L30n1d4s Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 I have been reading up more and more on the new Tau codex and one possible way to integrate Tau in as an ally to C:SM is bringing a Riptide battlesuit in as an Elites slot. I have been thinking about how to do this and one idea that jumped out at me is, given that the Riptide can be joined by ICs (since it can take drones, it doesn't count as a unit that is only one model, hence ICs can join it, unlike most MCs), what if you took Lysander as your HQ and then linked him up with your allied Tau Riptide with Ion Accelerator, Stim Injector, TLed Fusion Gun, and 2 Shielded Missile Drones? This unit would have: -7 T6 wounds with 2+/5++; 4 T4 wounds (which would actually be rolled as T6, due to majority toughness rules) with a 2+/3++, and EW backing them up against ID... so that is a total of 11 T6 equivelant wounds, all backed up by 2+ saves and between 5++ and 3++ Invuls -In close combat, 4 S10 AP2 Unwieldy attacks at WS6 and 3 S6 AP2 I2 attacks (or swapped for 2 S10 AP2 I2 attacks due to "Smash" USR) -In shooting, you have 3 x S7 AP2 (or 1 x S8 AP2 large blast) plus 4 x S7 AP4 plus 1 x TLed S8 AP1 Melta shots. -Mobility wise, it would only move 6" a turn, but could DS to get in close to the enemy or could use the Riptide's superior range to sit back and force the enemy to come to them. Leadership wise, as long as Lysander stays alive you have Stubborn Ld 10 with ATSKNF, so very handy there. Overall, this is definitely an expensive deathstar style unit, but it also would be very difficult to deal with, either by shooting or CC, and yet still not easy to ignore due to its shooting and close combat abilities. I think it would be exceptional as a Fire Magnet that Deep Strikes in near enemy lines and absorbs as much of their attention as possible, allowing the rest of your army to carry out its mission unmolested. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 It's far too inefficient. One unit works best hanging back and shooting whilst the other rushing forwards and assaulting. You're not really improving the survivability of the Riptide either, since you're putting it in harms way. And once in assaults you're going to get Lysander challenged away and the Riptide hammered with Krak grenades. Even if the risk of losing is negligible you won't be shooting. You can get Terminaters for cheaper who will actually benefit from Lysander. So in short, no, this idea wouldn't work. Sorry. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3352164 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 It's far too inefficient. One unit works best hanging back and shooting whilst the other rushing forwards and assaulting. You're not really improving the survivability of the Riptide either, since you're putting it in harms way. And once in assaults you're going to get Lysander challenged away and the Riptide hammered with Krak grenades. Even if the risk of losing is negligible you won't be shooting. You can get Terminaters for cheaper who will actually benefit from Lysander. So in short, no, this idea wouldn't work. Sorry. I agree with you. You don't want the Riptide to be in CC since his nice 72" kill-nearly-everything weapon would be wasted and you don't want to reduce Lysander to mere ablative wounds. However if you want to bring Tau allies and play a very effecfive IC+Riptide combo you can do another thing: add a Crisis Commader with Commad/Control node and multi spectrum (I hope I typed its name correctly ;) ) Now you have a Riptide who rerolls to hit and ignores cover. Add the minum number of fire warriors and you have an allied Tau force ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3352180 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulochromis Posted April 18, 2013 Share Posted April 18, 2013 It seems strange to me that Lysander is only considered in terms of a beat stick. Sure S10 TH, 2+/3++ plus EW mean he can boldly go where saner men fear to tread, but he also has defensive buffs as well (Bolster Ruins, Stubborn, Bolter Drill). These seem quite compatible with a hang-back style gunline approach. He roams the backfield, dealing (decisively) with any opposing assault elements that make it that far. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3352703 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Idaho Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 But how does he roam the battlefield? Certainly not alongside a Riptide! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3352949 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted April 19, 2013 Share Posted April 19, 2013 But how does he roam the battlefield? Certainly not alongside a Riptide! Exactly! I'd keep the two units separated. Riptide, and eventually Tau commander, pick long range targets to be detroyed while Lysander can roam the battlefield with the hel of other units... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3353076 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted April 20, 2013 Share Posted April 20, 2013 Now what you should do is get a thunderfire cannon, Lysander, Calgar, Dante, and Corbulo, have them all join the TFC and there all T7 Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3353851 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Now what you should do is get a thunderfire cannon, Lysander, Calgar, Dante, and Corbulo, have them all join the TFC and there all T7 Is it a sort of joke? ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3354129 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 No, I also forgot they get FNP Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3354575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted April 22, 2013 Share Posted April 22, 2013 No, I also forgot they get FNP But you are putting strong melee characters in unit who should engage the unit on range... beside T7 woulnd't be the majority T value: you have 4 T4 models. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3354748 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Axagoras Posted April 22, 2013 Share Posted April 22, 2013 Dont have my rulebook on me but I believe artillery always uses the guns toughens. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3355128 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cmdr Shepard Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 Dont have my rulebook on me but I believe artillery always uses the guns toughens. But that's happen to the artillery itself. Rulebook is silent on what happen when ICs join it. However you are spending a lot points only to increase your IC T by 3 and it only work with shooting since in CC the ICs will use their T. Beside as long as they remain with the artillery they cannot assault so they have to leave it in the movement phase and use their T when they are subject to overwatch shots. The Thunderfire cannot fire if it moves so you actually spend those points for a +3 bonus to T. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/274283-lysander-and-the-riptide/#findComment-3355407 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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