DA Playstyle

[NuclearSnowyOwl]

So guys, I'm totally new to 40k, though I have played Fantasy off and on for about 15 years.  I have recently made the decision to take the plunge and join the hobby.  I believe Dark Angels are the army for me.  

 

Can we get a discussion going about the play style of DA?

 

For example, is there really only 1 good play style that works?  Or are there 10?  What is the strength of the DA army?  I won't be playing competitively, so that's not an issue.  But I don't like getting my face mashed in every time either.  I like to at least have a sporting chance.

 

I have chosen this army after about a month of investigation.  I have watched lots of batreps, read through the rules, looked at lots of models, etc.  The look, feel, and theme of DA is the coolest by far, IMO.  

 

HOWEVER, I would have to say that the most important part of the hobby for me is play style.  So this is the last piece of the puzzle for me to choose an army.  If the game play is boring, I'll have to choose something else (though I'm not counting on it.  Seems like Tau already have the monopoly on boring game play).  

 

Thanks in advance!

[Brother Immolator]

First of all the Dark Angels choose you, you don't choose them.

You think that we have those pervert midgets peeping from the shadows for nothing?

The fact that you knocked our door is the first step.

 

Now after the not so warm welcome lets see...

 

We have 4 playstyles for the demanding player!

 

We can do it like marines: Power armor, infantry,planes,mechanized etc etc etc. And we can do it better and cheaper than them. We don't have all the options (etc Ironclads) but they don't have ours too. Overall we currently have quite an edge though.

 

Second playstyle is the illustrious deathwing. Cram as many terminators as you can in there. Make them scorring with belial and hammer everything to death.

 

Third is our Ravenwing. An army focus on speeders and bikes. We can score with those too if you take the right H.Q. Fast game, outflanking, firing on the move and staying mobile.

 

And last but not least a combination of the Deathwing and Ravenwing. We can combine them into deadly effect by either taking our supreme grand master (who makes both wings scorring) or the two respective H.Qs. The plan here is to outmaneuver the opponent and harass him with our bikes and then use their teleport homers to deepstrike the terminators and cut them.

 

The fun part is that none of the above is the 'right way'. All of them are viable and all of them have sworn enemies and lovers. Some even master them all.

 

Anyways. Hope I have been of slight help. There are brothers more versed in the arts of discussion than me and will add more in time.

For the time being welcome to the Rock. I hope you enjoy your stay and eventually you join.

Remember though: The watchers are watching!

[NuclearSnowyOwl]

Awesome, thanks for the quick response Brother Immolator.

 

First, let me say that your point about being chosen is well taken.  I've been trying to "like" an army for about a month now, as I said.  Nothing was really striking me...that is, until today.  Why?  The FLGS, which until now had sold nothing related to any miniatures games, had just gotten in a whole new load of stuff.  By chance, I stopped by today, even though I knew (supposedly) they would have nothing I was interested in.  Low and behold, there was 40k stuff.  The first thing that I laid my hands on and picked up?  The DA codex.  After perusing the codex for a few minutes, I knew DA was for me.  There was SO MUCH STUFF in there that is not in the rulebook.  So I have to conclude that armies like Blood Angels, Tyranids, Chaos SM, Ultramarines, Dark Eldar, and IG are desperate for recruits because the rulebook is loaded with pics of them.  They are trying to appear desirable so new players will choose them.  Pictures and fluff for Dark Angels is practically non-existent in the rulebook.  So, after not falling for those other factions' cheap recruitment tricks, I have now been chosen...

 

Okay now let me reveal my ignorance and ask about all the things in your post I don't understand yet.  Remember, I have never played a game and I do not own models or a codex.  So my ignorance is great indeed...for now.

 

1) "do it like the marines"  Well, how do the marines do it?  With all the mechanized and planes, is it mostly shooting?  Do you let all the big guns on both sides blow each other up and then send in the troops to mop up and score?

 

2) "cram as many terminators as you can in there"  In where?  Can Terminators/troops only be crammed into vehicles designated Dedicated Transport?  Hammering everything to death definitely sounds appealing.

 

3) Which of these styles would you say is best against a horde army like Nids?

 

4) My favorite models in all of 40k are a group of soldiers that I can't positively identify.  On GW's site they come up as one of the alternate pics under Deathwing Command Squadron.  They look like Terminators who have replaced their helmets/masks for robes and hoods.  They carry massive maces while their leader carries some type of mace/flail thing that looks like it will rock anybody's face.  Are these Deathwing Knights?  If so, would these work with Deathwing style of first cramming then hammering?

