morello Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 How do chaps just wondering how to deal with the new daemons dex. I've got a game in the next few days and I've yet to fight them, had anyone got some hints or tips they could share? It's around 1.5-2K points and I was thinking : HB/AC Baal HB/FC Baal Stormraven DC Dred/Blood talons ASM with SP(JP) Fragioso in pod Devs? 2xLC/ML-2xPC/ML Chaplain Just a rough idea I had, I think it should be ok? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Are you looking for tweaks and general tactics or a tailored approach? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demoulius Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 Is that your list or the things you got? Do you have a rough idea what your opponent is running? Also first a small disclaimer. A friend of mine played them throughout the last edition and ive played him twice with the current edition.... I might still have some of the old ruling in my head... Some general tips: *Every deamon has an invulable save higher then their armour (because the vat majority dont even have armour ) so it doesent matter if something has a good AP or not. Take into account that they will ALWAYS get a save. Deamon troops have a low Toughness. But are incredibly resiliant anyway because of the invul save. Your most likely going to be outnumbered and the deamon player will have a large number of expendable units that he can throw your way... This is because his troops are dirtcheap! Dont let this fool you though, some of the troops are pretty deadly. Bloodletters carry powerswords, the footslogging tzeentch one (forget name) have loads of S4 shots. Tzeentch also have screamers, which are so really nasty pieces of work. Can fly around like jetbikes, against vehicles they have meltabombs (if im not mistaken) and they have AP2 attacks.... When they fly over a unit using their jetbike move they can also attack it (although not at AP2) so be carefull. Nurglings and Plaguebearers have... I dont know actually they used to have T5 and FnP (plaguebearers) and I think that got taken down to just T4 for the plaguebearers. Nurglings have lots of wounds (swarms) but other then that I dont know. Plaguebearers at the very least have poisend weapons so with S4 that would give them reroll to wound (unsure if they have S4 though...) Ive never faced off against Slaaneshi deamons so cant really comment on this. Also never faced their cav, beast of nurgle or any of the greater deamons other then the Nurgle one (oh, and a keeper of secrets) and all I can say is... Theyre nasty, but dont focus ALL your fire on them. While they can do some major damage they cant take out a complete squad in a single turn (with the possible exception of the blood thirster... unsure how many attacks and what strength he has in this version ) so as contraditory as it might seem, keep your units close by so you can support eachother. Alot of units in their dex can also still deepstrike so keep that in mind. Overall though shooting is their major weakness as its the biggest thing that they lack. Keep them at bay at first and when theyre weakend off enough charge them and kill them off in a single turn. The last thing you want is your squad getting bogged down with a greater deamon nearby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 The flamestorm cannon is great in theory, but in practice it requires you to sacrifice a 145 point model for one flamestorm shot. Our vehicles are really vulnerable in combat now, and getting that close to enemies is a bad idea. The alternative way to use the FSC Baal is to sit back and shoot with HBs, until the enemy gets really close then counter flame. The issue here is that your main weapon youre not using for 1, 2 maybe even 3 turns. With the TLAC baal you could be pumping out those AC shots from turn 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morello Posted April 28, 2013 Author Share Posted April 28, 2013 Thanks for the reply chaps, I've got at least 2 of everything in the dex so I'm sure I could field just about any list. The one I set out above was just a little rough idea I had. I had no idea they all had invulnerable saves so that may hamper me to some extent. I was thinking of some sternguard in a pod for any of the big daemons and putting in corbulo with tycho? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demoulius Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 Well sternguards and snipers who wound on a fixed roll of a die are always good, but theyre best when targetting monstrous creatures or otherwise high toughness targets. Rending wont help so much as they will get their saves anyway! One unit I forget to mention was flamers. Havent met them yet with their new codex but they had AP2 flamers that wounded models on a fixed die roll of 4 (if im not mistaken) and basicly caused glancing/penetrating hits on fixed amounts as well... Either way... Ask before the game what unit does what, what tougness/strength value and such they have. Do this with every dex tbh but deamons are a special breed with their invul saves and varied army... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morticon Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 Flamers are now nerfed hard. Theyre no longer ignore armour, instead AP4 i think - and give you FNP !! Yes, thats right. If you take a wound, then pass a toughness test, your squad gets +1 to FNP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BassMattJaxx Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 BAAL pred's are pretty much a must against daemons. They shred the infantry, and can generally out manouvre them. Be wary of the Tzeetch chariot though, as it's packing d3 lascannons. Generally the things that have hurt me in my games recently are the flying monstrous creatures. Namely the bloodthirster =/ You probably won't see many flamers, if any, nowadays. They got hit for 6 with the nerf bat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morello Posted April 28, 2013 Author Share Posted April 28, 2013 Cheers for the tips chaps think I will at least stick with some Baal dakka preds, that's good to know about the +1 FNP!!! Might stick some DC into the mix. The only thing that I'm worried about is a greater deamon so I'm thinking Mephiston as a counter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knife&fork Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 Snipers and sternguards will do a better job on the greater daemons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morello Posted April 28, 2013 Author Share Posted April 28, 2013 Will keep that in mind when making up my list, cheers. How do they (Daemon) fair in the shooting side of things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theredknight Posted April 28, 2013 Share Posted April 28, 2013 If they take a lord of change..very well! Flamers are pesky.. Basically, anything from tzeentch is bad for shooty. Nurgle princes get a tough template I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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