction is so high that redicule doesnt begin to discribe it.

Perhaps instead of listening to 'jokes' some pps need to get their models on the table a couple of more hours....Or against more decent opponents.

[Disruptor_fe404]

I prefer assault cannons. Because getting lucky with an assault cannon is better than getting lucky with a plasma cannon.

 

For the record, I've used assault cannons to take out a charging Trygon with overwatch (desperate times), and a Storm raven with snap shots (even more desperate times), neither of which is possible with a plasma cannon.

 

Also I deep strike them lots, and I always try for Gate of Infinity on my Librarian.

[AngelVeto]

Posting off topic, then I'm off the chamber 42 for it, but does anyone see how awesome it is to be able to have this discussion and be able to list the merits of varying builds? We are coming for a codex that basically saw one build be able to function with any degree of success for the majority of our players, to being able to fill pages of a forum with different builds and discus the merits of each one... This leaves me super ecstatic. I love all these topics.

 

OT: I use plasma in some of my games, especially if I dot have the points for a CML or an AC. They are cheap, pack a decent punch, and can even give vehicle squadrons pause if you get a good scatter. On the whole, I feel they have their uses and will see table time for me at least.

[Brother Immolator]

Posting off topic, then I'm off the chamber 42 for it, but does anyone see how awesome it is to be able to have this discussion and be able to list the merits of varying builds? We are coming for a codex that basically saw one build be able to function with any degree of success for the majority of our players, to being able to fill pages of a forum with different builds and discus the merits of each one... This leaves me super ecstatic. I love all these topics.

 

 

Yes and I am saddened by it. Or to be more precice, by the fact  that people continue to stick to their 'ultimate solutions' and disregard everything else as worthless.

Get off my lawn altitude Or 5th edition mentality, you choose.