 

5) I am also absolutely in love with what I believe is the Ravenwing Darkshroud.  Can anyone explain a bit what all it's special rules are?  What's the best play style/list to GET THIS IN MY ARMY?!  (Ravenwing is my guess)  The more gothic the better...so this is definitely the best model ever.  

 

Ok that's a start :)

[Jehoel]

Awesome, thanks for the quick response Brother Immolator.

First, let me say that your point about being chosen is well taken. I've been trying to "like" an army for about a month now, as I said. Nothing was really striking me...that is, until today. Why? The FLGS, which until now had sold nothing related to any miniatures games, had just gotten in a whole new load of stuff. By chance, I stopped by today, even though I knew (supposedly) they would have nothing I was interested in. Low and behold, there was 40k stuff. The first thing that I laid my hands on and picked up? The DA codex. After perusing the codex for a few minutes, I knew DA was for me. There was SO MUCH STUFF in there that is not in the rulebook. So I have to conclude that armies like Blood Angels, Tyranids, Chaos SM, Ultramarines, Dark Eldar, and IG are desperate for recruits because the rulebook is loaded with pics of them. They are trying to appear desirable so new players will choose them. Pictures and fluff for Dark Angels is practically non-existent in the rulebook. So, after not falling for those other factions' cheap recruitment tricks, I have now been chosen...

Okay now let me reveal my ignorance and ask about all the things in your post I don't understand yet. Remember, I have never played a game and I do not own models or a codex. So my ignorance is great indeed...for now.

1) "do it like the marines" Well, how do the marines do it? With all the mechanized and planes, is it mostly shooting? Do you let all the big guns on both sides blow each other up and then send in the troops to mop up and score?

2) "cram as many terminators as you can in there" In where? Can Terminators/troops only be crammed into vehicles designated Dedicated Transport? Hammering everything to death definitely sounds appealing.

3) Which of these styles would you say is best against a horde army like Nids?

4) My favorite models in all of 40k are a group of soldiers that I can't positively identify. On GW's site they come up as one of the alternate pics under Deathwing Command Squadron. They look like Terminators who have replaced their helmets/masks for robes and hoods. They carry massive maces while their leader carries some type of mace/flail thing that looks like it will rock anybody's face. Are these Deathwing Knights? If so, would these work with Deathwing style of first cramming then hammering?

5) I am also absolutely in love with what I believe is the Ravenwing Darkshroud. Can anyone explain a bit what all it's special rules are? What's the best play style/list to GET THIS IN MY ARMY?! (Ravenwing is my guess) The more gothic the better...so this is definitely the best model ever.

Ok that's a start

#4) those were Deathwing Knights, an elite terminator unit that only the DA codex has. By cramming as many terminators in as possible, he meant building a list with as many terminator units in it as possible. By taking Beliel, you can take up to 3 elite squads (Deathwing Knights are elite only) and 6 troop squads. Depending on the point level, that would be up to 60 Deathwing Terminators, 30 Deathwing Knights, and a 5 man Command Squad, plus Beliel. But that is an insane number of points.

Did you pick up the codex? You mentioned reading it, but not whether you bougt it.

[elphilo]

It appears we have another recruit for the Deathwing

I'm going to try and answer to the best of my abilities for you.

1. Doing it like the Marines means mainly taking tactical squads as your troop choices. Basically adhering to what fluff nuts would call the Codex Astartes. Lots of Marines in power armor doing their respective roles.

2. Cramming as many Terminators in a list means Taking Belial/Azreal to unlock Deathwing Terminators as Troop choices and trying to fit as many scoring Terminators as you can.

3. Against horde? Greenwing (see number 1, its a nickname for our base Marines) with Standard of Devastation and Whirlwinds. Or Ravenwing with Standard of Devastation with Whirlwind. Mass Storm Bolters equipped on Terminators will help, but you probably won't have enough dudes. Basically Deathwing's struggle is versus horde and mass small arms fire.

4. Those are Deathwing Knights. The Deathwing Command Squad box can make 3 different types of Terminator squads. A Deathwing Command Squad, a Deathwing Terminator Squad or a Deathwing Knight Squad. BTW the Knights are my favorite as well, good choice

5. I haven't played with the Darkshroud as I truly hate Landspeeders so I'll let someone more qualified respond to this one.

Hope this helps!

Also

[Eulfein]

First of all the Dark Angels choose you, you don't choose them.

You think that we have those pervert midgets peeping from the shadows for nothing?

The fact that you knocked our door is the first step.

 

Now after the not so warm welcome lets see...

 

We have 4 playstyles for the demanding player!

 

We can do it like marines: Power armor, infantry,planes,mechanized etc etc etc. And we can do it better and cheaper than them. We don't have all the options (etc Ironclads) but they don't have ours too. Overall we currently have quite an edge though.

 

Second playstyle is the illustrious deathwing. Cram as many terminators as you can in there. Make them scorring with belial and hammer everything to death.

 

Third is our Ravenwing. An army focus on speeders and bikes. We can score with those too if you take the right H.Q. Fast game, outflanking, firing on the move and staying mobile.

 

And last but not least a combination of the Deathwing and Ravenwing. We can combine them into deadly effect by either taking our supreme grand master (who makes both wings scorring) or the two respective H.Qs. The plan here is to outmaneuver the opponent and harass him with our bikes and then use their teleport homers to deepstrike the terminators and cut them.

 

The fun part is that none of the above is the 'right way'. All of them are viable and all of them have sworn enemies and lovers. Some even master them all.

 

Anyways. Hope I have been of slight help. There are brothers more versed in the arts of discussion than me and will add more in time.

 

For the time being welcome to the Rock. I hope you enjoy your stay and eventually you join.

Remember though: The watchers are watching!

'Tis true that the Watchers of the Dark choose those who are a Lion at heart. Welcome to the Rock, Brother!

 

Just my two cents. What's great about Dark Angels is that you have a plethora of options available to you. As Brother Immolator has stated these are the Greenwing - our version of generic Space Marines which are more cost effective and can put out a massive number of power armored bodies on the board with the firepower to match. The Ravenwing, which plays like a mechanized spear. Fast moving and scoring troops backed up by Landspeeder Typhoons and Ravenwing Black Knights for added punch. The Deathwing is like a hammer, they teleport into battle in the 1st or 2nd turn while laying a fusillade of storm bolter fire downrange and the Deathwing Knights mopping up anything in close combat. Lastly you've got a mix or combination of any of the wings. Each "wing" playing off of each others strengths

 

Like Brother Immolator said, none of these options are "the way", that's the beauty of playing Dark Angels. IMHO it's all so finely tuned and balanced that any of the wings can stand on their own and can win with the right player at the helm. I sincerely hope you'll have fun discovering the wonders of the Lion as much as I have.

 

So as the Lion chose me, he chose you. 

 

Now let's go kill some Fallen.

[pueriexdeus]

An Initiate eh;

 

First you must walk the path of understanding the rights of  BGB and C:DA are the start of your journey. If you can survive this you must next embrace the Greenwing and all their foibles. Learn the Scouts, Devastators, and Assault options, with them will come the Librarians and Chaplains to keep your mind pure and straight.

 

If you can learn their ways of war, than you might cross onto the next path.

[Brother Immolator]

Well most of our brothers covered it for me

But heres my personal 2cents too, never say I Ignore a brother in need

1)Space marines (codex space marines) as an army are a jack of all trades but master of none. They can play as infantry divisions, bike squadrons, Mechanised, Tanks, and to lesser extend artillery and aircraft. We (the Dark Angels) can do all those and most of the time even better due to our tricks in the rules and points costs. A small exception is our flyers, which seem terribad on paper but if you combine them with the right units they can turn tables.

2)I meant to cram them in the force organisation chart. Each unit in the 40k is designated either as: Troop choice, Fast attack, Heavy support or Elites.

Under normal circumstances you are restricted to your available choices in each category. However, there are H.Qs such as are own Belial for example, that can turn terminators into troops and you can have more. With the added bonus of been able to claim objectives no less.

3)As I said I always like the mutly wing. Its is well rounded and can deal with every nasty surprise. If you now you will face the little gribles and design a list for that, I would carm as much Power armor as possible, with a unit of TH/SS terminators in a LR crusader to deal with their mostrus creatures.

4)As Jehoel said, those are own deathwing knights. They can be seen in the deathwing command squad box because its a multy part kit allowing you to build on of the three available builds: A 5 man deathwing knight unit, a 5 man DW command squad and a regular 5 man DW squad.

Once you build your squad you have the bits for the others but not the bodies to build them. You can either buy another one, but I would suggest that you buy a second to build the knights as buying the flails and bodies online will amount to close to the kits cost. From there you can combine the bits with regular terminator/assault terminator boxes to build the rest.

5)Your guess is correct. Its a unit that gives a cover save to units in a radius and is best used to escort ravenwing bike and speeder units because they are a bit fragile. However with the cover ignoring madness prevelant in this edition IMHO its something best avoided.

An Initiate eh;

First
you must walk the path of understanding the rights of BGB and C:DA are
the start of your journey. If you can survive this you must next
embrace the Greenwing and all their foibles. Learn the Scouts,
Devastators, and Assault options, with them will come the Librarians and
Chaplains to keep your mind pure and straight.

If you can learn their ways of war, than you might cross onto the next path.

And thats the best way to do it.

Dont get overwhelmed. Get yourself a copy of the Dark Vengeance starter set. It will set you up and you will learn how to use most of the units in the game. Also great minies and great value for money.

[MadMek83]

As of currently, Dark Angels is not just one of the most flexible army codices ( three wings, combinations are almost unlimited) its also fun codex but also challenging as its not written around few Deathstar units like C:BA Death Company with Reclursiarch. Or C:GK Psycannon spam. While our fliers seem to be less than stellar, if you use them with correct units and with correct timing, they will win game for you. I mean Dark Talon with Rift cannon, one time bomb and two sets of Hurricane bolter is not going to wreck flyers or vehicles (other than Dark Eldar perhaps) but you combine it for Ravenwing Black Knights or Deathwing Assault, you will kill enemy tough unit like  Thunderwolf cavalry, terminators, plague marines and Eldar Wraithguard.

 

Its really Fun Codex. I havent' had this Fun Codex since Kelly's Eldar codex. Yes, I know I go Blam my self soon enough for saying such heretic words... *BLAM*

[NuclearSnowyOwl]

 

 

Did you pick up the codex? You mentioned reading it, but not whether you bougt it.

 

No, didn't get it yet.  $49.50?  I can save at least $10 on ebay.

[NuclearSnowyOwl]

An Initiate eh;

 

First you must walk the path of understanding the rights of  BGB and C:DA are the start of your journey. If you can survive this you must next embrace the Greenwing and all their foibles. Learn the Scouts, Devastators, and Assault options, with them will come the Librarians and Chaplains to keep your mind pure and straight.

 

If you can learn their ways of war, than you might cross onto the next path.

 

What is "BGB?"  Also, can someone suggest a 1,500 point Greenwing list so that I can follow this advice?

[Eulfein]

Did you pick up the codex? You mentioned reading it, but not whether you bougt it.

No, didn't get it yet. $49.50? I can save at least $10 on ebay.

it's worth every cent my brother. Really!

[pueriexdeus]

 

An Initiate eh;

 

First you must walk the path of understanding the rights of  BGB and C:DA are the start of your journey. If you can survive this you must next embrace the Greenwing and all their foibles. Learn the Scouts, Devastators, and Assault options, with them will come the Librarians and Chaplains to keep your mind pure and straight.

 

If you can learn their ways of war, than you might cross onto the next path.

 

What is "BGB?"  Also, can someone suggest a 1,500 point Greenwing list so that I can follow this advice?

The BGB is the 6th.V Warhammer 40K rulebook.

[NuclearSnowyOwl]

 

 

An Initiate eh;

 

First you must walk the path of understanding the rights of  BGB and C:DA are the start of your journey. If you can survive this you must next embrace the Greenwing and all their foibles. Learn the Scouts, Devastators, and Assault options, with them will come the Librarians and Chaplains to keep your mind pure and straight.

 

If you can learn their ways of war, than you might cross onto the next path.

 

What is "BGB?"  Also, can someone suggest a 1,500 point Greenwing list so that I can follow this advice?

The BGB is the 6th.V Warhammer 40K rulebook.

 

Okay, well, I do have a copy of the BGB.  What does that even stand for?  Big Game Book?  Battle Game Book?  Big Giant Book?

 

The DA codex is next.  Off to ebay I go.  Thanks for the help everyone.

[BigGumbo]

"BGB" = Big Green Book, so dubbed due to the DA Libby on the cover in contrast to the 5th Edition "Big Red Book", which actually was big and red.

 

For army list ideas, can I suggest that you peruse the Army lists section of the forum? It's linked at the top of the main DA forum.

 

Happy hunting, brother ;-)

[Brother dean]

I would second others and point out that two dark vengeance boxes will give you a legal 1000 point army and will give you a feel for how the three wings work. Since you have a BGB you can get the DV minis seperate on the bay of e and not worry about getting rid of the chaos.

 

There are discount web stores if you know where to look as I am sure that codexes aren't cheaper on eBay yet.